1. #5201
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Pretty much. Given the current circumstances I'd be striking Warren off the shortlist, too - I think America needs a high profile person of color in office again.

    No, not you Kamala.
    I love the idea of Vice-President (and then hopefully President) Warren, but she would also make an ass-kicking SecTreas. Abrams and Demmings are both solid women-of-color choices that would both excite and ignite the base.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kaelleria View Post
    Abrams isn't high profile.
    Uhhh....what.



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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    I love the idea of Vice-President (and then hopefully President) Warren, but she would also make an ass-kicking SecTreas. Abrams and Demmings are both solid women-of-color choices that would both excite and ignite the base.
    Warren's practical skillset is more useful in the cabinet, I agree. Same with Harris.

    I would say Dennings but...I don't trust the Florida Democratic Party enough to not bungle the state, even with Trump's current ratings.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kaelleria View Post
    Abrams isn't high profile.
    I would have to respectfully disagree. And if you're putting Demmings on the high profile list, then Abrams certainly qualifies, too. And I know you're going to say (at least I think ) that Val is a U.S. Congresswoman - and that should be high profile enough. But it isn't - I had heard and knew a lot about Abrams months before I heard of Demmings. That's just me of course - but I do pay attention to these matters.

    Of course - the answer to me is "who fucking cares" - because Demmings is also an ass-kicking black woman and she could single-handedly deliver FL - and if Biden wins FL that's the whole ballgame there.

    Did I just defeat my own argument?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Warren's practical skillset is more useful in the cabinet, I agree. Same with Harris.

    I would say Dennings but...I don't trust the Florida Democratic Party enough to not bungle the state, even with Trump's current ratings.
    Agreed re Harris - I would be terrified of AG Harris and I haven't fucking done anything wrong. She would crawl right up everyone's ass and rip out their intestines to get to the heart of any matter. If Biden wins he might have one of the most diverse cabinets in history.

    Interesting point about FL - I hadn't considered that the FLDNC would fuck up even almost sure thing.

  4. #5204
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Agreed re Harris - I would be terrified of AG Harris and I haven't fucking done anything wrong. She would crawl right up everyone's ass and rip out their intestines to get to the heart of any matter. If Biden wins he might have one of the most diverse cabinets in history.

    Interesting point about FL - I hadn't considered that the FLDNC would fuck up even almost sure thing.
    It's all the incompetence of a state level Democratic party with all the craziness of Florida being...Florida.

    Like, we complain about being unable to find a single Virginia Democrat who hasn't been in blackface or gods forbid the shitshow that is the IDP, but yikes at least they know how to run their political machine.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  5. #5205
    Compared to Kamala or Warren, Abrams isn't really high profile.

    Personally I think it's going to end up being Kamala. Warren has the DNA nonsense that will be a distraction regardless of how overblown you think it is.... She's also an old white woman. Abrams is well known to people who follow politics, but most people don't.

  6. #5206
    Quote Originally Posted by kaelleria View Post
    Compared to Kamala or Warren, Abrams isn't really high profile.

    Personally I think it's going to end up being Kamala. Warren has the DNA nonsense that will be a distraction regardless of how overblown you think it is.... She's also an old white woman. Abrams is well known to people who follow politics, but most people don't.
    You bet your ass she is. Her campaign for Georgia governor got huge national attention. She was higher profile than Kamala was before Kamala ran, and I'd argue remains at least as high profile as Kamala now. Less so than Warren likely, but still quite high profile.

    And I'm still skeptical about Kamala given her record as DA, that's gonna bite her in the ass hard, and given that she was firmly running in the Biden centrist lane that's a pick that's not gonna do anything for the more progressive wing of the party.

    Abrams is well known to folks that follow politics, yeah. But like it or not she checks off quite a few boxes for what the Democrats would want in a VP candidate - female, of color, IIRC she's more progressive than Biden (but not a hardcore progressive). I still am impressed with how much political clout/capital she's built despite losing her election and am a bit mystified about why she remains so high profile, but reality is reality.

  7. #5207
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaelleria View Post
    Compared to Kamala or Warren, Abrams isn't really high profile.

    Personally I think it's going to end up being Kamala. Warren has the DNA nonsense that will be a distraction regardless of how overblown you think it is.... She's also an old white woman. Abrams is well known to people who follow politics, but most people don't.
    Abrams entirely high profile. Her gubernatorial campaign garnered national attention, and that was before she had it stolen by the GOP then-SecState. And you were comparing her to Demmings, IIRC, so that's a different playing field than Harris or Warren.

    Harris, imo, is a non-starter. She has some issues with her prosecutorial record and something about an affair - both of which I believe are unfounded and unfair criticisms - but we need the VP candidate to be as clean as possible. Look for her in the Cabinet as AG or National Security Chief.

    Warren is golden, but carries a lot of Hillary-esque baggage - again, unfounded and unfair, but this is politics. She will be Biden's SecTreas.

    I think the two M peeps are out - Minnesota for this whole flair-up that isn't her fault, but she'll be tainted by it. And the MI governor, because of her fuck-wit husband.

    Klobuchar is a solid possibility.

  8. #5208
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    You bet your ass she is. Her campaign for Georgia governor got huge national attention. She was higher profile than Kamala was before Kamala ran, and I'd argue remains at least as high profile as Kamala now. Less so than Warren likely, but still quite high profile.

    And I'm still skeptical about Kamala given her record as DA, that's gonna bite her in the ass hard, and given that she was firmly running in the Biden centrist lane that's a pick that's not gonna do anything for the more progressive wing of the party.

    Abrams is well known to folks that follow politics, yeah. But like it or not she checks off quite a few boxes for what the Democrats would want in a VP candidate - female, of color, IIRC she's more progressive than Biden (but not a hardcore progressive). I still am impressed with how much political clout/capital she's built despite losing her election and am a bit mystified about why she remains so high profile, but reality is reality.
    I have no issues with Abrams, but she's still relatively unknown compared to Harris... There are 35% of voters who have no opinion of her.
    https://today.yougov.com/topics/poli...e-favorability


    Demmings isn't really high profile either, so I don't think she'll be the choice.

    Basically Abrams will result in a who? from a bunch of people. Whether or not this is a bad thing, I don't know given Biden's universal name recognition.

    I just think the smart money is still on Harris.
    Last edited by kaelleria; 2020-05-29 at 09:36 PM.

  9. #5209
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Abrams is well known to folks that follow politics, yeah. But like it or not she checks off quite a few boxes for what the Democrats would want in a VP candidate - female, of color, IIRC she's more progressive than Biden (but not a hardcore progressive). I still am impressed with how much political clout/capital she's built despite losing her election and am a bit mystified about why she remains so high profile, but reality is reality.
    Combination of factors, I think; aside from her obvious merits as a public servant, the closeness of the election in an environment plagued by voter suppression kinda gives the impression that she should be the rightful Governor of Georgia, especially given the incumbent's many, many failings. But let's not discount her own agency here; she's been very active in the aftermath of her election as an advocate for various causes, as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

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  11. #5211
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lenonis View Post
    It's not helping.
    Hate to say it but I don't think anything can help the situation you guys are in, as South Park would say you can vote for the turd sandwich or the giant douche. It's not like you actually have any decent option so it's understandable why many of you are just trying to **** the system.

  12. #5212
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    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    It's not like you actually have any decent option so it's understandable why many of you are just trying to **** the system.
    It actually really isn't understandable if people take more than five minutes to look at the situation and remember that the Judiciary exists.

    But I guess because it's just minority rights on the line it's worth gambling for some crackpot shot at universal healthcare.

    Christ on a bike.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  13. #5213
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    It actually really isn't understandable if people take more than five minutes to look at the situation and remember that the Judiciary exists.
    Care to elaborate?

  14. #5214
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    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Hate to say it but I don't think anything can help the situation you guys are in, as South Park would say you can vote for the turd sandwich or the giant douche. It's not like you actually have any decent option so it's understandable why many of you are just trying to **** the system.
    What's amazing is that people like you still chug the "neither choice is good" kool aid that Team Deplorable and their Russian Troll Farms shrill. Do you enjoy being told what to think? Or do you know how wrong you are, but still shill because *reasons*?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    What's amazing is that people like you still chug the "neither choice is good" kool aid that Team Deplorable and their Russian Troll Farms shrill. Do you enjoy being told what to think? Or do you know how wrong you are, but still shill because *reasons*?
    Lmao, neither choice is good, it's a fact not an opinion.

    Now are they equally bad? No, of course not, Biden is blatantly the least worst option (hell even I can see that and I'm British so dislike him from his time with Obummer), but to try and pretend he's actually a good option is comical at best and delusionary at worst.

  16. #5216
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    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Hate to say it but I don't think anything can help the situation you guys are in, as South Park would say you can vote for the turd sandwich or the giant douche. It's not like you actually have any decent option so it's understandable why many of you are just trying to **** the system.
    That’s not what South Park said about Trump...
    Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi

  17. #5217
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    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Lmao, neither choice is good, it's a fact not an opinion.

    Now are they equally bad? No, of course not, Biden is blatantly the least worst option (hell even I can see that and I'm British so dislike him from his time with Obummer), but to try and pretend he's actually a good option is comical at best and delusionary at worst.
    Go ahead and make your case for why he's not a good option. Include links with any accusations. We'll wait.
    (if you've posted before your reasons - just relink those is fine)

    and now we wait while the response will be "you should know this already, i don't have to prove it" or "unfettered opinions from troll farms" - should be fun to watch, regardless
    Last edited by cubby; 2020-05-29 at 10:29 PM.

  18. #5218
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Go ahead and make your case for why he's not a good option. Include links with any accusations. We'll wait.
    (if you've posted before your reasons - just relink those is fine)

    and now we wait while the response will be "you should know this already, i don't have to prove it" or "unfettered opinions from troll farms" - should be fun to watch, regardless
    We've been through this a thousand fucking times: he supported segregation, homophobia, worked with white supremacists, cheerleaded for Bush wars, is accused of rape, plagiarized his way through college and a 1988 campaign speech. Most of this isn't even contestable, it is just historical record.

    Any of those things would be enough to sink a candidate if they didn't have the patronage of Wall St, which is the only reason we are discussing this vile, disgusting horrible human being.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Care to elaborate?
    The Democrats are spinning this fiction that Trump will pack the Supreme Court with conservatives and they will outlaw gayness or something.

    In fact it makes very little difference who is on the Supreme Court. The most liberal piece of legislation in recent history (Roe vs Wade) was passed by 5 conservative judges.

    The Democrats push this a lot because it is one of a few areas where there is an actual policy difference.

  19. #5219
    Quote Originally Posted by fringist View Post
    We've been through this a thousand fucking times: he supported segregation, homophobia, worked with white supremacists, cheerleaded for Bush wars, is accused of rape, plagiarized his way through college and a 1988 campaign speech. Most of this isn't even contestable, it is just historical record.

    Any of those things would be enough to sink a candidate if they didn't have the patronage of Wall St, which is the only reason we are discussing this vile, disgusting horrible human being.

    - - - Updated - - -



    The Democrats are spinning this fiction that Trump will pack the Supreme Court with conservatives and they will outlaw gayness or something.

    In fact it makes very little difference who is on the Supreme Court. The most liberal piece of legislation in recent history (Roe vs Wade) was passed by 5 conservative judges.

    The Democrats push this a lot because it is one of a few areas where there is an actual policy difference.
    And trump rounds up refugee children and rapes them, Where'S ThA Difference.

    I have facts on mah side

  20. #5220
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post

    But I guess because it's just minority rights on the line

    Obama did fuck all for minorities-their socioeconomic situation got worse under his presidency. Biden will be worse.

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