1. #15121
    Quote Originally Posted by omerome View Post
    I do have a question though, and it really bothers me. The United States have three equal branches of government - Executive, Judicial, and Legislative and they should all be keeping each other in check. So, why did our constitution allow one branch to dictate the direction of another? I mean, why does the Legistlative branch have the power to tilt the influence of another branch (Judicial) if in fact, they should all be co-equal?

    How in the world could they have not seen it being used as a political weapon at some point? Or am I missing something here? I just felt that this should have been revised long time ago.
    The constitution is woefully outdated and due for a pretty hefty update, imo.

  2. #15122
    Merely a Setback cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by omerome View Post
    I do have a question though, and it really bothers me. The United States have three equal branches of government - Executive, Judicial, and Legislative and they should all be keeping each other in check. So, why did our constitution allow one branch to dictate the direction of another? I mean, why does the Legistlative branch have the power to tilt the influence of another branch (Judicial) if in fact, they should all be co-equal?

    How in the world could they have not seen it being used as a political weapon at some point? Or am I missing something here? I just felt that this should have been revised long time ago.
    The problem has come up a lot since the GOP went full fascist. The issue is that the founding fathers assumed the parties would work together, not game the system for personal power. The GOP over the last two decades has essentially ignored any kind of collegial atmosphere and gone full partisan. And unfortunately, the rules set in place didn't account for that kind of behavior.

    The Impeachment was just one example.

  3. #15123
    Quote Originally Posted by DocSavageFan View Post
    So you are linking to an opinion piece rather than the actual speech? Lets look at the actual speech

    https://www.congress.gov/congression...article/S925-7

    Now lets quote the part the above opinion piece is pointing to that seemingly allows McConnell to do what he is doing without being a hypocrite.

    One might say this is an almost unprecedented moment in the history
    of our country. It has been more than 80 years since a Supreme Court
    vacancy arose and was filled in a Presidential election year, and that
    was when the Senate majority and the President were from the same
    political party. It has been 80 years.
    Since we have divided government today, it means we have to look back
    almost 130 years to the last time a nominee was confirmed in similar
    circumstances. That was back when politicians such as mugwumps were
    debating policy like free silver and a guy named Grover ran the
    country. Think about that.
    This paragraph is doing nothing more than providing some historical context. its not actually a part of his argument.


    But what is McConnell's actual argument? back to the speech!

    Will we allow the people to
    continue deciding who will nominate the next Justice or will we empower
    a lameduck President to make that decision on his way out the door
    instead?
    This is what he is arguing against. You'll notice he makes no mention of the controlling parties anywhere in the speech or how that would impact the decision on whether or not to allow a vote. His stance is purely based on the fact that its an election year and that the President is a "lameduck" (which at that point i would argue is not true, but not really relevant at the moment.)

    The opinion piece is taking a small part of his speech and spinning the context of it to mean something it didn't. The GOP is effectively moving the goalposts so as not to seem like hypocrites playing politics, which of course they are.

  4. #15124
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    The problem has come up a lot since the GOP went full fascist. The issue is that the founding fathers assumed the parties would work together, not game the system for personal power. The GOP over the last two decades has essentially ignored any kind of collegial atmosphere and gone full partisan. And unfortunately, the rules set in place didn't account for that kind of behavior.

    The Impeachment was just one example.
    And even if they assumed this, the hero-worship some people have for the founding fathers never will be understood by me. Back then, it was clear both parties had huge divides in their beliefs so, to me, that was just a horrible miscalculation.

    It's like saying, if I leave a poison vial on a table for a week in a public park, hopefully, no one will use it.
    The MF has been impeached. Now he needs to GTFO.

  5. #15125
    Merely a Setback cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by omerome View Post
    And even if they assumed this, the hero-worship some people have for the founding fathers never will be understood by me. Back then, it was clear both parties had huge divides in their beliefs so, to me, that was just a horrible miscalculation.

    It's like saying, if I leave this poison vial on a table for a week in a public park, hopefully, no one will use it.
    The divides were always there, but the elected officials worked together to find common ground. Compromise was the water our country swam in for 200 years. The GOP has thrown that out the window, with their cult-worship of Trump and embracing ignorance/opinion over fact/science. We're now seeing conspiracy theory pushers winning GOP primaries. It feels hopeless. How do you change the course of ignorance if that ignorance is predicated on opinions are the most important position in a debate? Asimov nailed it.

    I've posted before there doesn't seem any way to fix that.

    If you look at Democratic policies, on whole, they are aimed at helping people and fixing problems. The GOP seems to have forgotten that entire concept.
    Last edited by cubby; 2020-09-22 at 03:21 PM.

  6. #15126
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    If you look at Democratic policies, on whole, they are aimed at helping people and fixing problems. The GOP seems to have forgotten that entire concept.
    Nah, they didn't forget. They're just out to hurt people and make problems.
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  7. #15127
    Pit Lord DocSavageFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shimerra View Post
    Would you like to post an actual rebuttal? I made zero claims that the senate HAS to do anything. They had every right constitutionally speaking to say no then and yes now. The issue was with their bullshit justification to block garland that McConnell gave as a free citizen and his choice to violate it now and attempt to twist his previous statement to avoid a conflict he created. That conflict and people taking issue with it is 200% the fault of conservatives. Why are you so against personal responsibility?


    What I am saying, if you actually can read it this time, is McConnell made up a bullshit rule to cover his ass and then changed it the literal second his own rule dictated he should not confirm his own party nomination and that any quibbling about the rule and which party was in power came after Trump was elected not during the Garland debacle.

    Garland actually had a history of siding with roberts, a conservative leaning judge I'll remind you, but y'all cried like Chairman Mao was nominated. Now when your comments are turned back on you rather than abide by them you squirm, lie, twist, and connive.
    You said this..."The "McConnell rule" did not initially say that. Like all conservatives when inconvenienced by a rule he made up he simply modified it it suit his needs"

    I rebutted by presenting facts which expose your statement as a lie. Your denial of the truth is sad.

    If you want to continue this...please specifically cite what McConnell changed from his initial statements in 2016.
    Last edited by DocSavageFan; 2020-09-22 at 03:26 PM.
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  8. #15128
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    The divides were always there, but the elected officials worked together to find common ground. Compromise was the water our country swam in for 200 years. The GOP has thrown that out the window, with their cult-worship of Trump and embracing ignorance/opinion over fact/science. We're now seeing conspiracy theory pushers winning GOP primaries. It feels hopeless. How do you change the course of ignorance if that ignorance is predicated on opinions are the most important position in a debate? Asimov nailed it.

    I've posted before there doesn't seem any way to fix that.

    If you look at Democratic policies, on whole, they are aimed at helping people and fixing problems. The GOP seems to have forgotten that entire concept.
    Yeah, it's definitely clear the GOP has thrown any sort of future discussions of compromise out the window when they move forward. And whoever they pick will forever be known as the judge that finally broke the Senate.

    And the sad thing is, and you hear it all the time from members of congress that despite their differences, many of them are still friends. I mean how can they still remain friends after this? That work environment was toxic before, but damn, it's got to be Chernobyl levels at this point.

    We all know that the GOP will have to (because it's designed that way), ask for a compromise for something in the future. And after everything they've done, why in the world should the Democrats even entertain them? You don't stab someone in the back, twist the knife, and then turn around and ask that same person for a favor.
    The MF has been impeached. Now he needs to GTFO.

  9. #15129
    Legendary! unfilteredJW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocSavageFan View Post
    I rebutted by presenting facts which expose your statement as a lie.
    This is a lie and can be summarily dismissed.
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    What of the pious, the pure of heart, the peaceful, the meek, the mourning, and the merciful? All doomed, all doomed

  10. #15130
    Merely a Setback cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by omerome View Post
    Yeah, it's definitely clear the GOP has thrown any sort of future discussions of compromise out the window when they move forward. And whoever they pick will forever be known as the judge that finally broke the Senate.

    And the sad thing is, and you hear it all the time from members of congress that despite their differences, many of them are still friends. I mean how can they still remain friends after this? That work environment was toxic before, but damn, it's got to be Chernobyl levels at this point.

    We all know that the GOP will have to (because it's designed that way), ask for a compromise for something in the future. And after everything they've done, why in the world should the Democrats even entertain them? You don't stab someone in the back, twist the knife, and then turn around and ask that same person for a favor.
    And the problem is the GOP made this switch to no compromise and the Democrats still clung to hope. And had it shoved down their faces with the ACA - originally a Republican proposal, as people are prone to forget.

    I sincerely hope that if the Democrats defeat the Felon-in-Office Trump and somehow take the Senate, they go full nuclear on all the issues. Statehood for D.C./P.R., SCOTUS seats, ACA on Steroids, etc. At one point we had a long list of items that need to just be rammed through in Biden's first 100 days.

  11. #15131
    Quote Originally Posted by Somewhatconcerned View Post
    Dude, the left is done in this country for the next 30 years, if not longer. No need to grandstand.
    Lol, you sound some what concerned that won’t happened....

  12. #15132
    Merely a Setback cubby's Avatar
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    Pending Government shutdown seems right up Trump's "mayhem" style. McConnell must be salivating at this kind of distraction while he rams through their SCOTUS nominee.

  13. #15133
    Quote Originally Posted by Somewhatconcerned View Post
    Dude, the left is done in this country for the next 30 years, if not longer. No need to grandstand.
    Democrats said the same thing in 2008 and you are just as big of an idiot as they were then. The pendulum always swings in this country no party holds power forever.

  14. #15134
    Quote Originally Posted by Somewhatconcerned View Post
    Dude, the left is done in this country for the next 30 years, if not longer. No need to grandstand.
    Are you just upset, because you got caught lying about being a Dwmocrat, before shilling fotlr Trump full time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

  15. #15135
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Pending Government shutdown seems right up Trump's "mayhem" style. McConnell must be salivating at this kind of distraction while he rams through their SCOTUS nominee.
    The last shut down worked so well for them

    Again utterly amazed on the republican party setting itself on fire for Trump.

  16. #15136
    Merely a Setback JohnBrown1917's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draco-Onis View Post
    Democrats said the same thing in 2008 and you are just as big of an idiot as they were then. The pendulum always swings in this country no party holds power forever.
    Unless they stack the court, they won't change anything in the next few decades.
    Quote Originally Posted by Milchshake View Post
    There’s always a lot of talk of a general strike on the left. But it’s mostly a syndicalist fantasy that “the workers” are going to rise up, which is disconnected from the fact that “the workers” are your racist uncle and jerk co-workers who you don’t like.
    Just your typical neo-liberal horseshit.

  17. #15137
    For whatever reason, the SCOTUS issue has galvanized the Democratic supporters. ActBlue has raised 160M in small donations in 3 days. Breaking every single records in the book. This will definitely be the most expensive election in history. Not a peep on the GOP side. I assume their fundraising is not doing as well.

  18. #15138
    Legendary! PresidentElectMilchschake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Somewhatconcerned View Post
    Dude, the left is done in this country for the next 30 years, if not longer. No need to grandstand.
    Hi history here! The Left has been getting screwed since like forever. Not really a surprised feeling.
    It's everyone else, who isnt a neo-confederate douchebag that should really be concerned over the next 30 years.

    The GOP senate represents about 20 million fewer americans. So it's an apartheid type problem that the court majority was selected by a minortarian group.
    Welcome to GEN-OT, have a seat, we'll introduce you to the 23-year-old who will lecture you about how Democrats didn't try hard enough to improve the ACA, and once that's all set up you'll be assigned a socialist who supported Ron Paul up to 2015 to harass you forever.
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  19. #15139
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBrown1917 View Post
    Unless they stack the court, they won't change anything in the next few decades.
    That's the thing Republicans are only thinking short term they are backing the Democrats into a corner even though they already have a majority in the court. Roberts has given them everything except the extreme.

  20. #15140
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    For whatever reason, the SCOTUS issue has galvanized the Democratic supporters. ActBlue has raised 160M in small donations in 3 days. Breaking every single records in the book. This will definitely be the most expensive election in history. Not a peep on the GOP side. I assume their fundraising is not doing as well.
    Good. I hope to see attack ads on every commercial break. If I have to deal with a commercial, let it be to show the country what lying POS the GOP are.

    I want the Democrats to stay on the offensive and contrast that with fixing what's broken. Make November 3 - Take out the Trash Day.
    The MF has been impeached. Now he needs to GTFO.

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