Shadowlands DOES come with an ilevel

[Darknessvamp]

So I'm guessing we're going to have the WoD issues again real soon after release then.

[Synical123]

Please explain how the numbers you hit for make the game magically change into an entirely different type of game.

Please explain why you attempting to put words in my mouth I didn’t say. I never said the numbers alone made it a completely different game. I simply explained why I prefer lower numbers

[Thagrynor]

I think they already have coefficients added. I remember that when they did the other squishes they had to tune older content a bit. I believe they already have stuff set that that says "MC is 400% buff, Black temple 325" etc etc (numbers pulled out of my ass of course). So I think it will be done so all previous raids scale appropriately for lvl 50's.

Funny enough, shortly after I posted the above, they apparently posted about it. I am wondering if they will do "more than 5 levels over" given the level "equivalence" they mentioned. Guess we will have to wait and see!

[Revamp Man]

Yes, let's compare the current game to the iteration 15 years ago, what could go wrong?

Maybe that we have 4 difficulties that ain't going anywhere soon is a thing? or that the whole fucking item structure is different since nearly a decade? hmm...

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You can't make every item a trinket or trinket like though (over saturation) and we still have 4 difficulties.
Getting Pants that have 15~% more power after a few months of the same raid just feels better than 5%...

I'd go as crazy as to say that with the current nonexistance of set tiers i'd go with more than the 15 ilvl jump usual from raid to raid, 20-25 would feel even better.

You don’t have to make every piece like a trinket but sets like the BoD sword and ring was great
Mechagon rings

Make secondary stats stronger and buff the primary

The problem is more gaps and bigger differences means more squish required

[PenguinChan]

I wonder if they're going to keep doing this with every expansion going forward? 9.0 brings a stat, level and ilvl squish. 10.0 brings a level squish, and you go back to 50. 11.0 does what 9.0 did? I'm very curious to see how this continues.

[Beefhammer]

What? I had like 5k or something on my paladin and I wasn't a tank.

Like I said it's ben 13-15 since I was in Vanilla. Like I remember shit like HP totals from that long ago. My only concern was making sure green bars stayed full.

[TheLucky1]

The problem is more gaps and bigger differences means more squish required

Is it a problem though? I think the past showed that 99% of the players don't care after playing a few hours with the new numbers, makes sense too since the only thing you interact and "feel" with while in the open world is how fast you deplete the HP bar from the mob you currently target.

[MrLachyG]

How can you have a level squish and not have a stat & ilvl squish to go along with it?

It only makes sense that if a level squish happens the other 2 as well.

Sorry you lost your numb3rs.

I mean you can do a level squish and an ilvl squish without affecting the stats. they just chose not to go that route

[Venziir]

So I raised a few months ago that with the level squish there would also be an item level and stat squish. At the time a LOT of people resoundly rejected this as it wasn't stated directly by Blizzard.

Thought I would add this here as it has not been mentioned but we ARE getting an ilvl squish and from the looks of it a stat squish as well (sloots live stream ATM shows a Lvl51 in plate with 16,000 health)

https://www.wowhead.com/news=311945/...squish-details

... Well obviously it does, you can't do a level squish without an ilevel and stat squish.

[Duroga]

ilvl squish is good an all but we still need an outright numbers squish too. At least in my opinion. I'd love to see this expansion have tank HPs be around 2k.

This is utter bullshit. You d'ont know what you are talking about.
2k HP for a tank and what 600HP for a mage?
This means every levelup gives you what 10 HP?
So if you get a new Item that has 10 itemlevel more, gives you about 10 HP more.
So the difference between an Item from Leveling and from the first raid would be allmost meeningless.

No,No,No

The more I read about Shadowlands the more I don't like it.
WF/TF gone, Corruption gone, azerit traits gone, essences gone, emmisarys gone, less loot.
So boring.

Ability pruning has been changed into gear pruning.

Its like classic 2.0 and I hate classic from the bottom of my heart.

[Caaethil]

Thanks for this, it's the first time someone has linked me what they said.

That is extremely bad wording on blizzards part. Technically they are correct in that we are "just as powerful" as we are now, so they haven't lied bacause everything number wise is also going down, but that is so wooly as an answer I can see why people thought there wouldn't be a stat squish.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OHDAwg-Tw4

Skip to 19:30 - he explicitly states there will be no stat squish. "This isn't like a number's squish or anything like that."

Just to be clear: I'm happy they changed their minds and are doing a stat squish. I don't think they lied or anything like that. They changed their minds and made a better decision in the end imo. I'm just clarifying that the people who are surprised by the stat squish are 100% remembering correctly that Blizzard said it wouldn't happen.

[shise]

ilvl squish is good an all but we still need an outright numbers squish too. At least in my opinion. I'd love to see this expansion have tank HPs be around 2k.

TBC was perfect. Everyone ended up around 10-11K, tanks were on 22K on raids.

We could even go to WotLK numbers, to make it easier. Remember that we have many expansions in between now and then..

[Lefrog]

Sounds to me like they are turning all previous expansions into a parallel experience, which fixes any issues with stat squishing moving forward, because you will only ever need a drastic power level increase between an old expansion and the current.

You no longer need an HP difference between WotLK and Warlords bosses. They will be the same and soloable by anyone in the Shadowlands ilvl range. This allows them to bump SL down to a "precious xpac" stat lvl when a new expansion comes out and not worry about power creep due to trying to scale stats through 10+ expansions.

[fear]

... Well obviously it does, you can't do a level squish without an ilevel and stat squish.

You can and they originally didn't do anything but a lvl squish http://youtu.be/qXQ-uyotkfw?t=871

[Revamp Man]

Is it a problem though? I think the past showed that 99% of the players don't care after playing a few hours with the new numbers, makes sense too since the only thing you interact and "feel" with while in the open world is how fast you deplete the HP bar from the mob you currently target.

The only problem I have with it is when they talk about how they don’t know how to solve the problem of having a level squish when in reality the way to solve the problem is to stop the goddamn power leap that we experience every expansion

I’m actually surprised that we only went 100 item levels this time

But yeah personally I don’t see the number squishes a problem I just see the fact that the next patch will invalidate all of the content that you’ve been running and you never have to come back to do content if that makes sense so you’ll never have to run the first Raid once the second rate is out and eventually a heroic dungeon will reward better gear than mythic of the entire first tier

[dewd]

squishes feel horrible. its like every expansion is like a diablo season where i start from new with shit numbers and work my way to slightly less shit numbers