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  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by Highelf View Post
    completely disagree. but you do you

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    The story and lore in TBC are very weak and kind of come out of no where in times.
    Whereas the story in vanilla doesn't come out of nowhere at all.. let's be honest, the story in wow until Cata was very pocketed. It created a nice picture if you look at it together but the narrative has always been a weak point.

    That said, I don't think lore is weak in tbc.. AT ALL. Just pay attention to it, the details in Karazhan, TK or Black Temple are amazing as far as individual stories go.

  2. #182
    Epic! Highelf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cracked View Post
    Whereas the story in vanilla doesn't come out of nowhere at all.. let's be honest, the story in wow until Cata was very pocketed. It created a nice picture if you look at it together but the narrative has always been a weak point.

    That said, I don't think lore is weak in tbc.. AT ALL. Just pay attention to it, the details in Karazhan, TK or Black Temple are amazing as far as individual stories go.
    Honestly what does that even mean? It's either good or it's not. This isn't some classic American novel here.
    “I've noticed that everybody that is for abortion has already been born.”
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  3. #183
    Quote Originally Posted by Highelf View Post
    Honestly what does that even mean? It's either good or it's not. This isn't some classic American novel here.
    Sure you can think it’s good or not if you want to no one is stopping you. The points you’re bringing up on the other hand just don’t make sense.

    If your stance is just ‘I don’t like the story’ then that’s fine. When your statements are ‘they are weak and they are come out of nowhere’, then you’re speaking silly talk.

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synical123 View Post
    Sure you can think it’s good or not if you want to no one is stopping you. The points you’re bringing up on the other hand just don’t make sense.

    If your stance is just ‘I don’t like the story’ then that’s fine. When your statements are ‘they are weak and they are come out of nowhere’, then you’re speaking silly talk.
    IT's not a good overall story and especially lore. period.
    “I've noticed that everybody that is for abortion has already been born.”
    ― Ronald Regan

  5. #185
    Quote Originally Posted by Highelf View Post
    IT's not a good overall story and especially lore. period.
    That’s a wonderful opinion! All I’m asking for is what the reasoning specifically is?

    Here, I’ll give you an example.

    I hated cata. I believe the addition to lfr and transmog lessened the ‘prestige’ of gear sets and making raid clears feel like meaningful. Also the pvp in cata, blizzard changed how health/damaged worked in order to make arena matches ‘longer’ and this made fights last forever and made it so arena matches felt more stale.

    You see how I say that I don’t like something and then point out the specific changes and then my opinions on them?

    Ok now you try

  6. #186
    Quote Originally Posted by Synical123 View Post
    Yeah everything you just said points exactly why he would turn into a villain LOL. Also, whats the fascination with people only wanting villains to be this all bad never good characters? That's boring, that's why people loved Arthas so much, he was a good guy, he did what he thought was good for his people and went mad over trying to defeat malganis. He isn't really 'all' evil.

    Same thing with Illidan. From the start he was an enemy/good guy. We had common enemies, but the nightelves deemed him to be dangerous and a 'beast'. He went into outland to fight the burning legion and overthrow them (this is the story during tbc). We thought he was trying to gain an army and enslave the locals there so he had to be dealt with. What you're saying just doesn't make much sense for why you don't understand how this could happen. We screwed him over in wc3 time and time again, he helped us and we still treated him like a tool and warned him to basically just stay the fuck away. If you're upset with the story, it started in WC3 and that's what you should be upset about. TBC just continued on the path that these characters progressions were leading towards.

    As for Kael, yeah it's the perfect story (just like literally every. single. villain. in. warcraft.), he was once on our side, got fucked over or driven mad, and allied with Illidan which at the time we thought was 'bad', and went to outland (with the burning legions command) to take over that world to defeat arthas. Which at the time, the humans/elves/the players character didn't know this was what he was going to do.

    I'm just convinced you guys didn't pay much attention to the story in WC3 because it makes perfect sense.

    Honestly, I would just watch videos like this if you are bored, it makes way more sense

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEi0z3Bdd8M
    I have watched every single video this guys has out and have read Chronicles and have read Ilidan novel. I just think that Arthas was built as a villain so much better than Kaelthas becoming one behind the scenes straight after w3. Who is the bad guy does not matter. I am not saying the idea or the bosses in TBC are bad, but the flow in all the expansions after that was way better. Tho I miss the TBC/WotLK/Cata buildups to the last boss (TBC had Sunwell, but whole xpac was about getting Ili dead). MoP was not clear who will end up as the big bad, WoD... Well... I have my grudges on not fighting all the warlords and getting Archi again as the last one. Legion was not clear for sure. BfA I was hoping that they will build up our beloved tentacly mistress as a final boss of the Xpac, but.... we got her and big masterplotter Nzoth in Nyalotha in the same Xpac. Which I guess you could speculate it would happen but it still feels like a waste of such a huge potential to not have Nyalotha as a separate big ass zone. Raid is nice.. but I was hoping for something more since the puzzle. Maybe they want a clean slate for they future lore or something.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Azerox View Post
    All this classic nonsense is just rubbish.
    Taking away precious development time that could be used on retail.
    And yes, it is another team, still they could have worked on retail.
    Thanks, you!
    Think you'll find that many people find retail to be rubbish, and that those devs could be better spent on classic development.
    Without Classic, WoW as a whole would be close to dead now.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Xykotic View Post
    Think you'll find that many people find retail to be rubbish, and that those devs could be better spent on classic development.
    Without Classic, WoW as a whole would be close to dead now.
    Exactly this. Whether people want to admit it or not, retails numbers are in shambles compared to what it was. Remember when people were freaking the fuck out because wow dropped to like 5 mil subs and when they stopped posting numbers?

    They should be praising 5 mil at this point. Just realize classic day one brought in triple the amount of retail subs with almost no advertising lol. How many do you think played classic day one? 2 mil? 5 mil? Whatever number you come up with divide it by 3 and that’s retails subs.

  9. #189

    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by Highelf View Post
    completely disagree. but you do you
    Gameplay-wise TBC blew vanilla completely out of the water. It just did everything better. You could actually play a tanking paladin in the endgame, balance druids were viable.. A lot of the neglected classes that the team never got to finish in Vanilla was rectified and fixed.

    It baffles me that people want the inferior class setup of Vanilla and not TBC.

  10. #190
    Quote Originally Posted by Lawzen View Post
    Gameplay-wise TBC blew vanilla completely out of the water. It just did everything better. You could actually play a tanking paladin in the endgame, balance druids were viable.. A lot of the neglected classes that the team never got to finish in Vanilla was rectified and fixed.

    It baffles me that people want the inferior class setup of Vanilla and not TBC.
    Completely agree. I understand everyone has different likes and dislikes. But tbc objectively fixed loads of things vanilla just didn’t have figured out yet. Class design is a major one like you mentioned, the pvp is a system I also think about, also little things like guild banks and raid design.

  11. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lawzen View Post
    Gameplay-wise TBC blew vanilla completely out of the water. It just did everything better. You could actually play a tanking paladin in the endgame, balance druids were viable.. A lot of the neglected classes that the team never got to finish in Vanilla was rectified and fixed.

    It baffles me that people want the inferior class setup of Vanilla and not TBC.
    No I totally get it and do like what TBC did to classes. But I also really enjoy class design in Vanilla too. Sometimes balance, and trying to keep things balanced every 5 minutes is not a good thing imo.
    “I've noticed that everybody that is for abortion has already been born.”
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  12. #192
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    I hope they give people THREE options.
    1. Continue with your original classic character with out TBC.
    2. Free transfer to the TBC server with your classic character.
    3. Start from level 1 on a new non transferable TBC server.

    P.S. my friend told me something interesting. Instead of making a TBC server, create content for classic on the patch we are on.
    Last edited by Xandu; 2020-04-13 at 03:25 PM.

  13. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xandu View Post
    I hope they give people THREE options.
    1. Continue with your original classic character with out TBC.
    2. Free transfer to the TBC server with your classic character.
    3. Start from level 1 on a new non transferable TBC server.

    P.S. my friend told me something interesting. Instead of making a TBC server, create content for classic on the patch we are on.
    They aren't making Vanilla content. That would require a larger and different team of devs. Almost everybody who worked on Vanilla content is gone and the current devs would just bumble the fuck out of it. You're either going to keep playing Vanilla or end up play BC.
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