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  1. #21
    Titan Maxilian's Avatar
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    I think that he did what he had to, though that event gave him the notion of "The end justify the means", making he do a lot of shitty things in Nothrend.

    -Lying to his people
    -Betraying and massacring a group of mercenaries
    -Sacrificing an old friend for the sake of power

  2. #22
    It was the right pragmatic choice, the problem are his choices afterwards, making this decision entirely worthless.

  3. #23
    The only thing Arthas did wrong in that situation is his very emotional approach. He should have explained the situation further, after all Jaina and Uther weren't some random dumbasses. Instead he instantly lashed out at his superior.

    Arthas: Glad you could make it, Uther.
    Uther: Watch your tone with me, boy. You may be the prince, but I'm still your superior as a paladin.
    Arthas: As if I could forget. Listen, Uther, there's something about the plague you should know. Oh no. It's too late. These people have all been infected. They may look fine now, but it's a matter of time before they turn into the undead.
    Uther: What?
    Arthas: This entire city must be purged.
    Uther: How can you even consider that? There's got to be some other way!
    Arthas: Damn it, Uther. As your future king, I order you to purge this city.
    Uther: You are not my king yet, boy. Nor would I obey that command if you were!
    Arthas: Then I must consider this an act of treason.
    Uther: Treason? Have you lost your mind, Arthas?
    Arthas: Have I? Lord Uther, by my right of succession and sovereignty of my crown, I hereby relieve you from your command and suspend your paladins from service.
    Jaina: Arthas, you can't just...
    Arthas: It's done! Those of you who have the will to save this land, follow me. The rest of you... get out of my sight.
    Uther: You've just crossed a terrible threshold, Arthas.
    Arthas: Jaina?
    Jaina: I'm sorry, Arthas. I can't watch you do this.

    So let's see. At this very moment, Arthas' knowledge about the state of the city was greater than Uther's. He instantly goes from "We need to talk" to "Let's kill them all". Uther is shocked by the very idea. Note that at this moment he's not yet against it, he's just shocked, partialy because of what's going on in Stratholme and partialy by the fact his Prince has just got an idea to kill everyone within the city.
    Instead of talking (and don't even start with the "there was no time", a few minutes more wouldn't have mattered at all), Arthas throws his fit like a child. As a "future king" he holds no command, and within the order Uther was his superior. Arthas sounds angry, shows disrespect towards Uther and calls forth command powers which simply do not exist. At this point Uther loses his patience. Arthas behaviour causes the importance of Stratholme situation diminish, and instead shows Arthas as a psycho.

    All that was needed was maturity and talk. I have no doubts Uther would agree on the plan if he had the same knowledge about the situation as Arthas did. But he just arrived and Arthas instantly demands he purges a city full of innocent people. One could think it was Arthas who's got corrupted.

  4. #24
    Bloodsail Admiral Ardenaso's Avatar
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    Speaking of the "right thing", has anyone played the Scourge of Lordaeron Enhanced? There's an alternate ending in The Culling if you cured the civilians instead of killing them
    Lightbound Orcs > High Elves https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...ace-suggestion

    Blizzard should realize that Alteraci Humans will fulfill the Young Adult Dystopia Anarchy fantasy for Warcraft

  5. #25
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    Speaking of the "right thing", has anyone played the Scourge of Lordaeron Enhanced? There's an alternate ending in The Culling if you cured the civilians instead of killing them
    Non-canonical due to the fact that, at this time in the Warcraft universe, the Plague of Undeath had no cure - once you contracted it undeath and slavery to the Lich King was a given.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Nachtigal View Post
    Ha, weeb. They always find a way to bring some Japanese sounding shit somewhere completely unnecessary

    Infracted.
    Except for the fact that Kobayashi Maru has nothing to do with anime. It's from Star Trek and was a training exercise that was designed to be unwinnable.

  7. #27
    Legendary! Soon-TM's Avatar
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    The Culling of Stratholme must be one of the (very) few actually morally grey episodes in Warcraft.
    Quote Originally Posted by Danuser
    we created a story structure for Sylvanas that, on the surface, echoed many broad strokes of the road Garrosh took (...). These parallels were intentional. But it's within the nuance that we sought to show the story grow and change.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    BFA was about as nuanced as a golf club to the testicles/ovaries.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    Speaking of the "right thing", has anyone played the Scourge of Lordaeron Enhanced? There's an alternate ending in The Culling if you cured the civilians instead of killing them
    Isn't that a fanmade campaign?
    One shot, one kill. This is how I preserve my realm.

  9. #29
    Stratholme was sorta a lose/lose situation, anything after the purge was wrong though, everything from hiring mercs to prevent his soldiers from going home, thus dooming the entire expedition, to picking up frostmourne and leaving Muradin for death was definitely the wrong thing.

  10. #30
    The whole point is he got shit on by everyone for doing the right thing. That's what drove him to be desperate (and isolated) enough to do the wrong thing during his Northrend campaign.

  11. #31
    The Lightbringer SinR's Avatar
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    Arthas did the right thing as its been mentioned many times before.
    We're all newbs, some are just more newbier than others.

    Just a burned out hardcore raider turned casual.
    No Shadowlands Alpha. No Fucks Given.
    Wait... I'm SUPPOSED to be angry at No Alpha???

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Malganis was already inside the city and turning the citizens into undead, quarantine would have never worked on time or would have saved so few people at the cost of so many men that it would not have been worth it.

    Of course even if he did the "right" thing, morally his actions were wrong, since it is mass murder. That is why the Culling of Stratholme is a good example of a morally grey event… unlike other, more recent events.
    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    The Culling of Stratholme must be one of the (very) few actually morally grey episodes in Warcraft.
    I don't even consider it morally grey. The second they are infected in this way they become an enemy. They are no longer people. They are enemy combatants waiting to hatch. Any sympathy is simply holding on to memories that are no longer relevant.

  13. #33
    The Lightbringer SinR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WintersLegion View Post
    Except for the fact that Kobayashi Maru has nothing to do with anime. It's from Star Trek and was a training exercise that was designed to be unwinnable.
    until Kirk Hacked it and actually got commended for it

    and then Kirk hacked it and got reprimanded by Spock
    We're all newbs, some are just more newbier than others.

    Just a burned out hardcore raider turned casual.
    No Shadowlands Alpha. No Fucks Given.
    Wait... I'm SUPPOSED to be angry at No Alpha???

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    That is why the Culling of Stratholme is a good example of a morally grey event… unlike other, more recent events.
    What could he possibly mean by this?


    OT: even though I think it was justified in a vacuum since otherwise the outcome would have been much more disastrous for Lordaeron, it was ultimately what broke Arthas, severed his connection to the Light, isolated him from his friends and drove him towards a path of retribution that ended up killing him and pretty much all of the Kingdom of Lordaeron.
    Last edited by Nerovar; 2020-04-24 at 08:02 PM.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnusthegreat View Post
    I don't even consider it morally grey. The second they are infected in this way they become an enemy. They are no longer people. They are enemy combatants waiting to hatch. Any sympathy is simply holding on to memories that are no longer relevant.
    It's still portrayed in a morally grey way though. Just look at this official artwork:



    Yes, they were monsters at that point, but they really didn't do anything wrong and were pretty much victims of a demon. Arthas had innocent blood on his hands, and that can't be ignored.
    One shot, one kill. This is how I preserve my realm.

  16. #36
    weird, 10 years ago this forum would be mostly on about how wrong Arthas was to purge Stratholme, now it's in agreement that he did the right thing.

    Arthas did the right thing, he made a hard decision while others refused and if he did the same, more would have died. Dalaran would not have been able to quarantine the plague, everyone would have already been dead by the time they acted and it would have already spread to other parts of Lordaeron.

    Imagine if Arthas, Jaina and Uther didn't abandon him and afterwards with an army aided by knights and mages went after Malganis and just kicked the shit out of him and the Scourge and then laid siege to Icecrown...

    Another thought, if the mages would have been so quick to quarantine, where the hell were they this whole time? Most of the north is being attacked by undead and they didn't hear any word of this? Don't have any mages in any of these towns or cities?? xD

  17. #37
    I am Murloc! Dellis0991's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oplawlz View Post
    Arthas was always the good guy.
    After Stratholme he wasn't.....he had so many chances to take his ass home and not fuck with that blade...

  18. #38
    Bloodsail Admiral Ardenaso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Isn't that a fanmade campaign?
    Well yes though I'm not sure if the author had sources about the plague being curable or not on the time his campaign was conceived

    - - - Updated - - -

    Speaking of, I still haven't seen a single Blood Elf/High Elf/Dark Ranger who can recall being in the 1st Legion or in the Culling that time.
    Lightbound Orcs > High Elves https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...ace-suggestion

    Blizzard should realize that Alteraci Humans will fulfill the Young Adult Dystopia Anarchy fantasy for Warcraft

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Ardenaso View Post
    Well yes though I'm not sure if the author had sources about the plague being curable or not on the time his campaign was conceived

    - - - Updated - - -

    Speaking of, I still haven't seen a single Blood Elf/High Elf/Dark Ranger who can recall being in the 1st Legion or in the Culling that time.
    But it's a fanmade campaign, so it doesn't matter if there's an AU where the quarantine worked.
    One shot, one kill. This is how I preserve my realm.

  20. #40
    Yes, of course. What Arthas did was objective right. His plan and execution of it were sound.
    Last edited by Fetus Rex; 2020-04-25 at 03:39 PM.

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