Mega-Thread: 2020 United States General Election

[zealo]

Too bad the EU had to do most of the funding for the research/development to be possible.

No clue where the money for "Project Warp Speed" from Trump went, probably straight into his bank accounts.

The site mass-producing the vaccine is very near my door here in the EU too (the outfitting of the factory also funded majorly by the EU).

BionTech isn't large enough of a company to get this produced in the volumes necessary in the timespan at hand, the actual mass production is through a partnership with Pfizer to get it done at the scale necessary.

[Mihalik]

The weird thing is...

The Republicans have spent much of my lifetime (20 vs 15 years) being in power. Of those years I can remember the Bush Jr. and Trump years, but you know you can read up on the rest.

In all those years Republicans have made things worse and worse and worse. Economic ruin again and again... We're on the 3rd Republican lead and caused massive recession in as many decades. The middle class was kneecapped, Unions were nearly wiped out, put education system was eroded into a useless nubbin, healthcare reform was made virtually impossible, endless wars and the list goes on and on.

Often the very communities that most fervently support the Republicans are the ones most severely affected.

And after all that 70 million people still think more Republicans will make their lives better...and there's no way to convince them otherwise. You can show them objective data proving that the very people they are voting for are the ones ruining their lives, and they'll just stick their fingers in their ears go - Lalalalalala, I can't hear you! Fake news! Deep state! OAN, Alex Jones, Benghazi, Hillary Clinton eats babies! China virus! Lalalalalala.

What do you do with is?

There was that interview a few days back with the nurse who was finally losing her shit watching people who were literally dying from Covid, being angry about the "China virus hoax" refusing to believe what was killing them.

I clarify.... They aren't mad their dying... They are mad that they are dying of Covid, refusing to accept it's that, saying it must be lung cancer or something.

This is a death cult. How do you deal with these people?

Prophets of the Death Cult like Tucker Carlson, the Koch Brothers and Fox News might look at the cult they built and now try to take a step back, but it seems the ship has sailed.

It's like, Abu Bakr Al-Baghdadi waking up one day in Raqqah, looking out his window to see heads on spikes and going - Whoops, I might have went a bit too far.

At that point you can't reign it in again.

And I'm sure (or at least hope) not all the 70 million people who voted for the Death Cult are death cultists themselves... But don't they see that they are hanging out with a death cult?

[Breccia]

The last lawsuit in Arizona has been tossed.

Trump was trying to stop the certification based on two votes. Two. As in, flip the bird with both hands, that many. Biden won by ten thousand.

However, Trump does have a new lawsuit in Michigan --

"Yeah! MAGA!"

--because he's being sued for voter suppression.

"Yeah! Wait, what?"

Michigan group sues Trump campaign citing disenfranchisement of Black voters

In a lawsuit filed in D.C. federal court Friday, the group alleged the Trump campaign is attempting mass voter suppression — particularly among Black voters — by pressuring election officials into not certifying the election results in their state.

"Repeating false claims of voter fraud, which have been thoroughly debunked, Defendants are pressuring state and local officials in Michigan not to count votes from Wayne County, Michigan (where Detroit is the county seat), and thereby disenfranchise hundreds of thousands of voters," the lawsuit stated. "Defendants’ tactics repeat the worst abuses in our nation’s history, as Black Americans were denied a voice in American democracy for most of the first two centuries of the Republic."


The lawsuit aimed to halt any efforts by the Trump campaign and the president to push state officials into canceling their ballots or appointing electors who do not represent the election results in their state. It cited numerous efforts to cast doubt on the election, from Trump's personal tweets to a White House meeting Friday between Republican state lawmakers and Trump.

The plaintiffs included three Black residents of Detroit — Teasha K. Jones, Nicole L. Hill and Maureen Taylor — who voted in this year's election, as well as the Michigan Welfare Rights Organization. The plaintiffs are represented by lawyers from the NAACP Legal Defense Fund.

Amongst other things, the lawsuit basically says that Trump filed a lawuit claiming crazy bullshit, then withdrew the lawsuit, but left their crazy bullshit claims on the record, making them effectively official.

[Benggaul]

None of your statements change the fact that BioNTech developed the BNT162 vaccine and collaborate with Pfizer in the western world for getting it to people and with Fosun in China.

I knew that some in the US suffered from the Not-Invented-Here syndrome, but I didn't know that it was so severe.

What I said:

Well for one thing Pfizer's vaccine was developed in New York

And now this:

Pfizer's lab in Rockland County [Benggaul's note: this is in New York] is the primary research and development center for the vaccine.

So, once again, my statement was true and you're choosing to be a pedant. *shrug*

And I don't know what kind of "HERPDERP 'MURICA NUMBER ONE!" light you're trying to cast me in here but I'm not one of those yahoos who thinks everything--or, indeed, anything--American is superior and the rest of the world is trash. I'm not trying to take some weird pride in the fact that it was developed in New York--I don't live there and don't give a fuck where it's developed/produced. I would take a vaccine made anywhere else in the world if it's been tested and proven (and I likely will be given I don't currently live in the States).

The only point I was making was that Trump would have a hard time denying New York the vaccine when it's being developed there. You are the one who all of a sudden went off on some strange pseudo-nationalistic journey. I realize English may not be your first language (I don't know for sure, I don't know where you're from) and if you don't know me from my other posts here you might not be able to accurately detect my tone, but fuck dude maybe try to figure that out before you jump down my throat because of a simplified statement of fact. Toodles.

[Felya]

Republicans saying they’re ready to go to Civil War if Trump tells them to. It’s bloody insane... the absolute denial and loyalty these people give him. It’s exactly what Trump wants.

Link: https://www.yahoo.com/news/why-repub...120755031.html

They are in Texas... not really the place to start an attack on liberal officials. Also, if they are waiting for Trump to tell them to attack, it will never happen. Trump is in a bunker and Russians haven’t even reached the subway tunnels........

[DarkAmbient]

This fucking guy https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/...48622898515969

[beanman12345]

Republicans saying they’re ready to go to Civil War if Trump tells them to. It’s bloody insane... the absolute denial and loyalty these people give him. It’s exactly what Trump wants.

Link: https://www.yahoo.com/news/why-repub...120755031.html

rofl. idiots. “If I’m being manipulated by Trump ... then he is the greatest con man that ever lived in America,” uhhhhhhhhh yeah bro he is.

[DarkAmbient]

What is actually going to happen if he refuses to leave? Will they literally have to escort him out of the White House? Can the military/security services etc just refuse to take orders from him anymore?

[beanman12345]

What is actually going to happen if he refuses to leave? Will they literally have to escort him out of the White House? Can the military/security services etc just refuse to take orders from him anymore?

apparently if SS or Military try to even block a door to prevent him for being removed they'd be arrested. But that's not gonna happen. My guess Trump will go to mar-a-lago or someplace for xmas and just not return after.

[DarkAmbient]

Come Jan 20th, Biden will be the active President and the military will follow his orders, doesn’t matter what Trump says/does.

Well that's a relief. All Biden needs to do is not die before then, lol.

apparently if SS or Military try to even block a door to prevent him for being removed they'd be arrested. But that's not gonna happen. My guess Trump will go to mar-a-lago or someplace for xmas and just not return after.

Yeah I guess to save himself the embarrassment he might just scuttle off and go to ground for a while, you're probably right. Ending not with a bang but with a whimper.

[Mihalik]

Come Jan 20th, Biden will be the active President and the military will follow his orders, doesn’t matter what Trump says/does.

Debatable.

It's unprecedented but the military doesn't really have a legal mechanism for choosing whose the legitimate Commander in Chief.

It's more and more looking like Republicans will either try to overturn the results or refuse to accept the legitimacy.

Let's say Biden is swears in and Trump swears in. Independently of each other.

One has control of the civilian infrastructure of the military (Trump) the other doesn't (Biden).

Whatever happens here, I think the military will sit this one out and just fall in line with the eventual outcome.

I think people who place their faith in the military to step in and save them...are deluding themselves with wishful thinking.

Also anyone who thought that Republicans after an initial phase of denial will eventually gradually come to their senses and take a step back from the brink and drag Trump with them were also deluding themselves.

Tho opposite has happened and is happening.

I've said on election night, this is only over when Trump is no longer in the White House, even then this won't be really truly over, assuming Trump doesn't just stay on.

[Orange Joe]

Republicans saying they’re ready to go to Civil War if Trump tells them to. It’s bloody insane... the absolute denial and loyalty these people give him. It’s exactly what Trump wants.

Link: https://www.yahoo.com/news/why-repub...120755031.html

If only people said shit like this would happen 4 years ago before Trump was elected. I mean who would have thought Trump was a complete shitbag

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Debatable.

It's unprecedented but the military doesn't really have a legal mechanism for choosing whose the legitimate Commander in Chief.

It's more and more looking like Republicans will either try to overturn the results or refuse to accept the legitimacy.

Let's say Biden is swears in and Trump swears in. Independently of each other.

One has control of the civilian infrastructure of the military (Trump) the other doesn't (Biden).

Whatever happens here, I think the military will sit this one out and just fall in line with the eventual outcome.

I think people who place their faith in the military to step in and save them...are deluding themselves with wishful thinking.

Also anyone who thought that Republicans after an initial phase of denial will eventually gradually come to their senses and take a step back from the brink and drag Trump with them were also deluding themselves.

Tho opposite has happened and is happening.

I've said on election night, this is only over when Trump is no longer in the White House, even then this won't be really truly over, assuming Trump doesn't just stay on.

That can't even happen.

[Mormolyce]

The conventional wisdom that Hillary lost because she's an establishment candidate is belied by, among other things, Joe Biden's win with ~80 million votes, 306 EC votes, and gaining ground with Georgia, Arizona, and Nevada, so it fails and requires a different explanation.

Yes, Biden won with a huge number of votes, but scraped by in nail-biters in a handful of states - why is that? Really, think about it.

It's because the majority of those increased votes were in already blue states. Not in say, FL and OH where you really needed them. So his he was only strong in the places that were already going to vote Democrat, and weak in battleground states - this is the exact opposite of the entire rationale for nominating him.

[Mormolyce]

He didn't fail to perform. He won the election.

He barely won the election, failed to manifest the "blue wave" as constantly speculated, and failed in the exact states where establishment candidates claim they should be appealing. If an establishment candidate can't win in FL and OH, what's the point of them?

Now Biden enters office as the oldest President in history, with a likely inimical Senate. Incumbent parties usually lose seats in the midterm, so that's 2022... and 2024 is the map that favours Republicans. This was the chance to turn the tide, and he blew it.

Back in 2016, I believed in these establishment arguments too. They make sense, they're conventional political wisdom. Besides, I have no horse in this race - I don't live in America and wouldn't vote if I did. But then 2016 and 2020 happened, and the result is plain as the nose on your face. Hillary and Biden both promised that they could appeal to swing voters more than a candidate who actually stood for real change. They both failed spectacularly at that. One barely won, the other barely lost, sure. But what neither did is win over the "middle".

There are only two possibilities. One is that the middle is so small it effectively doesn't exist. The other is that middling candidates like Hillary and Biden do not appeal to the middle. Whichever of these is true, it completely undermines any reason to put up establishment candidates.

[Forogil]

What I said:
"Well for one thing Pfizer's vaccine was developed in New York"

And as I stated that statement had two errors, you could just have accepted that and moved on - but instead you decide to make a big deal out of it,

First and foremost it's actually a Pfizer and BioNTech vaccine, as Pfizer themselves says https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-re...didate-against - and secondly it wasn't developed in New York, but primarily in Germany.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BNT162b2

BioNTech is the original developer of the underlying vaccine technology, while Pfizer provides logistics, finances and oversees the clinical trials, and is the manufacturing partner of BNT162b2 worldwide, with the exception of China where the license was purchased by Fosun

And now this: "Pfizer's lab in Rockland County [Benggaul's note: this is in New York] is the primary research and development center for the vaccine."

Which was linking to a local story in the New York region that just claimed that they "spearheaded" the effort - what-ever that means.
That article also call it a Pfizer and BioNTech vaccine in the text.

You are the one who all of a sudden went off on some strange pseudo-nationalistic journey.

No, I'm just trying to set the facts straight.

And for distributing vaccine the more important part is manufacturing, which in the US is done in Kalamazoo, Michigan (and gov. Gretchen is unlikely to do as Trump says), and finally it seems Pfizer is in charge of the logistics of distribution in the US (they didn't opt into that part of WarpSpeed):
https://www.fox5ny.com/news/trump-cl...ed-to-new-york

[Mormolyce]

Republicans saying they’re ready to go to Civil War if Trump tells them to. It’s bloody insane... the absolute denial and loyalty these people give him. It’s exactly what Trump wants.

Seriously, just do it. Let's finally get this over with.

[Resurgo]

...
It's because the majority of those increased votes were in already blue states. Not in say, FL and OH where you really needed them. So his he was only strong in the places that were already going to vote Democrat, and weak in battleground states - this is the exact opposite of the entire rationale for nominating him.

That's living with the flaws of the electoral college.

~80 million people vs ~73 million people

Blue states/Red states shouldn't even enter into the equation. Land doesn't vote.

[beanman12345]

If only people said shit like this would happen 4 years ago before Trump was elected. I mean who would have thought Trump was a complete shitbag

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That can't even happen.

sure it can. Biden get's sworn in by Roberts at the capital building, While Trump get's sworn in by Rudy on the golf course.

[zealo]

That can't even happen.

Wouldn't be that shocking if it does, it's happened before in countries the US has "exported" democracy to.

[Mormolyce]

What is actually going to happen if he refuses to leave? Will they literally have to escort him out of the White House? Can the military/security services etc just refuse to take orders from him anymore?

Most likely that will not happen, he's probably just going to slink off to Mar-a-Lago or wherever. But LegalEagle did a video about what would happen legally speaking in such an absurd scenario:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnhF_Qw0dtk

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sure it can. Biden get's sworn in by Roberts at the capital building, While Trump get's sworn in by Rudy on the golf course.

Is Four Seasons Landscaping unavailable?