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  1. #41
    Old God Mirishka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by willtron View Post
    Only stance to bring back is Gladiator Stance.
    Amen.

    /10char
    My greatest fear is that one day, my MMO-Champion ignore list will run out of space.

  2. #42
    I played arms warrior in Cata when stance dancing was still a thing. If I remember correctly I made a bunch of macros and then forgot about stances mostly. I admit it was fun figuring it all out. It felt good when I had it all set up properly. But it did nothing for me gameplay-wise.

  3. #43
    I've changed my password and logged into this account after probably 5 or 6 years just so I can express my total disgust over just thinking about those times, when warrior had to stance dance. It was the most annoying class mechanic, that I've encountered in 15 years of playing warrior and I've quit my warrior for 2 years because of it and returned to playing him only, after they removed this cancerous, fun killing, disgusting mechanic.

    Blizzard should in no way or form ever bring stances back, maybe only as a buff, not limiting abilities! Bad idea..baaaad!

  4. #44
    Herald of the Titans Jazzhands's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    I like the idea of stances yes. I liked the spec alot more back then.
    I also liked seal twisting in wod and felt rewarding.

    Seems you are just not a fan of it, thats cool.
    I actually just think it's done poorly in WoW. Plenty of games have stances, for tank classes especially to give them more damage by giving up defense, but the way Warrior stances worked in Vanilla was just awful. I don't see what's fun about empty GCDs or not having access to certain tools when in certain stances. It worked in Vanilla because the game was incredibly slow to begin with, and I can see how one might enjoy it back then, but I absolutely cannot see how anyone would want them back in this age of the game, they'd have to be so neutered that they might as well simply not exist, otherwise Warriors as a whole would basically be worthless in every bit of content. The drawbacks of stances Vanilla style would make warriors obsolete to any other full class that didn't have to stance dance just to charge or interrupt.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzhands View Post
    I actually just think it's done poorly in WoW. Plenty of games have stances, for tank classes especially to give them more damage by giving up defense, but the way Warrior stances worked in Vanilla was just awful. I don't see what's fun about empty GCDs or not having access to certain tools when in certain stances. It worked in Vanilla because the game was incredibly slow to begin with, and I can see how one might enjoy it back then, but I absolutely cannot see how anyone would want them back in this age of the game, they'd have to be so neutered that they might as well simply not exist, otherwise Warriors as a whole would basically be worthless in every bit of content. The drawbacks of stances Vanilla style would make warriors obsolete to any other full class that didn't have to stance dance just to charge or interrupt.
    I get that, the thing is.. when we first were introduced to stances was in 2004 my man.
    Its 2020, they can work around all of the issues you call out and make it a fun experience, its about the actual gameplay people want to see make a return and any small bits that feel outdated can be fixed. The core stays the same, if you dont like that.. maybe a class without will be a better fit for you. I hope it will make a return, its one of those things to seperate the good player vs the bad imo.

    To each their own in the end.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    Amen.

    /10char
    Ye that was cool as well... read somewhere they didnt like specs in specs such as shadow priest became shadow mages in wod because of 1 talent.

    But I am all for it, but I would say make it a fourth stance if specced in it. Or replace battle with gladiator and leave dev stance as a quick help type of thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FFLover View Post
    I've changed my password and logged into this account after probably 5 or 6 years just so I can express my total disgust over just thinking about those times, when warrior had to stance dance. It was the most annoying class mechanic, that I've encountered in 15 years of playing warrior and I've quit my warrior for 2 years because of it and returned to playing him only, after they removed this cancerous, fun killing, disgusting mechanic.

    Blizzard should in no way or form ever bring stances back, maybe only as a buff, not limiting abilities! Bad idea..baaaad!
    That was its core.. you hate it reroll. Simple as that.

    Making stances a talent will not work.. because its either to good or just bad. Same with seals for ret in wod.
    Fun times imo.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Arkthugal View Post
    Said no warrior, ever.
    Well, the only Warriors that don't want it back are the failures of their class, or the ones that have a problem with their Eye–hand coordination, you need to be decent at playing a Warrior to be able to stance dance.

  7. #47
    Herald of the Titans Jazzhands's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    I get that, the thing is.. when we first were introduced to stances was in 2004 my man.
    Its 2020, they can work around all of the issues you call out and make it a fun experience, its about the actual gameplay people want to see make a return and any small bits that feel outdated can be fixed. The core stays the same, if you dont like that.. maybe a class without will be a better fit for you. I hope it will make a return, its one of those things to seperate the good player vs the bad imo.
    I'm genuinely curious how could they bring them back, still have them feel like Vanilla, and still be balanced to the point where warriors aren't useless? You seem to have something in mind if you think this is possible.

    The thing is, it's not a matter of them being fun or not. Each stance has to have specific tools and benefits/negatives, not to mention rage loss when swapping. This is the reason they can't work anymore, the game is too focused on balance. A tank that has to lose defensive capability and resources just to use certain utility will never be brought to M+ or a raid unless they're OP, in which case they make other classes obsolete, which we can't have. If they don't have specific tools or upsides/downsides, then why ever swap specs? Without specific tools, they're just DK presences, which they removed because they were uninteresting and 98% of the population used one presence per spec and that was it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dunhildas View Post
    Well, the only Warriors that don't want it back are the failures of their class, or the ones that have a problem with their Eye–hand coordination, you need to be decent at playing a Warrior to be able to stance dance.
    I really hope this is a joke. "Stance Dancing" literally just meant having to act when a timer has 2 seconds left instead of .5, and there are incredibly few situations where it's actually even needed. Edit: It's not even that. I mixed up how GCDs and stances worked. You literally just macro the ability together, and just swap back after, or with another macro/ability! Basically, you could use macros to ignore stances existed. Very difficult stuff.

    Maybe in PVP, but we all know Classic PVP was a joke, especially for a warrior, they could sneeze and half the classes in the game fell over.
    Last edited by Jazzhands; 2020-04-18 at 12:28 PM.

  8. #48
    Yeah...just reroll..ideal solution....I'd switch to hunter long time ago, if they made achievements BoA...but as long as they force me to play one char just so I don't lose progress on dozens of achievements, I have to stick with my class and hope that some "clever" designer doesn't have this amazing idea to put extra GCD on top of already existing flawed GCD changes from BfA... It literally does nothing except makes class way more clunky due to usage of macros for every spell... As it was already said, only stance to be brought back, should be Gladiator stance, which actually brought something extra and fun to class instead of inhibiting fun and enjoyment from class...

  9. #49
    Legendary! Ealyssa's Avatar
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    Stance dance is just loosing your rage when you cast a macro spell. No depth, just stupid. But not surprised stupid liking stupid gameplay...
    Quote Originally Posted by primalmatter View Post
    nazi is not the abbreviation of national socialism....
    When googling 4 letters is asking too much fact-checking.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzhands View Post
    I'm genuinely curious how could they bring them back, still have them feel like Vanilla, and still be balanced to the point where warriors aren't useless? You seem to have something in mind if you think this is possible.

    The thing is, it's not a matter of them being fun or not. Each stance has to have specific tools and benefits/negatives, not to mention rage loss when swapping. This is the reason they can't work anymore, the game is too focused on balance. A tank that has to lose defensive capability and resources just to use certain utility will never be brought to M+ or a raid unless they're OP, in which case they make other classes obsolete, which we can't have. If they don't have specific tools or upsides/downsides, then why ever swap specs? Without specific tools, they're just DK presences, which they removed because they were uninteresting and 98% of the population used one presence per spec and that was it.

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    I really hope this is a joke. "Stance Dancing" literally just meant having to act when a timer has 2 seconds left instead of .5, and there are incredibly few situations where it's actually even needed.

    Maybe in PVP, but we all know Classic PVP was a joke, especially for a warrior, they could sneeze and half the classes in the game fell over.
    Once again.. you call out minor points why it didint work in your opinion that can be fixed easily.
    Gcd on swapping and rage loss when swapping are qol changes I would like to see to make swapping feel good.
    To give an example of seal twisting, when you judged the target withbthe haste seal, swapping instantly became so much easier. So fixing the gcd on it will 100% make it feel much smoother.

    You make it seem harder then it actually is, benefits should pretty much the same, as in battle= damage, dev= defence. Numbers are not important here. The 20% dr worked out well so.

    Once again it just falls down to you like the stance idea or not, which you clearly dont like.

    Pressences were flavor for dks and aas fittting nicely, they did a bad job at balancing those. They left them fairly untouched throughout wrath and only made a couple of changes in all these years. Frost and unholy were using blood pressence at first to begin with. Dks should just have 1 pressence per spec and not try to immitate a warrior.

  11. #51
    Stances were the worst thing a warrior had.. Hope they never bring them back.

  12. #52
    I am Murloc!
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    Blizzard does not read these forums.

    If you want a chance of them hearing you twitter or reddit is the place to go.
    They most certainly do.

  13. #53
    Herald of the Titans Jazzhands's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Once again.. you call out minor points why it didint work in your opinion that can be fixed easily.
    Gcd on swapping and rage loss when swapping are qol changes I would like to see to make swapping feel good.
    To give an example of seal twisting, when you judged the target withbthe haste seal, swapping instantly became so much easier. So fixing the gcd on it will 100% make it feel much smoother.

    You make it seem harder then it actually is, benefits should pretty much the same, as in battle= damage, dev= defence. Numbers are not important here. The 20% dr worked out well so.

    Once again it just falls down to you like the stance idea or not, which you clearly dont like.

    Pressences were flavor for dks and aas fittting nicely, they did a bad job at balancing those. They left them fairly untouched throughout wrath and only made a couple of changes in all these years. Frost and unholy were using blood pressence at first to begin with. Dks should just have 1 pressence per spec and not try to immitate a warrior.
    They really, really are. This game is built around balance. Not everyone plays at the top end, bust most try to emulate it, if the top end says warriors are bad the class gets shunned. Look at Shamans, even when Elemental was really strong people were still hesitant, simply because of the reputation that had carried over from when they were completely shunned from M+ and raids because they were decent but not top 3-10 (depending on spec).

    The only reason I'm making it seem harder than it is, is that I'm trying to consider all the things a Dev team would need to consider instead of ignoring huge chunks of the game. Devs cannot ignore numbers, balance is incredibly important.

    The GCD and rage loss were a big part of them, as were the positive AND negative stats, and the utility limitations (Probably the most impactful thing about stances) was a way to balance the class as a whole. Thing is, If utility is limited in a way that forces you to lower your defensive capabilities to access it, Warrior tanks are basically dead in the water for M+/raids, because no other tank needs to do this. If defensive stance gives any defensive value, then leaving it removes said value, and creates a vulnerability no tank has to work around. So, can't limit utility, which removes the need to ever stance swap, which just makes them presences, which... you get my point, I hope. There's nothing wrong with liking them and wanting them back, we're all free to our opinions, but they were removed for a reason. They just don't wouldn't fit in the game, at least not how they actually use to be. They could make them passive buffs like paladin auras or something, but those aren't stances anymore.

    Edit: Funny thing, I actually got myself mixed up on how GCDs and stances worked. Stance swapping doesn't trigger ability GCDs, but abilities trigger stance GCD, thus my confusion as it's been many many years. With that being the case, Stance dancing is literally just making macros just like people did in Vanilla. Much difficulty.
    Last edited by Jazzhands; 2020-04-18 at 12:23 PM.

  14. #54
    The Lightbringer Adramalech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunhildas View Post
    Well, the only Warriors that don't want it back are the failures of their class, or the ones that have a problem with their Eye–hand coordination, you need to be decent at playing a Warrior to be able to stance dance.
    You can't be serious. You just macro'd stances to relevant abilities and forgot they existed.

    Is this really the type of gameplay people want back?
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    As a warlock, allow me to be the first to say that I get tremendous amounts of joy from watching fear pathing take you to Africa.
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    Twinking is like going back to school when you are 30, just to be smarter than the other kids.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by vexxan View Post
    Hi!

    One of the most fun aspects of playing warrior in classic is (imho) swapping around between stances. This creates depth and you can enjoy the different aspects of being a warrior.

    • Charge in and rend up your targets.
    • An incoming healer joining the fight? Berserker and intercept.
    • Oh, two rogues attacking? Better use my sword+board macro and swap to defensive.
    • The bastard rogue dodged? No worries. Back to battle stance.

    Am I alone loving this and hoping it will return in Shadowlands (even tho it's not mentioned in the upcoming changes...)?

    /vexxan
    Stance dancing is garbage. It barely worked in vanilla, because of the slow gameplay and the few buttons you had anyways. Otherwise, even in vanilla, people would just macro them together with spells, so it's become totally useless. There is no bad or good stance dancing either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Laqweeta View Post
    Unfortunately the majority of the game's population are just too mentally ineffective to stance dance
    Stance dancing was the most brain dead mechanic of playing a warrior. You'd literally macro it and never think about it again. Look in the mirror pls lol

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertMugabe View Post
    Stance dancing is garbage. It barely worked in vanilla, because of the slow gameplay and the few buttons you had anyways. Otherwise, even in vanilla, people would just macro them together with spells, so it's become totally useless. There is no bad or good stance dancing either.

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    Stance dancing was the most brain dead mechanic of playing a warrior. You'd literally macro it and never think about it again. Look in the mirror pls lol
    Never played Vanilla, TBC, WotLK or Cata confirmed.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Laqweeta View Post
    Never played Vanilla, TBC, WotLK or Cata confirmed.
    Stance dancing is a terrible and braindead mechanic, because you would simply macro it all together and never again think about them. People like you who think it required skill where probably children back in these expansions and don't know better, otherwise I can't explain what any of this has to do with good or bad players.

    Nothing else has to be said about this, since you don't provide any arguments anyways and just continue to feel triggered lmao

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Once again.. you call out minor points why it didint work in your opinion that can be fixed easily.
    Gcd on swapping and rage loss when swapping are qol changes I would like to see to make swapping feel good.
    To give an example of seal twisting, when you judged the target withbthe haste seal, swapping instantly became so much easier. So fixing the gcd on it will 100% make it feel much smoother.

    You make it seem harder then it actually is, benefits should pretty much the same, as in battle= damage, dev= defence. Numbers are not important here. The 20% dr worked out well so.

    Once again it just falls down to you like the stance idea or not, which you clearly dont like.

    Pressences were flavor for dks and aas fittting nicely, they did a bad job at balancing those. They left them fairly untouched throughout wrath and only made a couple of changes in all these years. Frost and unholy were using blood pressence at first to begin with. Dks should just have 1 pressence per spec and not try to immitate a warrior.
    Without a gcd or rage lost, all it would come down to is macro which is the best stance for each ability. Basically what we have now. Stance dancing was great in vanilla because all the other class/specs were boring using 1 or 2 buttons at the most while they waited for their 2/3 minute cool downs. Warrior was the only class (maybe shaman, played alliance back then so no idea) that took a minimum number brain cells to play. Get on classic and try warrior and you quickly find out as I did they are not hard to play at all anymore. Current classes (not all but quite a few) have as much depth to play as vanilla warrior did without the clunkiness of needing 2 gcd just to use one ability.

    Aka: warrior was the only class that got it right in vanilla, now others have caught up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruargh
    I'm baffled that something this simple can be so hard for some people... I guess we can't blame blizzard for dumbing down the game any longer, because apparently it very much needed :

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertMugabe View Post
    Stance dancing is a terrible and braindead mechanic, because you would simply macro it all together and never again think about them. People like you who think it required skill where probably children back in these expansions and don't know better, otherwise I can't explain what any of this has to do with good or bad players.

    Nothing else has to be said about this, since you don't provide any arguments anyways and just continue to feel triggered lmao
    I'm not triggered, you're just proving you have absolutely NO clue what you're talking about c:

  20. #60
    No. /10chars

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