1. #10721
    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    That is really not where people should have to go look to find them.

    It should be all over the news and media, front and center in ads, etc. It should be prominently out there being messaged what they are, in my opinion.

    Only being able to find them on a campaign website is the sign of a bad campaign.


    EDIT: And when I go look at the campaign site... It's all over the damn place. No clear focus or anything central that catches the eye. Did these guys forget we're living in the year 2020 ?
    Don't blame the media because you don't know how to use the internet.

  2. #10722
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    EDIT: And when I go look at the campaign site... It's all over the damn place. No clear focus or anything central that catches the eye. Did these guys forget we're living in the year 2020 ?
    Keep on moving them goalposts. In the space of a page and a half we've gone from:

    > "Biden's policies are practically impossible to find", to
    > "Biden's policies aren't being broadcast enough", to
    > "Biden's not campaigning in a way that appeals to me".

    Y'all need to learn the difference between 'It's bad' and 'I don't like'.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  3. #10723
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    It doesn't bode well when I try to google for "Biden's main policies" and I'm met with several pages of opinion pieces and news articles trying to investigate the same thing. There does not seem to be any clear messaging on what his main policies are.

    The main line that does pop out more prominently is:
    "People don't want a revolution, they want results." - something he stated during the same paragraph in which he called for a return to normalcy.


    I actually had to do some digging and research to find his main policies (most of these from the Guardian):
    1. Undo Trump's tax cuts for the wealthy.
    2. Stricter Gun control laws
    3. Affordable Healthcare
    4. Foreign Policy: A stronger stance against non-democratic Dictatorships and illiberal nations (and more traditional cooperation with allies / Paris Climate Accord etc.)
    5. Allow more immigration and loosen up the requirements to be able to claim asylum within the USA for refugees
    6. Affordable Education
    +~some vague talk about increasing the required years of education up from 12 years to 15 years (eg. minimum 3 more years of trade school or college required after high school)


    You can say what you want, but Biden's campaign could do a better job more prominently presenting these as his main 6 campaign points.
    Thats odd. 3rd result for me


  4. #10724
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    People should not be looking for someone's policies...on their campaign website...

    Lol, are you serious right now?

    Again: We get that you don't like Biden or a lot of his policies but that isn't an excuse for outright lying about things to create a false impression. Cut it out with the agitprop.
    He cries about bias in MSM but then cries MSM isn't 100% propoganda pieces for candidates.

  5. #10725
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    Yes? It's absolute common sense.
    Common sense in the year 2020, which you insist of reminding us of, is that someone's policies are available on their website. This has been the case for years in the United States at pretty much every level of government.

    The level of reaching to try and justify this criticism is insane, lol.

    If Obama had ran his campaign like this he would've lost the election against McCain.
    Based on...what?

    The you personally not finding someone's campaign website personally appealing isn't particularly compelling evidence.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  6. #10726
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I guess people really like the idea of fascism.
    I prefer that the Democratic voters feel scared and uncomfortable. They are more likely to vote. Fat and happy voters are no good. We want them to be disgruntled and dissatisfied. That will make sure that they show up.

  7. #10727
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    Okay, you go ahead and have good luck with changing the culture and manner in which people consume media in the year 2020.

    You're allowed to point out when your candidate is doing a bad job at something.
    Sure, what you aren't allowed to do is invent shit out of wholecloth and using that as a springboard for accelerationism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  8. #10728
    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    Okay, you go ahead and have good luck with changing the culture and manner in which people consume media in the year 2020.

    You're allowed to point out when your candidate is doing a bad job at something.
    I have no plans to fix stupidity in people, because it's not possible.

  9. #10729
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Lol, no you didn't. He literally has his policies listed in his campaign website.

    We get that you don't like Biden or a lot of his policies but that isn't an excuse for outright lying about things to create a false impression. Cut it out with the agitprop.
    I guess that's why so few voted for Bernie--people who might have supported him apparently couldn't manage to go to his website where all of his policies, positions and credentials are on display. I didn't realize all those "progressives" couldn't even figure out how the internet works.

  10. #10730
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    > Goalposts are moved

    That is like the classic effortless argument.

    Try to combine those three sentences there into one message and maybe you'll see the forest through the trees.
    Ah yeah that sign right there that reads "Bad Faith Argument National Park?"

    His policies are hard to find...
    Objectively false, as we've proven.

    who the fuck is going to go read a campaign website?
    Most people in the year 2020.

    They should be broadcasted better.
    This is a different argument from "they are hard to find", hun.

    Then when they go read it... there's like a grey mass of boxes and no main or central policies listed.
    You don't seem to grasp this is subjective opinion on your part and that presenting it as an objective fact doesn't fly without like, actual substantiation of the argument.

    At this point yes, the objective correct answer to summarize his policies are: "Nothing special, just some stuff. You know, the usual."
    That is hardly appealing.
    Kewl. You know what is?

    Not descending into plutocratic despotism. That is the main angle that is being pushed by the Biden camp at the moment and thus far it is proving effective.

    Like, let's be real here; it's not that Biden isn't marketing, it's that Biden isn't marketing to progressives. It's a same bullshit rehash of the same "if the Democrats had just nominated Bernie or accepted Medicare for All they would have taken the House, Senate, or Presidency" nonsense we've seen tossed around since 2016 despite there being no evidence of such.

    People are upset that they couldn't hack it in the primary, aren't being fawned on in the general, and throwing a tantrum by projecting their misgivings on the electorate in a pathetic attempt to scare people into giving them their way.
    Last edited by Elegiac; 2020-08-29 at 09:33 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  11. #10731
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    I prefer that the Democratic voters feel scared and uncomfortable. They are more likely to vote. Fat and happy voters are no good. We want them to be disgruntled and dissatisfied. That will make sure that they show up.
    I agree the voters should not get complacent. Especially given the monumental amount of suppression we're facing this year.

  12. #10732
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    That is really not where people should have to go look to find them.

    It should be all over the news and media, front and center in ads, etc. It should be prominently out there being messaged what they are, in my opinion.

    Only being able to find them on a campaign website is the sign of a bad campaign.


    EDIT: And when I go look at the campaign site... It's all over the damn place. No clear focus or anything central that catches the eye. Did these guys forget we're living in the year 2020 ?
    Good news, if this shit is too complicated there's another candidate that is more your speed.
    /s

  13. #10733
    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    That is really not where people should have to go look to find them.
    Policy/position pages like this have been bog-standard in presidential elections for quite some time now. I'm not sure why people wouldn't go to a candidate's page to learn more about them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    It should be all over the news and media, front and center in ads, etc. It should be prominently out there being messaged what they are, in my opinion.
    It is in various ways, but Biden can't quite dominate the news 24/7 just to make sure someone tuning in at 4AM on October 23 can finally learn about his positions. Other shit is happening in the world, there's another campaign being run, and you can only repeat your campaign positions so much before people tell you to come up with something new.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    Only being able to find them on a campaign website is the sign of a bad campaign.
    His positions are all over the internet, from his campaign site (again, bog-standard shit and I'm not sure why this seems new to you) to interviews on cable to articles like the one you cited.

  14. #10734
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Like, let's be real here; it's not that Biden isn't marketing, it's that Biden isn't marketing to progressives.
    He actually kind of is, reaching out to work with Bernie and Warren who will help shape his policies. The issue--for them--is that they think "all or nothing" is a valid platform. It's not.

  15. #10735
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    Obama had no issues campaigning prominently. His messaging was everywhere. You could barely turn on a televisions channel, a youtube video or a website without there being some mention about his "Hope" and "Change" campaign and all the injustices he sought to fight and rights to wrong within the USA.

    Even -if- someone is one of the rare few who goes check out Biden's campaign site, they're met with a grey blob of all his policies and ideas listed out next to each other, with none standing out more prominently like the other. If I had made a PR site like that during my marketing and publicity classes in uni I would've gotten an F.
    Once again, you are not the target demographic for Democratic messaging this electoral cycle.

    It's like the people bitching about the DNC when, as AOC correctly pointed out, the show isn't for them.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Benggaul View Post
    He actually kind of is, reaching out to work with Bernie and Warren who will help shape his policies. The issue--for them--is that they think "all or nothing" is a valid platform. It's not.
    Sorry, allow me to correct myself: He isn't marketing to the cosplay leftists like Shaun King.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  16. #10736
    Quote Originally Posted by Belize View Post
    The War on Christmas has been long and bloody, with Boomers being the largest casualty from it.
    Dearest Mother,

    My Starbucks coffee cup, was red...only red. No wreaths. No trees. No ornaments. Just red. I fear all is lost. Myself and others in the division, have hung our stockings with little care and no hope that St Nick will soon be here. Reginald, even started to believe in climate change. We rushed him to the med tent before the second stage of accepting gays, took him.
    "When Facism comes to America, it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross." - Unknown

  17. #10737
    The Insane draynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post

    Objective Truth:
    Bull Shit

    I am right because I used bold and italics
    Last edited by draynay; 2020-08-29 at 09:42 PM. Reason: needed more italicization
    /s

  18. #10738
    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    Obama had no issues campaigning prominently. His messaging was everywhere. You could barely turn on a televisions channel, a youtube video or a website without there being some mention about his "Hope" and "Change" campaign and all the injustices he sought to fight and rights to wrong within the USA.

    Even -if- someone is one of the rare few who goes check out Biden's campaign site, they're met with a grey blob of all his policies and ideas listed out next to each other, with none standing out more prominently like the other. If I had made a PR site like that during my marketing and publicity classes in uni I would've gotten an F.
    I mean, there also wasn't a pandemic so obama was also making televised speeches in front of thousands every single day. Claiming you can't or don't want to go to his website to read his policies doesn't make biden look bad, it makes you look bad. But like I said, can't fix it, no plans on it, so you do you.

    edit - also ROFL at you argueing campaign slogans like "Hope" and "Change" are what campaign policies are.
    Last edited by beanman12345; 2020-08-29 at 09:46 PM.

  19. #10739
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch-Angel of Riots View Post
    Wrong.

    If someone has to go to someone's campaign website to find a candidate's policies, then they are hard to find. It's like having to go to ground zero to find out that 9/11 happened.
    Aight. Prove it, then.

    Wrong again. Most people will not go read Biden's campaign website.
    Citation needed. You are not "most people".

    No it's not. It's bad campaigning. It makes even a site that nobody will come visit already harder to digest and read than it needs to be.
    Where is the main campaign messaging? Where are the main policies? What is Biden about? If you don't fill out those things yourself then the Republicans and Trump are going to fill those in for you. That isn't "subjective opinion", that is PR basics.
    You're not the target audience and really need to accept that, mate.

    I don't give a fuck about that. I just point out the truth as I see it.
    The term for this is called "stating my opinion", and again you really need to climb down and learn that your opinion and 'the truth' are not synonymous by default.

    And frankly, I think you are being intentionally obtuse here, because you're so desperately hoping that Biden is doing everything correct that you're unable to see where the flaws are.
    No? I'm quite willing to criticise Biden when he does stupid shit.

    What I'm not willing to do is invent shit out of whole cloth to use as criticism and then pretend that it's just 'alternative facts'.

    Objective Truth:[/B] When it comes to campaigning what Biden is about (besides being anti-Trump), Biden's campaign is failing.
    Objective Truth: Biden's main campaign message is being the anti-Trump so he is not, by definition, failing. Something that even you can't dispute as evidenced by that little disclaimer.

    Your contention is that being the anti-Trump isn't sufficient this cycle which, again, has not borne out because Bernie did not win the primary and everyone really, really needs to just get over it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  20. #10740
    lol, Typing a candidate's name and adding .com after makes finding them REALLY hard, guys!

    Fuck, the whining has gotten so stupid now.

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