Mega-Thread: 2020 United States General Election

[Cosmic Janitor]

Can he campaign from prison/Russia?

I think the question is more if he has enough money/favors to call in to fund himself a 4 year delay of the courts until the next election.

[alexw]

Let's not delude ourselves or grow complacent. if he was going to jail now, then he would've gone earlier.

No thats no true. After the DoJ stated that the belief that its illegal for them to go after a sitting president no one believed that law enforcement would go after him until AFTER he was out of the presidential office.

Well that's about to happen.

[Milchshake]

Can he campaign from prison/Russia?

Leonard Peltier is a fixture on some ballots ... so why not.

[Flower Milk]

But their opposition appears to come not from the fact that the DNC backed centrist candidates, but that she was too progressive? And that they want a younger, but still centrist Speaker? There's nothing in the article that I read that indicated that those centrist survivors suddenly want a hard-left turn?

Hence them talking about the fear of "socialism".

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't be sad to see a younger Speaker who was more progressive. But I think you're misreading the article.

Yes that's why I'm saying the centrists are wrong, Nancy Pelosi is not too progressive at all and centrists wanting a less progressive Speaker than freaking Nancy Pelosi while ignoring all of the progressive policies that were passed and how DSA backed candidates overwhelmingly won is fucking stupid. They really think "socialism" is to blame for centrist Democrat candidates losing while ignoring all of the other results in regards to progressive policy and candidates.

[Zantos]

Seems Bob Casey Jr. is saying Joe will win Pennsylvania. If that turns out to be the case, Biden will have a bigger win then first though. Really hope that is true.

[Zaydin]

Seems Bob Casey Jr. is saying Joe will win Pennsylvania. If that turns out to be the case, Biden will have a bigger win then first though. Really hope that is true.

If he does, it looks like the warnings about a "red mirage" were right.

[cubby]

Let's not delude ourselves or grow complacent. if he was going to jail now, then he would've gone earlier.

Apparently you haven't been paying attention. He can't even be indicted as a sitting Resident.

[Flower Milk]

Yup.

If Biden wins and the Senate is still GOP controlled, they will be the biggest cock blockers in history. They will deny any bills get voted on that the House passes and Biden can only encourage votes and/or judge appointments, while they sit back and do nothing. Then blame doing nothing on the Democrats for the next four years. They are evil.

I wouldn't even be surprised if Mitch just dismisses the Senate indefinitely until the inauguration.

Not only that, but there's a giant economic bomb about to drop in Biden's first or second term, and the GOP controlled Senate is unlikely to even confirm any of Biden's cabinet picks so he can prepare for it. It's a disaster waiting to happen and I don't think people who are looking at Biden possibly winning the presidency but Democrats losing the Senate are even thinking about how disastrous this is going to be outside of just legislation not being passed.

[Acidbaron]

Hopefully the GOP at one point stops following the madness of trump. Otherwise you are going to have a good segment of the population that feels cheated what is a good basis for domestic terrorism. See it as people who refused the civil war was lost, unironically it's going to be the same sort of people here in this case.

So it's that old wound that never really healed going to be opened up again, perhaps also a chance to really deal with that unsolved matter.

[TheramoreIsTheBomb]

Apparently you haven't been paying attention. He can't even be indicted as a sitting Resident.

He was doing this stuff long before he was elected while he was running and during president-elect

[Belize]

If he does, it looks like the warnings about a "red mirage" were right.

I mean, we knew they were right in MI and WI.

[Mihalik]

The US has a very poor track record of people who left office re-enter office. The odds are low.

Also, the GOP has three years to decide "did this really work for us?" while Biden has four years to find Trump's criminal actions.

It's a valid risk. But there are safeguards.

Norms do not apply to Trump, I thought that should have been glaring obvious by now.

[Kallisto]

A few hundred thousand Cubans in Florida =/= the rest of the country.

Stop drawing the wrong conclusions.

Look at what people are voting for or not voting for in all other places that isn't just Florida, and even in Florida the minimum wage hike pushed by progressives won.

Middle america also consider socialist = communist = must be destroyed at all costs even if they agree with the actual policies. Biden came out with leftist policies. Higher minimum wage, public option.

[cubby]

I think the question is more if he has enough money/favors to call in to fund himself a 4 year delay of the courts until the next election.

That is a VERY interesting idea. The question would be whether enough people still in power could help him.

[kaelleria]

Norms do not apply to Trump, I thought that should have been glaring obvious by now.

Not if he's in jail.

[Adam Jensen]

Trump is a narcissist. The guy literally wants to send in troops and shout conspiracies simply because he's losing and can't accept it. He will run again, mark my words. And if not him? His crazy ass son, Don. Jr.

God I can see it now.

2024: Ocasio-Cortez (who would be 35 in December of 24) vs Trump Jr.

Hopefully I can watch from abroad . . . in maybe Antarctica.

[Themius]

And all that would be made worse if Trump wins.

Like I said. Perspective.

My perspective is yes it would be worse but what is the path forward If the country is this radicalised

[cubby]

He was doing this stuff long before he was elected while he was running and during president-elect

And he was under investigation for some of that at the time. Winning the election staved off all of those investigations. Losing this one will restart those as well as all the other issues that have arisen outside his duties as Resident.

[Endus]

And we're already starting with the enlightened Democrat centrist bullshit.

Win or lose, centrism failed horribly. This shouldn't have been a fucking a toss up (it still is) this was supposed to be a centrist slam dunk.

Even if Biden wins, which I really hope he will, this was waaaaay too close for comfort.

I feel the hostile approach on that front isn't particularly helpful. It's more helpful, IMO, to point out the logical consequences of this outcome (and 2016, in retrospect).

Both elections, the Democrats put forward a strong centrist, with fairly broad appeal (yes, Hillary Clinton had broad appeal, I don't care if some individual hated her irrationally; I'm hardly a Hillary fanboy myself). This was up against Trump, a far-right fascist pushing fascist talking points and disinformation. This, it was argued both times, should result in a slam-dunk victory for the Democrats. It was a loss in 2016, and it's looking like a skin-of-the-teeth victory here in 2020.

So, we can reliably expect future appeals to centrism to be as risky. Especially if the opponent isn't as brazenly misanthropic and gross as Trump. 2016 and 2020 are the ideal circumstances for this ideological bent; this is the best possible outcome you can get, that way.

So, reasonably, we can presume that trying a progressive candidate in 2024 and beyond could resolve in any one of three ways, generally speaking. Less support for the Democrats. More support for the Democrats. Or no real change.

For the latter two, running the progressive is either not any greater a risk, or it's a net positive. There's real potential for gains, here.

And if it's the former, then you're already at the best you can ever hope to get with a non-fascist message. You can't ever do any better. Is the nation even recoverable in support of a Democratic message, at that point? Or are you locked into a fascist tailspin from which you can only try and mitigate the damage from the eventual crash? The voters will have made their views clear, and what the American people want, in that case, is more white supremacy, loss of civil rights, and economic lockdown. Those aren't bugs, they're the features they desire. And in such numbers that working against that will necessarily be a constant fight; making things better won't be on the table, only doing your best to ensure things don't get worse during that current term. I'm not sure that's a fight worth fighting, if I'm honest. Not in that manner, at least. That's where a peaceful separation might be a more-useful discussion, because separating into two distinct nations which can each effect their own visions is arguably a better outcome than trying to remain whole and battling each other bloodily for the soul of the nation, every year.

[Acidbaron]

Middle america also consider socialist = communist = must be destroyed at all costs even if they agree with the actual policies. Biden came out with leftist policies. Higher minimum wage, public option.

I wonder how much of it is actually fear of that and how much of that is the misinformation, arguably it is part of it but there's so much misinformation about what Trump is and did and what Biden isn't and did, that it feels like that is the root issue instead of something else.

How to deal with all of this as a nation and on level of policy without going into full censorship on social media and older media.