Mega-Thread: 2020 United States General Election

[PACOX]

Relative to their time, as in post Reagan, Clinton was far less progressive compared to Bush or even Dole, than Biden is to Trump. I don’t think you grasp the gap between Trump and even Bush. Even with 9/11... Bush said Iraq had WMDs... while Trump was claiming to see Muslims celebrating on NYC. Bush at least half assed trying to distance 9/11 from muslims, is downright progressive to what Trump was saying. There are few so... uhm... conservative, that they demanded Obama’s birth certificate in 2016.

The point I was trying to make is that modern Dems win they market themselves as progressive.

Biden is billing himself as going back to 2016, which is often viewed through rose tinted glasses. Trump one because of the referendum against Establishment politics.

In 2016 employment was trending up but because wages were stagnant and people needed two or three jobs to pay their bills.

People had health insurance but being killed by their premiums and medical debt

People were going to college but had to accept crippling debt and no promise of going out the other end with a better financial future.

The economy was up but every knew it was going to burst regardless of a Clinton, Trump, Sanders, or Cruz.

Immigrants weren't being kicked out as long as did not hope for something better than the jobs Americans did not want.

Biden wants to return all of that.

Obama left with the assumption that the next Dem would finish where he left of, not coast into mediocrity.

[PACOX]

You don’t like the assault rifle ban or the sex offender list?

Edit: Is it the violence against women act?

By the way... it helps if you don’t demonize a bill that included an assault rifle ban, sex offender list and violence against women act. When your actual issue, is the result of 3 strikes rule. That’s how you don’t toss the baby, with the bath water.

Biden only wanted to get rid of ARs because he believes shotguns are much effective killing tools.



The kids say KKona Clap to that.

[Thepersona]

Biden only wanted to get rid of ARs because he believes shotguns are much effective killing tools.



The kids say KKona Clap to that.

I mean, the video was from a few years ago? And the law was almost 30 years ago?

[Theodarzna]

Dodd-Frank is shit, and nothing to be proud about. It's right up there with NAFTA .

I am surprised we haven't be regaled with scolding about how NAFTA is woke as all hell.

I've said it many times now, but It is amazing how much these super fanboi's of the DNC are willing to sepakku their own integrity and values, betray it all, and for absolutely nothing. For Joe "Nothing will fundamentally change" Biden. In this thread and IRL you have people hypocritically burning whatever integrity they had all for the guy who wants Larry Summers and Jamie Diamond to run the economy.

I could rationalize it if Biden was like really going to structurally change the country and make our lives materially better. The guy who said he'd veto National Healthcare, that is the man these people are sepakku'ing their reputation for.

[PACOX]

I know it is moronic, that's not the point here. The point i was trying to make was that the law was not a concerted effort (ie: done with malice) to fuck over minorities, it was just an oversight of how a law that wasnt bad per-se interacted with a racist justice system, and biased penalties for drugs that were more prevalent in poorer (read: with more minorities) communities, and how it made things worse. Have a problem with that? Then whine about how Nixon and Reagan started and escalated the war on drugs, respectively.
And glass steagall was reinstated with the Obama administration (or a glass steagal-esque replacement). And you know who was the VP of said administration? Joe "Motherfucking AMTRAK" Biden.

10 years after Reagans war on drugs and he didn't think the bill wouldn't disproportionately harm minorities? Then he lacks the foresight and understanding of a person who is in charge of the United States.

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I mean, the video was from a few years ago? And the law was almost 30 years ago?

So you're saying Biden is stuck in his bullshit?

He barely lives outside the definition of a grifter.

[JohnBrown1917]

10 years after Reagans war on drugs and he didn't think the bill wouldn't disproportionately harm minorities? Then he lacks the foresight and understanding of a person who is in charge of the United States.

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So you're saying Biden is stuck in his bullshit?

Oh he knew, one look at his history of pro-segregation bullshit. is enough.

[Thepersona]

10 years after Reagans war on drugs and he didn't think the bill wouldn't disproportionately harm minorities? Then he lacks the foresight and understanding of a person who is in charge of the United States.

He (and Clinton) expressed regret on how the law interacted. That was a lack of foresight, and i agree, but context matters, and relative comparison also matters. We have a buffoon in the WH who's a clear and present danger for the safety of our planet and the future of our species.

So you're saying Biden is stuck in his bullshit?

Huh? No?

[PACOX]

Oh he knew, one look at his history of pro-segregation bullshit. is enough.

Always on the right side of history, that Biden.

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He (and Clinton) expressed regret on how the law interacted. That was a lack of foresight, and i agree, but context matters, and relative comparison also matters. We have a buffoon in the WH who's a clear and present danger for the safety of our planet and the future of our species.



Huh? No?

Biden seems to regret a lot. Mostly even thing from 1973 to 2009.

[Thepersona]

Oh he knew, one look at his history of pro-segregation bullshit. is enough.

Reality isnt black and white my commie comrade. I know that because i have ASD and i often think in black and white extremes (believe me that i hate corporate assholes in my country, but that's a story for another day).

"Biden won his Senate seat in 1972 on a platform of integration, but once in office, he faced white constituents who overwhelmingly opposed busing to achieve integration. A Gallup poll in 1973 found that while a majority of Americans supported school integration, only 5% supported busing.

A federal court order in 1974 to integrate Wilmington, Del., schools brought the issue home for Biden. In the Senate, he began supporting much of the anti-busing legislation.

In 1975, Biden supported an amendment by Sen. Jesse Helms, a North Carolina conservative who opposed civil rights, while stating he didn’t share all the views of those who opposed busing.

The amendment, which Helms called an "anti-busing amendment" was intended to ban schools from using federal funds to classify teachers or students based on race..

"I have become convinced that busing is a bankrupt concept that, in fact, does not bear any of the fruit for which it was designed," Biden said on the Senate floor Sept. 17, 1975. "If anything, it obfuscates the real issue today, which is whether or not there is equal opportunity within the educational field for all people within the United States."

Biden said that rather than busing, the Senate should focus on all areas of opportunity in housing, education, equal credit and voting rights to provide minorities with equal access.

When the Helms amendment was defeated, Biden himself proposed measures to oppose busing as a segregation remedy.

But that same year, Biden co-sponsored a 10-year extension of the Voting Rights Act, sponsored legislation to prohibit creditors from discriminating on the basis of race and opposed the nomination of Ben Blackburn, who had voted against civil rights bills in Congress, to the federal bench...

...Biden did oppose court-ordered busing in 1975, a program intended to achieve school integration. But he supported other legislation that aimed to fight segregation in housing and expand voting rights.

We rate this statement Mostly False"

https://www.politifact.com/factcheck...rypicks-joe-b/

[Edge-]

Biden only wanted to get rid of ARs because he believes shotguns are much effective killing tools.

I love when people take a video and completely misrepresent it. Which is precisely what you're doing here.

I mean, we can argue about the overall affects of the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act and its contribution to increasing the prison population and racial disparities therein (historians are already arguing over that), but Biden wrote the damn bill and spent 6 years getting it through. And do you know what it did include when it was passed in 1994? A ban on 19 brands of firearms and the possession of newly manufactured high capacity magazines.

Do you know what you can't find? Biden saying what you claim he says, or even implies. All Biden was doing was providing an answer to a question about how an American citizen can protect themselves with a firearm if they can't use an assault rifle. I'm not sure what's so outrageous or offensive here.

[Thepersona]

I love when people take a video and completely misrepresent it. Which is precisely what you're doing here.

I mean, we can argue about the overall affects of the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act and its contribution to increasing the prison population and racial disparities therein (historians are already arguing over that), but Biden wrote the damn bill and spent 6 years getting it through. And do you know what it did include when it was passed in 1994? A ban on 19 brands of firearms and the possession of newly manufactured high capacity magazines.

Do you know what you can't find? Biden saying what you claim he says, or even implies. All Biden was doing was providing an answer to a question about how an American citizen can protect themselves with a firearm if they can't use an assault rifle. I'm not sure what's so outrageous or offensive here.

I mean, a shotgun armed with some double-up buckshot can kill pretty much anyone with one shot. As Biden said, they're very effective as killing tools, so having an AR-15 (or any other magazine-fed semi automatic intermediate caliber firearm) is not necessary.

...And said bill also included the Violence against women act.

[Edge-]

I mean, a shotgun armed with some double-up buckshot can kill pretty much anyone with one shot.

...ok? I'm not sure what relevance that has to this discussion, did I miss something? >.>

[PACOX]

I love when people take a video and completely misrepresent it. Which is precisely what you're doing here.

I mean, we can argue about the overall affects of the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act and its contribution to increasing the prison population and racial disparities therein (historians are already arguing over that), but Biden wrote the damn bill and spent 6 years getting it through. And do you know what it did include when it was passed in 1994? A ban on 19 brands of firearms and the possession of newly manufactured high capacity magazines.

Do you know what you can't find? Biden saying what you claim he says, or even implies. All Biden was doing was providing an answer to a question about how an American citizen can protect themselves with a firearm if they can't use an assault rifle. I'm not sure what's so outrageous or offensive here.

The man basically said, "he you looking to off of someone. Don't get that AR. It's expensive and hard to use. Mostly malarkey to be honest. Here take this shotgun instead so you can blast them all away, sport. All the shooty shoot shooting with half the work! "

[eschatological]

Weird take mate, I am unsure what your angle is. Like, if I was Muslim and wanted to vote for a Muslim to represent me, would that be bad?

Wait, are you Hindu?

.......this explains a lot, what with the rise in rightwing, Hindu nationalists in India, and their support here.

As an Indian American, don't count me surprised.

[Thepersona]

...ok? I'm not sure what relevance that has to this discussion, did I miss something? >.>

The point being (the one that Biden tried to convey), having an AR-15 is not necessary for home defense, or any other magazine fed, semiautomatic, intermediate caliber firearm. Shotguns are sufficently good at being a killing tool for that purpose.

[PACOX]

The point being, having an AR-15 is not necessary for home defense.

Because shotguns gets them dead faster!

Joe Biden, 2020 NRA.

[Edge-]

The man basically said, "he you looking to off of someone. Don't get that AR. It's expensive and hard to use. Mostly malarkey to be honest. Here take this shotgun instead so you can blast them all away, sport. All the shooty shoot shooting with half the work! "

Yes, to respond to a question about using firearms for personal protection, by sharing an anecdote of the advise he gave his wife about keeping a shotgun at home for home protection.

And you're twisting it beyond recognition to serve an agenda.

Is is the most artful response? No. Is it the most intelligent response? Probably not, either. But is he saying that shotguns are better killing tools? Fuck no he is not.

[Thepersona]

Because shotguns gets them dead faster!

Joe Biden, 2020 NRA.

I'm not following your thought here. Shotguns are allowed in almost every country that allows the sale of firearms. Semi automatic rifles, on the other hand, are not. Here you can buy a semiauto shotgun, but not an AR-15.
Mostly because training on shotguns is way harder, more expensive, and tougher on your body than training on a AR-15. Also, shotguns are not a long range (100yds+) weapon, and AR-15 style rifles are.

[Edge-]

Because shotguns gets them dead faster!

Joe Biden, 2020 NRA.

We still have a Second Amendment, like it or not, dude. That isn't going to change, and running on repealing the Second Amendment is a great way to make sure you never win outside of the most liberal of local elections.

Good lord, dude.

Didn't Canada just announce a ban on a wide range of assault weapons in response to a mass shooting? Why didn't they hit those shotguns, dude?

[eschatological]

Democrats have failed as much as Trump and the GOP at their response thus far. Full Stop. They are both terrible, and passed Trillions of dollars in no-time with only single peep coming from Republican. The only good part was the part worked on by Sanders. Huge Surprise there.

You mean the part that Bernie Sanders came in on at the last day just to make a speech about, but was written by Michael Bennet, (D-CO), and others, who put in the work?

Your shallow knowledge of what actual legislators are doing is distressing.


As for the rest of the bill, countless Dems (headed by Warren) pointed out where the oversight needed to be.......but Congress can't do enforcement of a law, only the Executive Branch can, and Trump has handed over that to his corrupt SecTreas, Steve Mnuchin, and Jared.