DH Havoc Shadowlands Class Update - Thats it????

[gcsmith]

Glaive Tempest is pretty cool! Looks way too good atm numbers wise, but it's a nice and cool addition to the Havoc rotation I must say.

with the CD it only competes with the Blade dance DOT talent on multi targets, otherwise that talent is better on single target. At least on PTR.

[Doffen]

with the CD it only competes with the Blade dance DOT talent on multi targets, otherwise that talent is better on single target. At least on PTR.

Yeah, you are quite right. I did not try Trail yesterday and I am used to it being 7-10% of my damage on aoe, though of course that's with live numbers with TD corruption, Essence Beam etc. Now, we could maybe argue that both Glaive Tempest and Trail of Ruin is too good for a one talent, but that's another discussion. Glaive Tempest did a bit more for me on ST. We still got higher haste numbers with Furious Gaze still being active as it is, and the new passive will give us 10%. Should be factored in I guess.

3 Target cleave:
Glaive Tempest 21% of my damage.
Trail of Ruin 15.7%

ST:
Glaive Tempest 11.2%
Trail of Ruin 7.9%

Still, Glaive Tempest was a nice addition. Have not tried Unbound Chaos yet.

[killimage]

You should note that Glaive Tempest cost 30 fury and 1 GCD, so it reduces other damage you do. Even if the two talents does same damage overall, it makes up more percentage.
To compare those two, you should list your overall damage numbers as well.

[Vpuh]

Guess what class didnt get any news from devs today build?

[Doffen]

You should note that Glaive Tempest cost 30 fury and 1 GCD, so it reduces other damage you do. Even if the two talents does same damage overall, it makes up more percentage.
To compare those two, you should list your overall damage numbers as well.

That would go for most any other ability though. And it goes without saying.

And Glaive Tempest just got nerfed hard, less than half of the damage it did before in this new build. It did too much damage as reported, nothing to do with it using a GCD. And the numbers I got were three targets. It can hit up to 5. So the damage difference would be bigger than the numbers I got.

Unbound Chaos buffed a lot. Furious Gaze buffed from 10 to 15%.

[Faenlyn]

That would go for most any other ability though. And it goes without saying.

And Glaive Tempest just got nerfed hard, less than half of the damage it did before in this new build. It did too much damage as reported, nothing to do with it using a GCD. And the numbers I got were three targets. It can hit up to 5. So the damage difference would be bigger than the numbers I got.

Unbound Chaos buffed a lot. Furious Gaze buffed from 10 to 15%.

I can 2nd this. Glaive tempest for a while was doing incredible damage. it annihilated aoe packs by itself. It surpassed Trail and Unbound Chaos. Which I felt it should as Blizz has said they would like active abilities to do more damage than passive abilities when played right. But it does seem to have been nerfed which seems like Unbound Chaos is back on top. Which is unfortunate. Because even though UC hits like a truck, it pushes to the momentum playstyle as a Unbound Chaos hits at the end of the Fel Rush and benefits from the Momentum buff which really makes it shine.
This is problematic because Fel Rush does not play well with Demonic if you prefer that or if it sims better. You can time your Glaive Tempest with adds on demand when they show up. But if you go UC and you want to burn aoe packs / adds you have to juggle Immolation Aura, Eye Beam / Meta or Fel Rush / Unbound Chaos and you cant do all of those without sacrifices.
If you start with Immolation Aura, EB you will have to delay your UC so you dont lose significant Meta uptime which is now only 6 seconds to position out and then fel rush back in for the UC. Other players are DPSing and here you are like a derp leaving combat to reposition to fel rush back in. Hopefully you have VR up.

If you decide to position then Immolation, Fel Rush UC into an Eye Beam then its more doable but you're losing GCDs to get into your aoe that way also. Its just awkward to balance two aoe abilities when one keeps you in melee and the other has you jumping around.

It plays much better with momentum since FR is part the natural part of your DPS rotation. But momentum has never played well with dungeon mechanics and that is even worse in Shadowlands. Shadowland dungeons in general are very melee unfriendly with 1 shot ground effects, tornadoes, volcanoes, cliff that you can FR off of and die.. bosses you can fell FR overshoot into poison.. Its just bad.

[Doffen]

I can 2nd this. Glaive tempest for a while was doing incredible damage. it annihilated aoe packs by itself. It surpassed Trail and Unbound Chaos. Which I felt it should as Blizz has said they would like active abilities to do more damage than passive abilities when played right. But it does seem to have been nerfed which seems like Unbound Chaos is back on top. Which is unfortunate. Because even though UC hits like a truck, it pushes to the momentum playstyle as a Unbound Chaos hits at the end of the Fel Rush and benefits from the Momentum buff which really makes it shine.
This is problematic because Fel Rush does not play well with Demonic if you prefer that or if it sims better. You can time your Glaive Tempest with adds on demand when they show up. But if you go UC and you want to burn aoe packs / adds you have to juggle Immolation Aura, Eye Beam / Meta or Fel Rush / Unbound Chaos and you cant do all of those without sacrifices.
If you start with Immolation Aura, EB you will have to delay your UC so you dont lose significant Meta uptime which is now only 6 seconds to position out and then fel rush back in for the UC. Other players are DPSing and here you are like a derp leaving combat to reposition to fel rush back in. Hopefully you have VR up.

If you decide to position then Immolation, Fel Rush UC into an Eye Beam then its more doable but you're losing GCDs to get into your aoe that way also. Its just awkward to balance two aoe abilities when one keeps you in melee and the other has you jumping around.

It plays much better with momentum since FR is part the natural part of your DPS rotation. But momentum has never played well with dungeon mechanics and that is even worse in Shadowlands. Shadowland dungeons in general are very melee unfriendly with 1 shot ground effects, tornadoes, volcanoes, cliff that you can FR off of and die.. bosses you can fell FR overshoot into poison.. Its just bad.

Yeah, I felt Glaive Tempest did a tad too much at first, but the nerf was kinda overdone, as per usual. Might be scaling good. I don't like UC to be the best one as for the play style it brings. Glaive Tempest fits the demonic build well and it felt as a good short cd to use. Trail of Ruin for ST and GT for AoE would be fine for me. It's good that one thing is better for one thing and the other being good for something else. Right now UC is best for all ain't it, and that's not a situation I like at least.

I guess the tuning is still not final. I really like GT though, so I want it to be good. If it's a bit lower than UC I can live with that.

[Lucrece]

Yeah, I felt Glaive Tempest did a tad too much at first, but the nerf was kinda overdone, as per usual. Might be scaling good. I don't like UC to be the best one as for the play style it brings. Glaive Tempest fits the demonic build well and it felt as a good short cd to use. Trail of Ruin for ST and GT for AoE would be fine for me. It's good that one thing is better for one thing and the other being good for something else. Right now UC is best for all ain't it, and that's not a situation I like at least.

I guess the tuning is still not final. I really like GT though, so I want it to be good. If it's a bit lower than UC I can live with that.

I don't want UC simply because it still has the same annoying ass bug from Legion where the inner demon for a MALE DH is a FEMALE metamorphosis, it's so jarring and stupid and typical Blizzard that they'd revive a 4 year old bug.

[DesoPL]

Worth give a try in PvE DH Havoc guys? Because i consider play it in Shadowlands.

[Thelxi]

I was thinking about going DH for SL, but I have to say after diving deep into the covenant abilities/soulbinds/conduits I'm not so sure anymore. Havoc is fun now, but SL looks like it will be a smack to the head for DHs not aware of what is in store. Say goodbye to high demon form uptimes and say goodbye to your leech/self healing too just to name a couple of things.

It got worse when I looked at other specs' conduits like feral's. Not to be too pessimistic but I can see DHs soon experiencing what affliction experienced going from Legion to BfA.

[ssviolett]

To me it looks like DHs were introduced by Blizz only to attract people in Legion. Who didnt ever dream to play as "Illidan"? And after DHs served their role, after several Legion patches Blizz almost completely forgot about them - just check patch notes from 2nd half of Legion till now - DHs usually get zero or maybe several changes, even those are mostly minor.

[Zellas]

To me it looks like DHs were introduced by Blizz only to attract people in Legion.

Can't help but wonder what could possibly give you that idea?

So, my fellow glaive-swingers, how does it feel to be ignored by the devs? On a scale from 0 to Feral, how much of a disgrace it is?

[ssviolett]

Can't help but wonder what could possibly give you that idea?

The very next sentence in the message you quoyed will enlighten you

[Skayth]

To me it looks like DHs were introduced by Blizz only to attract people in Legion.

well contrary to the 5 post dude, they were originally set to appear in both classic and bc, but got the chopping block. Bc because they gave shaman to alliance and pally to horde, and they needed to tune the classes, so why bother adding another.

I figured we would get dh's in a legion themed expansion, and low behold i was right. (the big hints were the MoP's changes to demo, and then the killing of demo in WoD Before legion was ever announced). Ah well. There was a meme going around once legion was announced cause of WoD. "In case of emergency, break glass." And it was guldan breaking illidans glass prison cg.

[Lilsamee]

So basically, 13 days from launch and still not new talents or buffs. think we're gona be a 1 button class in shadowlands spamming only chaos strike/annihilation. this does not look good guys

[Icoblablubb]

i was shocked how aweful havoc playes right now ... did quit BfA like 3 months in and now came back to prepare a bit for SL but omg what has blizz done to them .. even with covenants/legendarys/conduits nothing rly changes gameplay wise Blade Dance is pretty much useless Demonic duration nerf leech nerf blur nerf.. sure Havoc was quite good since they were introduces but not that OP that warrants this shit even if they buff numbers by lets say 10% the class will still feel like shit

[Big Thanks]

Playing Demon Hunter PvP without gear was dreadful.

But today i farmed ALL PvP pieces in all slots + trinket set bonus...
Lets just say...15% versatility and with some haste it now plays PRETTY good.
Much better at least

Im playing with the talent "Essence Break" because otherwise...the class feels pretty boring.

[Schmilblick]

the class feels pretty boring.

Sadly like most classes :/

[Big Thanks]

Sadly like most classes :/

I found a "combo" im kinda enjoying :3

Immolation Aura (talented with Burning Hatred)
Eye Beam (talented with Blind Fury)
Essence Break
Blade Dance
Chaos Strike for as long as you can
Metamorphosis
Eye Beam
Blade Dance
Chaos strike for as long as you can

Feels good in PvP :3....is decent with 15% Versatility and Demonic Talent

[ipkonfig]

I found a "combo" im kinda enjoying :3

Immolation Aura (talented with Burning Hatred)
Eye Beam (talented with Blind Fury)
Essence Break
Blade Dance
Chaos Strike for as long as you can
Metamorphosis
Eye Beam
Blade Dance
Chaos strike for as long as you can

Feels good in PvP :3....is decent with 15% Versatility and Demonic Talent

that works well, if you're not in a stun

What pisses me off is players DIE FASTER in last 2 expansions and more CC added to game over the years yet Trinkets are still: 2Min CDs! W.T.F Blizztard?!