Mega-Thread: 2020 United States General Election

[Bodakane]

By that metric, Joe Biden is a Trump supporter given his vow that Nothing Will Fundamentally Change.

Who is touting Biden as anything other than, 'light years better than trump"? You are conflating:

- the Dems voting him in the primary because they felt like he'd win the moderate votes

with

- he's the man to champion a true liberal agenda

Again, for the 100th time, the only people that think Biden is sup[er liberal are your people.

[unfilteredJW]

Imagine being in favor of democracy and then shitting all over anybody who wants to push for fundamental changes. Because that's what some of us get, that somehow this tiny corner of the political discussion is going to widely swing an election and not that many of our concerns are probably shared by 1000s if not a whole lot more. Most Americans don't vote and they don't vote because neither the Democrats or Republicans can convince them they are working to improve their lives of govern in a way that actually helps them.

"OMG, people don't want to vote someone that clearly doesn't actually give a shit". You all just like hearing yourself moralize that your own view of the world is correct and insist that our own lived experience are invalidated.

Well I know what it's like growing up poor under a Clinton era presidency, and what it was like coming out of college from two terms of Obama. It wasn't great, and it wasn't even good. It was shitty, and it continues to be shitty. Swapping out Trump for the same policies that lead to Trump and being silent about it isn't a fucking option. I don't care how much better it makes you all feel to point out how much worse Trump is then Biden, "is not the hot take you think". Biden won't be anything but mediocre. Like Biden has been throughout his political career.

Even last night the DNC saw fit to have someone morally shame voters who might vote third party. Where the fuck do any of you get the right to act as moral judge and jurors to how the fuck people vote? It's our vote and we'll do with it what we want, and you trying to talk down to us like we don't know what the hell we are talking about isn't going to help. It does the exact opposite. So please continue, and I'll continue to support and push for the people and candidates that ACTUALLY Represent me. If Biden loses don't come crying and blaming anyone but Biden for losing. Just like the only person who needs to be blamed for losing in 2016 is Hillary Clinton. You all didn't want to listen to common sense back then and were just as out of touch. Biden and the DNC continue to spit in the face of the base so don't be shocked if the only reason they vote for Biden is because Trump is bad. It wasn't enough in 2016, and you all better hope it's enough in 2020. I think it will be, but doesn't mean I am going to be silent about it or that anyone needs should be.

The base picked Biden.

[PfeffermintShake]

The base picked Biden.

Also shows that the poster didnt actually watch the DNC last night. Multiple speakers made the moral case for voting for Biden.

That the poster phrased it as a singular speaker "morally shaming" them. Reveals they rely on a bad twitter take for their opinions about Democrats.

[Endus]

Imagine being in favor of democracy and then shitting all over anybody who wants to push for fundamental changes.

Imagine reading my post and thinking this was in any way a response to anything I actually said.

Cause it's not. You're strawmanning. I was responding to Theo's nonsense, there. Nothing more.

Hell, I'm probably supporting more fundamental change than most of you making that claim.

[Edge-]

They picked Hillary Clinton as well, and look where that lead us.

...and? She was a fine pick, if not particularly exciting, won the popular vote, and was screwed due to a mixture of Russian interference and bad timing (Comey letter to Congress).

Sometimes your candidate loses, this is how politics works.

[Theodarzna]

So, is there a reason why you are pointing this out, besides attempting to elicit wild reactions from people? You know what that would make you, if that's your entire goal?

And as everyone keeps telling you, "centrism" or whatever you want to paint it as, is infinitely preferable to the absolute shit show we have right now.

The reason I'd posit for the reaction is that some people cannot square the circle between supposed self proclaimed Leftism and the actual reality of being a rather normal Liberal. More over there is some strange expectation that Leftists should vote counter to their own convictions by voting for the Liberal political party any way and pointing out the obvious makes that act hard to do.

[Endus]

...and? She was a fine pick, if not particularly exciting, won the popular vote, and was screwed due to a mixture of Russian interference and bad timing (Comey letter to Congress).

Sometimes your candidate loses, this is how politics works.

Also, maybe we should put the "blame" on her loss on the voters who were scared off by the bullshit "Lock Her Up" nonsense, and all those supporting Trump. Y'know, blame people for their choices, not the candidate for being exactly who she always was and which the DNC overwhelmingly supported as their candidate.

[Omega10]

Imagine being in favor of democracy and then shitting all over anybody who wants to push for fundamental changes. Because that's what some of us get, that somehow this tiny corner of the political discussion is going to widely swing a national election. That many of our concerns are probably shared by 1000s if not a whole lot more people. Most Americans don't vote and they don't vote because neither the Democrats or Republicans can convince them they are working to improve their lives of govern in a way that actually helps them.

"OMG, people don't want to vote someone that clearly doesn't actually give a shit". You all just like hearing yourself moralize that your own view of the world is correct and insist that our own lived experience are invalidated.

Well I know what it's like growing up poor under a Clinton era presidency, and what it was like coming out of college from two terms of Obama. It wasn't great, and it wasn't even good. It was shitty, and it continues to be shitty. Swapping out Trump for the same policies that lead to Trump and being silent about it isn't a fucking option. I don't care how much better it makes you all feel to point out how much worse Trump is then Biden, "is not the hot take you think". Biden won't be anything but mediocre. Like Biden has been throughout his political career.

Even last night the DNC saw fit to have someone morally shame voters who might vote third party. Where the fuck do any of you get the right to act as moral judge and jurors to how the fuck people vote? It's our vote and we'll do with it what we want, and you trying to talk down to us like we don't know what the hell we are talking about isn't going to help. It does the exact opposite. So please continue, and I'll continue to support and push for the people and candidates that ACTUALLY Represent me. If Biden loses don't come crying and blaming anyone but Biden for losing. Just like the only person who needs to be blamed for losing in 2016 is Hillary Clinton. You all didn't want to listen to common sense back then and were just as out of touch. Biden and the DNC continue to spit in the face of the base so don't be shocked if the only reason they vote for Biden is because Trump is bad. It wasn't enough in 2016, and you all better hope it's enough in 2020. I think it will be, but doesn't mean I am going to be silent about it or that anyone needs should be.

In support of your thesis, here is what Americans are going through today. Your word "shitty" is accurate.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/parents-g...140015382.html
Title: Parents are going into debt to pay for kids' breakfasts, lunches

Excerpts:

Switching from in-person to online schooling has been hard on many families – and on their budgets.

About one-quarter of parents say they’ve gone into debt to pay for their kids’ at-home school expenses, with a large share blaming the cost of paying for their kids’ breakfasts and lunches when they switched to learning remotely from home.

Basically, school lunches provide food a lot cheaper than what people can get from the grocery store. And people are not just broke, they are VERY broke.

The reasons for the debt are higher grocery prices and the sudden switch to at-home schooling in March.

Prior to the pandemic, about 30 million children were fed daily by their schools’ breakfast and lunch programs, according to the School Nutrition Association, an association of school nutrition professionals.

Those meals are a good deal for parents, with the majority of children receiving free or reduced-cost lunches, while the regular price is about $2.50 a meal for elementary age kids.

Even though school districts across the nation provided free meals to families through pick-up locations during the pandemic, a majority of districts witnessed a drop of 50% or more in the number of meals they served, says Diane Pratt-Heavner, director of media relations for the School Nutrition Association. That could be due to conflicts with work schedules for parents, who might be unable to make it to the pickup locations, or concern about safety given COVID-19 infection rates in some communities.

At the same time, grocery prices have crept upwards, pushing up costs on everything from eggs to peanut butter.

Other costs are also pushing up household spending, with parents anticipating shelling out more money this year on technology such as laptops and tablets, Credit Karma said. That’s most likely due to at-home students needing better equipment to do their work.

Americans are just flat out broke. And, I agree that this situation is "shitty".

As a country, we had several months to prepare for this. And the US just refused to take care of its own. And republicans are still fighting hard to minimize how much aid flows to these people.

[Endus]

The reason I'd posit for the reaction is that some people cannot square the circle between supposed self proclaimed Leftism and the actual reality of being a rather mundane Liberal. More over there is some strange expectation that Leftists should vote counter to their own convictions by voting for the Liberal political party any way and pointing out the obvious makes that act hard to do.

Cute, you don't seem to grasp that classical liberalism is a center-right ideology. Not "leftist" at all.

[Theodarzna]

Who is touting Biden as anything other than, 'light years better than trump"? Y

Given, again, Biden's vow to his donors to do nothing different than the current, Biden has promised in his own words to be no different than Trump, except maybe in decorum. So, light years better? I mean he himself has said to his wealthy donors who pay him that he will be the same.

[Endus]

Why not, you all have no problem blaming voters. It's seems to be a favorite past time.

Yes. Blaming voters, for the votes they chose to cast.

Since when is expecting people to take responsibility for the results of their own free choices a negative, again?

[unfilteredJW]

They picked Hillary Clinton as well, and look where that lead us.

Then why did you invoke the base in that rant?

[Nurasu]

Given, again, Biden's vow to his donors to do nothing different than the current, Biden has promised in his own words to be no different than Trump, except maybe in decorum. So, light years better? I mean he himself has said to his wealthy donors who pay him that he will be the same.

You're getting an awful lot of mileage out of that quote that you've ripped from all context. "Nothing will fundamentally change" as far as taxes on his rich donors - that's all he was talking about. It was even in the same portion of his speech about changes he would make for the poor.

[Endus]

Since it is a politician literal job to get voters to vote for them. You have the entire dynamic flipped.

Nah. I'm just not denying the free agency of voters. Your position here requires that you do so.

[Edge-]

Oh yes, let's Blame the Russians and Comey. Of course. Maybe Comey was working for the RUSSIANS!

Literally never said that, that's a bad looking strawman. Those were two independent, different things.

Losing to Trump shouldn't have even been close. Even now the best argument Biden and you all have is, "he isn't Trump". /clap

Shouldn't have been, but was due to a variety of factors including a Republican voting demographic that votes their feels.

You present no solutions other than, "I don't like it when democracy doesn't go my way!"

[unfilteredJW]

Because those same people would vote for Bush's younger brother or Bloomberg so long as they had a D next to their name.

This is a lie and can be summarily dismissed.

[Nurasu]

Because those same people would vote for Bush's younger brother or Bloomberg so long as they had a D next to their name.

That's why Bloomberg is the candida- oh.

[unfilteredJW]

You mean being vocal about Representative Democracy within a Representative Democracy. /gasp.

Even there you blame Republicans from voting on their feels, and not their lived experiences. The disdain you have for them is disturbing and not helpful at all.

That's a glassy fucking house you have there.

[Endus]

Whose fault was it that she, a very weak candidate, ended up being the Democratic Party choice? The voters that nominated her?

She was a strong candidate. That's why she won the primary so handily.

I'm really not interested in GOP-style bullshit hit propaganda.

[Edge-]

Whose fault was it that she, a very weak candidate, ended up being the Democratic Party choice? The voters that nominated her?

First off, she was in no way a "very weak candidate" except for her likability. She is arguably the single most qualified presidential nominee in US history, ever.

And yes, it's the "fault" of voters who chose her. How do you think she won the nomination, divine intervention or DNC insiders manipulating the primary vote in every state?