Sylvanas Character Assassination

[Ardenaso]

alleria maybe but not vereesa she isnt that great looking.

I've seen Three Sisters and Vereesa looks like a fat 30 year old woman

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too lazy to find which one who to quote but... I prefer to think that Sylvanas didn't betray the loyalist in Nazjatar but rather has faith and knows very well that her loyalist can survive the trip down to the seafloor anyway

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I think that Blizzard retconned the retcon, because at first, the blight killed everyone save - perhaps - Forsaken.

Yep literally in WC3 shows that disease cloud (which is pretty much "the" blight) can only harm non-undead

[huth]

too lazy to find which one who to quote but... I prefer to think that Sylvanas didn't betray the loyalist in Nazjatar but rather has faith and knows very well that her loyalist can survive the trip down to the seafloor anyway

You mean the Sylvanas that tells the loyalist characters to their face that she didn't care whether they did?

[Raisei]

too lazy to find which one who to quote but... I prefer to think that Sylvanas didn't betray the loyalist in Nazjatar but rather has faith and knows very well that her loyalist can survive the trip down to the seafloor anyway

You are free to believe that of course. The reality however is that in the N'zoth fight you get to hear her explicitely DEMAND of Azshara to kill all the "Heroes" in Nazjatar. Azshara even mocks her for throwing away the lives of her people like that.

[Varodoc]

That moment when Azshara cares more about her people than Sylvanas. Sad.

[Mehrunes]

What kinda ffing blight kills ONLY scourge undead, and humans.
but not forsaken undead and orcs/tauren/etc.

What if I told you that there's a difference between a purpose of something (it's almost as if the word I used was "stated goal") and its capabilities and properties? If instead of the Blight Sylvanas ordered the RAS to create a boatload of guns to kill humans and undead does that in your mind mean those guns would be ineffective to kill Elves? They're goddamn guns and a bullet in the head is a bullet in the head. That doesn't change the fact that Sylvanas wanted to use those "guns" only to kill specific targets.

[Ardenaso]

That moment when Azshara cares more about her people than Sylvanas. Sad.

not really wanting an Illidan 2.0 nor Grommash 2.0 but I do kinda wish we were seen a bit more of Azshara's redemption like helping us against the remnants of the Old God's forces and Sylvanas' loyalists; I think she had her harsh lesson after the Sundering

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You are free to believe that of course. The reality however is that in the N'zoth fight you get to hear her explicitely DEMAND of Azshara to kill all the "Heroes" in Nazjatar. Azshara even mocks her for throwing away the lives of her people like that.

I see, fair enough. I thought it was those of Alliance and non-loyaists.

[kansor]

Define "morning cartoon villains", because smiling when someone is melting in front of you or saying stuff like "Let the gilneans enjoy their small victory, not even their bones will remain by tomorrow" is very morning cartoon villain.

Ruthless in pursuit of her goals and in defense of her people is different from being an almost metaphysical bad guy who wants to "kill hope" and does goofy villain monologues befitting a one-dimensional evulz character. Beside the clumsy dialogue and 8d chess, BFA mistook what kind of evil she is. It didn't turn her evil, but it did assassinate her as a character.

[Varodoc]

Ruthless in pursuit of her goals and in defense of her people is different from being an almost metaphysical bad guy who wants to "kill hope" and does goofy villain monologues befitting a one-dimensional evulz character. Beside the clumsy dialogue and 8d chess, BFA mistook what kind of evil she is. It didn't turn her evil, but it did assassinate her as a character.

Not really. Since Cataclysm at least she showed she had no problem exterminating an entire city if she had to, like she did in Gilneas. The Burning of Teldrassil was not surprising.

[kansor]

Not really. Since Cataclysm at least she showed she had no problem exterminating an entire city if she had to, like she did in Gilneas. The Burning of Teldrassil was not surprising.

No, it wasn't, which is why it should have been done for simple tactical reasons rather than in a fit of pique when someone insulted you in order to "kill their hope". That was a prime moment of character assassination.

[Grazrug]

Can't wait for Sylvanas' inevitable redemption in Shadowlands. The haters will spit fire and acid when it happens. A source of joy for me.

[FelPlague]

Yep literally in WC3 shows that disease cloud (which is pretty much "the" blight) can only harm non-undead

I think that Blizzard retconned the retcon, because at first, the blight killed everyone save - perhaps - Forsaken.

Thats because she made it stronger, to ALSO hurt undead. as she wanted to use it on everyone, primarily the lich kings forces.
and no btw, she made a deal with azshara to literally send you, loyalist or not to go die in nazjatar, so she would have the necklace.

[Orisai]

Given how the council is full of kumbaya singers that have no spines and don't disagree with each other on anything because it's sinful, the moment one of them pitches the idea of melting down Dwarven children for a vaporub the rest of them will roll with it. Besides, as shown in Vulpera questline Baine alone is running things while the rest do fuck all.




Meanwhile joining an omnicidal Fel cult that is on a rampage across all realities that killed more people than all Sylvanases from all realities combined lands you in Revendreth. And the stated goal of the Blight was never to kill everything, only the Scourge (for being Scourge) and the humans (for spawning Arthas).

The Blight kills everything living, not only the Scorge and humans. At the wrathgate it killed the Horde forces too.

[Ardenaso]

Thats because she made it stronger, to ALSO hurt undead. as she wanted to use it on everyone, primarily the lich kings forces.

I was referring to the point where it wasn't exclusive for humans

[danielewhite]

It is more the mindset of killing anyone, who stands in your way. That is a clear red flag Sylvanas was fine that way, because she was merely a regional power and as such could remain such a character, but one thing that would have always sealed her fate would have been too much power.

excellent comment I'd say so too, and I think you are pretty right...
sylvanas as a fictional non-existent character has gone through different hands...(writers)
and as of frozen throne, she doesn't show any desire for power...what she wants is revenge.
she was pretty much forced to take Lordaeron as the nathrezim threatened to destroy her and her remaining banshees.
nothing evil about that.

right now shes totally evil...
and what used to be my favourite character has become a crazy ^&*(* that I hate.

so instead of trying to kill off sylvanas...because the writers suck...
we should stand as a community and try to raise the companies standards.
doubtfully sylvanas is the only character lacking...everything in the story is lacking
and that is the problem

few examples...mentioning other characters I used to like.

tyrande, she used to be a strong independent woman, who only elune could forbid of anything ...
in legion she is presented as a weak character crying for a man...later in battle for Azeroth we also learn that female characters can only ve strong if they go through some transformation....someone in blizzard must like magical girls...(right alleria?) or maybe Dragon ball Z
Maiev...she was another strong female lead, her motivation was to capture Illidan and serve her justice.
then we get a novel telling us she went mad and started to kill off elves.
then they realized they needed her back for legion so they scrapped the madness and turns out she was possessed by devils. (said by Jarod shadowsong during legion)
then she allied with Illidan XD (this goes sooooo against her character that it's funny)and gets even more fun cause during the last raid she wasn't even around so people could say...well at least shes guarding him.
then she got to apologize to Tyrande! the one that killed her wardens whom she considered family... and in a way that also looked like it was maiev's fault.

do u remember that cinematic that was a rip-off almost frame by frame of the lord of the ring finale?

every single piece of writing in this game sucks, they don't have standards and we are letting them.
because we just eat content without setting a bar for ourselves.

[Aleax]

Is anyone else really pissed about this??

Sylvanas was a "good-aligned" elf before being a banshee, so I am not sure she should have been made evil by all means now. So I am with you.
Unfortunately that's the choice of the devs, she is now a banshee and is by all means now "evil", she looks like she doesn't have the slight memory of their previous body/state/mind. ...RIP Sylvanas

[Varodoc]

Sylvanas was a "good-aligned" elf before being a banshee, so I am not sure she should have been made evil by all means now. So I am with you.
Unfortunately that's the choice of the devs, she is now a banshee and is by all means now "evil", she looks like she doesn't have the slight memory of their previous body/state/mind. ...RIP Sylvanas

On the contrary she has perfect memory of what happened to her, she simply rejects all that she was because she saw herself as a fool who clung to hope and life and got killed because of that naiveness. Like she told Delaryn.

[Raisei]

excellent comment I'd say so too, and I think you are pretty right...
sylvanas as a fictional non-existent character has gone through different hands...(writers)
and as of frozen throne, she doesn't show any desire for power...what she wants is revenge.
she was pretty much forced to take Lordaeron as the nathrezim threatened to destroy her and her remaining banshees.
nothing evil about that.

If she had kept fighting against demons that was true. However, in her desire for revenge she killed everything and everyone she felt like, because she did not care about anything but her revenge.
She literally tested her blight (a tool for said revenge) on some captured humans and her own Forsaken. That was after she had beaten the Dreadlords into submission, so this was not a desperate move for self-preservation as you make it sound.
She did it because her revenge was everything she cared about, her own selfish desires made her murder completely unrelated people in a gruesome fashion and she enjoyed watching their deaththrows. That is simply evil, no two sides about it. Sylvanas was a villain from the moment she was freed from Arthas will.

right now shes totally evil...
and what used to be my favourite character has become a crazy ^&*(* that I hate.

I just don't understand how you can look at her history and imagine that she was ever anything but totally evil. All her actions were driven by selfish desires. First revenge, then clinging to life and she has been completely fine to ruthlessly murder anyone to achieve either of these goals. She is not sacrificing people for the greater good as an anti-hero, she is killing people because she feels that her continued existance outweighs anything else, making her a villain and nothing but a villain.

so instead of trying to kill off sylvanas...because the writers suck...
we should stand as a community and try to raise the companies standards.
doubtfully sylvanas is the only character lacking...everything in the story is lacking
and that is the problem

It is really not the writer fault that you made an inaccurate picture of the character in your head and now demand this picture to be made real. Every quest, every book, every short story written told you what kind of a person she is and that she should have been killed years ago.

It would be completely fine to like Sylvanas for the villain she is, but declaring that the writers suck because YOU have ignored the lore of the last 15 years and made up your own headcannon where she is not a villain is simply unfair.

few examples...mentioning other characters I used to like.

tyrande, she used to be a strong independent woman, who only elune could forbid of anything ...
in legion she is presented as a weak character crying for a man...later in battle for Azeroth we also learn that female characters can only ve strong if they go through some transformation....someone in blizzard must like magical girls...(right alleria?) or maybe Dragon ball Z

... Jaina nearly vaporized Orgrimmar and commandeered a flying ship alone that broke the Siege of Lordaeron single-handedly, that strong and female enough for you? Or does the change in her outfit already qualify as "transformation"?

Maiev...she was another strong female lead, her motivation was to capture Illidan and serve her justice.
[B]then we get a novel telling us she went mad and started to kill off elves.

She literally left Tyrande to die and lied to Malfurion to rile him up against Illidan, maniplulating one of her races leaders and leaving the other to die just so she could get Illidan... she was quite mad there already.

every single piece of writing in this game sucks, they don't have standards and we are letting them.
because we just eat content without setting a bar for ourselves.

Maybe it is more that you have very strange views of characters that in no way ever was mirrored in the lore and you get mad because the people actually knowing how THEIR characters work do not agree with your headcannon? Food for thought.

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Sylvanas was a "good-aligned" elf before being a banshee, so I am not sure she should have been made evil by all means now. So I am with you.
Unfortunately that's the choice of the devs, she is now a banshee and is by all means now "evil", she looks like she doesn't have the slight memory of their previous body/state/mind. ...RIP Sylvanas

The Sylvanas Warbringer and the "Three Sisters" comic shows her clearly remembering her past as Ranger General and from Edge of Night we can take that she was at least very ruthless even then, spending her fellow elves like arrows in her quiver. Granted she was a military leader and confronted with an advancing enemy, so I guess she had to make sacrifices.

[Ardenaso]

Sylvanas was a "good-aligned" elf before being a banshee

friendly reminder again Sylvanas sent her Farstriders to a suicide rush against Arthas because getting the fame and glory and being the hero who defeated the Death Knight is better than simply outright assassinating him with a 360 no scope snipe; she was even judged by the Val'kyr for it - arrows in her quiver

[Wangming]

So Voldermort isn't a villain cause his actions are motivated by his refusal to die. he wanted to survive so he created Horcruxes. Sure he is evil now, but it's not his fault his soul got cut into seven places.

[Varodoc]

Voldemort wasn't evil. Baby Harry started the war when he deflected the avada kedavra and hit Voldemort.