Datamined race intros shows Blizz set on whitewashing Horde.

[Stormdash]

"Horde faction text in character creator?: You are a soldier of the mighty Horde, a diverse band of races from across Azeroth who fight for freedom and honor."

That's what I signed up for in 2009 *shrug*

[VooDsXo]

...

The thread is not about genocide, or even the faction conflict. Return to the actual topic at hand as opposed to these derailing tangents.

No actually this is not anything to do w/ whitewashing at all LMFAO you literally just threw that in there. Retcon would be the word we use in fantasy media. Also, no the scourge who were free'd from the power of the lich king did not seek to make more.

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"Horde faction text in character creator?: You are a soldier of the mighty Horde, a diverse band of races from across Azeroth who fight for freedom and honor."

That's what I signed up for in 2009 *shrug*

Yeah, he is throwing the old horde under Gul'dans rule and the old Scourge under the Lich kings rule...smh

[Kithelle]

Most of them are honest enough...the Undead one is odd though

[Omedon]

Who reboots aspects of a mmo's story for an expansion? Neurotic fucking blizzard need to get real. It won't see any more big influxes of new players. They've gained way too much notoriety so they should focus on servicing the loyal customers they already have. But they're loyal and keeps paying, so who cares about them, right?

I honestly and literally think Blizz and WoW are perfectly ok with losing any and all customers/players for whom "we aren't cast as dicks in the lore? I signed on to be a dick! It's my right to be a villainous dick in this multiplayer game" is a deal breaker. I'm not even speaking hyperbolically, that's literally an angle that can be seen as countering toxicity, something that is MUCH more of a big deal to the bottom line, in this day an age than it was at WoW's founding.

[Kuja]

So horde are now the good guys? Not that alliance has been any more good, lol.

[Shadowferal]

On one hand I can understand the criticism here.
But I...I think when Taran Zhu decried the faction business as nothing but a race war, that seemed to me the most mature thing any NPC ever said.
And I thought then that maybe the higher the level, the less "hated" by the other faction, to reflect "growing up." I mean a night elf will never stroll through Undercity, or a forsaken wander into Darnassus without some sort of challenge, but neither should be KOA either.

Too much?

ow...okay okay...

[Saltysquidoon]

I'm not even speaking hyperbolically, that's literally an angle that can be seen as countering toxicity, something that is MUCH more of a big deal, to the bottom line, in this day an age than it was at WoW's founding.

Who even cares about 'toxicity' (wasn't Riot Lyte a sex offender or something) in wow? Who talks to people outside of their guild in WoW?



On topic, I don't think enough is being made about how weirdly Orwellian this shit is, it's like some sort of psy-op test. Not do new players do this but they can't do old expansions (and thus be exposed to the forsaken's comical evil) and they're removing references to the war caused by the forsaken.
It's creepy honestly.

[Stormwolf64]

Who even cares about 'toxicity' (wasn't Riot Lyte a sex offender or something) in wow? Who talks to people outside of their guild in WoW?



On topic, I don't think enough is being made about how weirdly Orwellian this shit is, it's like some sort of psy-op test. Not do new players do this but they can't do old expansions (and thus be exposed to the forsaken's comical evil) and they're removing references to the war caused by the forsaken.
It's creepy honestly.

Blizzard being blizzard. They can't help themselves making terrible decisions. This is actually a very valid reason to walk out and shut the door behind you.

[Feanoro]

The problem is that in the current setup, you can please neither Saurfang's honourbros, who got their hero killed and a farce of "council" set up instead of the iconic post of warchief, nor Sylvanas' murderbros, who thought they could finally play a fully evil faction until the deep end. Btw, not even Ally players can be happy with the current story, unless you are one of those Anduin groupies laying around.

Oh I realize that. As soon as they showed the artwork of Teldrassil burning, I knew they couldn't end it without pissing off most people.

[Malikath]

That is NOT what whitewashing means in modern times.

No, that's what it means, it's just not what it means to YOU.

[Jinpachi]

It does. For like, 120 members of the horde or something. Those that revelled with him. But that was a tiny, tiny , insignificant minority.

until after the mok'gora. then it was the ENTIRE horde

[NED funded]

I don't quite like this tbh. Like half the fantasy of the horde is that you get to play the more ambiguous races to say the least. Kinda like a pirate fantasy where you are told that you are a pirate but you are not one of THOSE pirates of the past you are a good pirate. It takes away from the fantasy associated to the horde, but others might not see it that way so its not that big of a deal

[Ianus]

Humans: Your people have a history of throwing outsiders in concentration camps and making them fight each other for sport. Your leaders have attempted genocide, and repeatedly ignored warnings about impending disaster.

OH WAIT it doesn't actually say that, does it.

i would also do that if someone tried that on me 2 times

[Cathfaern]

And you go right into BFA.... Did Sylvanas burn the tree or commit a massacre in Legion? Nope. All those events are in BFA.

Those are in the BfA pre-event which is not available anymore. The new player starting zone also don't mention these. They also removed Battle for Lordaeron, and changed the text to why people go to Kul'Tiras. So practically a new player will know nothing about these events.

[RH92]

Even though I absolutely hate it, it makes a sense.

How else are you going to justify Horde existing in the first place? Recently I finally leveled my Alliance character and it left me wondering, Allies received enormous power creep with every fucking new ally - all the advanced technology and overpowered leaders.

Horde is just fucked up, destroyed by all recent war efforts against the world threats and two civil wars. There is no option in this game anymore, you either play Alliance or shameful Alliance lapdogs. So pick your poison I guess.

[qwerty123456]

rather you want to count the viking as humans or not it doesn't change that they aren't native's of azeroth they are only there because of the titans.

its also due to them hanging out with the mogu and being around before the curse of flesh that it seems likely that they would have some kind of knowledge on where the curse of flesh races came form.

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even if she does it kinda counteracts these openings.

Actually they are native to Azeroth as they were created on Azeroth and from Azeroth's crust. Would you consider Dragons or Goblins non-native as they were created from stuff on Azeroth as well?(although in both cases it was creature on the planet not from the planet itself)

Are the Aqir not native to Azeroth? Pretty much everything that exists on Azeroth only exists because of Titan/Old God influences : "The Well accelerated the cycles of growth and rebirth, and before long, it caused sentient beings to evolve from the land's primitive life forms".

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Actually they are native to Azeroth as they were created on Azeroth and from Azeroth's crust. Would you consider Dragons or Goblins non-native as they were created from stuff on Azeroth as well?(although in both cases it was creature on the planet not from the planet itself)

Are the Aqir not native to Azeroth? Pretty much everything that exists on Azeroth only exists because of Titan/Old God influences : "The Well accelerated the cycles of growth and rebirth, and before long, it caused sentient beings to evolve from the land's primitive life forms".

Would I count a bunch of bugs spawned from void entities literally lunched through space to smack into and corrupt plants natives? Of course not.

Being a mutant like a goblin or night elf would still make you native I’d say and the dragons were around as proto drakes before there forced evolution so they count to.

As your own quote says the well accelerated grown but it didn’t case it, without the titans or the old gods showing up these races would have still evolved on Azeroth even if the time frame was way way longer. Aliens messing around with something doesn’t mean there end result was the natural outcome.

[qwerty123456]

Would I count a bunch of bugs spawned from void entities literally lunched through space to smack into and corrupt plants natives? Of course not.

Being a mutant like a goblin or night elf would still make you native I’d say and the dragons were around as proto drakes before there forced evolution so they count to.

As your own quote says the well accelerated grown but it didn’t case it, without the titans or the old gods showing up these races would have still evolved on Azeroth even if the time frame was way way longer. Aliens messing around with something doesn’t mean there end result was the natural outcome.

You can't be sure those races would have evolved. Sentient species may have eventually evolved but for all we know it could have been floating kirby like creatures because the elementals destroyed everything on land before it could become sentient. Also there is a difference between natural and native.

[Boddhi]

Fantasy world is just adapting to real world. Patriach/Matriach (Garrosh, Sylvanas) rulers and leaders that need to make the tough decisions and suffer under their heavy burden are a relic of the past. One man show leaders are not wanted anymore. What we got now are "Managers" that manage a democratic consensual biotope for everyone to have their opinions matter and being part of the decision making. That leads to a superficially we all love each other comfy zone with lowest common denominator results, that under the surface pisses everyone off. But to not disturb the love and the comfy, its never expressed.

[Super Dickmann]

I honestly and literally think Blizz and WoW are perfectly ok with losing any and all customers/players for whom "we aren't cast as dicks in the lore? I signed on to be a dick! It's my right to be a villainous dick in this multiplayer game" is a deal breaker. I'm not even speaking hyperbolically, that's literally an angle that can be seen as countering toxicity, something that is MUCH more of a big deal to the bottom line, in this day an age than it was at WoW's founding.

The demographic you talk about don't exist. Even if there were this hidden group of consumers who were dicks because the story has dicks in the game and they can't differentiate between reality and the game and would suddenly clear out once you didn't, the hypothetical buyer you're mentioning would do one of things - A) Take a look at any other vector like DKs, DHs, warlocks, Maldraxxus or what have you or, and far more likely, B) Notice that this same story has all good flowing out of a hereditary blue eyed blonde man and all bad coming from a strong independent woman who's savages need to be taught to like said white man and pen a fifty page screed against it on their site of choice. Those who piss off their existing playerbase to try in vain to snag a new one in this fashion lose both because the former lose interest and the latter aren't interested. It's like clockwork.

@Boddhi

The whole 'cosmetically diverse but ethically and behaviourally identical' thing pushed hard in BFA and these descriptions is pretty much the wet dream of that kind of mindset too, but since it's fiction, it can actually be imposed. At least until you or the consumer get bored and you switch tracks.