Did you like D3 ?

[AeneasBK]

Inferno at release were brutal as I remember and I enjoyed it. people complained about how hard Inferno was and then it got nerfed heavily.
Do I misremember it that badly?

I know I'm not good, so whether I personally find a game easy or hard isn't a refelction on whether it is in fact an easy or hard game; but it did seem popular consensus amongst twitch/youtube/forums was that the game on it's hardest difficulty (was it called Inferno, I forget) was stupidly overtuned where they literally just put a '00' on the end of all the numbers compared to the previous difficulty and it was just stupid, no one actually "played" the game on that difficulty they just did 'chest' runs or runs of that part of Act3 before Azmodan where you vault/teleport past the mobs and just smash wossnames urns or w/e.

So that OP starts the thread (I get that was months ago) with "When D3 came out it was boringly easy" or however he expressed it; it's hard to take anything else they write seriously.

[Dawon]

I loved it, grinded quite a bit back in the days (passed 1k paragon levels) but stopped by the time Necro patch was incoming. Game is still awesome imo and pushing rifts is fun but now I need D4 so will be other games until that arrive.

D3 gets a solid 8/10 in overall score from me!

[Cnfzs]

It really depends on what you are looking for. It is a very casual and fast-paced ARPG. You can log in for one or two hours and have some fun. I would have hated it when I was a teen but like it nowadays for these reasons. Blizzard games are mostly like Marvel movies that cater to the whole family, without them being overly complicated to play or require you to put much thought into them (some exceptions in WoW of course).

But there is nothing wrong with that because alternatives exist. If you are into that deep ARPG experience, PoE is there for you. Grim Dawn strikes a balance between D3 and PoE. I think it is great that we can choose between so many different styles of ARPGs today.

[Kumorii]

I know I'm not good, so whether I personally find a game easy or hard isn't a refelction on whether it is in fact an easy or hard game; but it did seem popular consensus amongst twitch/youtube/forums was that the game on it's hardest difficulty (was it called Inferno, I forget) was stupidly overtuned where they literally just put a '00' on the end of all the numbers compared to the previous difficulty and it was just stupid, no one actually "played" the game on that difficulty they just did 'chest' runs or runs of that part of Act3 before Azmodan where you vault/teleport past the mobs and just smash wossnames urns or w/e.

So that OP starts the thread (I get that was months ago) with "When D3 came out it was boringly easy" or however he expressed it; it's hard to take anything else they write seriously.

Hence my confusion in my reply to whom I quoted.

[AeneasBK]

Hence my confusion in my reply to whom I quoted.

Yeah, sorry, that was meant to be agreeing with you; rambled a bit

[Fabled]

Yea, but then the seasonal grind started and it quickly got so boring to redo everything just to push keys. I know others enjoy it and that's fantastic, it's just not for me. God I wish it just stayed in D3 and they didn't do it for WoW's Mythics.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

D3 was great. End of the day its support faded off. They liked making systems for the game but they didn't really make much more game over the years. I still pick it up and benge it once in a while but it is or never was going to be a long laster for me. Seasonal repeat the game stuff only works on me a few times before I am just tired of doing it again.

[Unholyground]

D3 RoS is one of the best selling PC games of all time so you tell me lol. In all honesty though it turned out really good after they made the expansion, the saddest part is they canceled 2 in-development expansions and then released the Necro they were working on for one of them as DLC to recoup the losses.

[PenguinChan]

D3 is great but Blizzard abandoned it. My only gripe is how solo-focused and how coop doesn't really feel like coop. It's more coop than Warframe, sure, but it's not Overwatch levels of teamwork. I wish we had more team-work like that in an ARPG and none seem to have it. But D3 still has the most fluid and enjoyable movement and area clearing abilities out there. But it's not too in depth.

[chrisnumbers]

I guess my thousands of hours says I liked it. But it's been pretty stagnant for quite some time so, idk. It needs a little something.

[Coldkil]

Inferno at release were brutal as I remember and I enjoyed it. people complained about how hard Inferno was and then it got nerfed heavily.
Do I misremember it that badly? I remember weaving through the slow stinger shots in act 2 because they one shot you or 2 shot so you had to really take your environment into consideration for them.

Multiple things, actually.

Inferno wasn't hard by itself - loot was terrible and basically unfarmable. First iteration was like this: act 1 had lvl60 monsters (= to your character so actually pretty standard), act 2 had lvl 61, etc up to 63 at act 4. Problem was both monster scaling and loot scaling - monsters higher levels than you were just deadly and you could get ilvl >60 ONLY from monster that had level >60 (which is actually how D2 has always worked).

It was hard because farming for gear was basically impossible, coupled with the fact stats and rolls were all over the place, uniques were useless etc. I did my clear """"pretty easily""""" because i played DH so i could Smoke Screen/Vault the whole thing, same with wizards and shield barbs. That's coincidentally why the AH was so popular aswell. Good gear was just scarce and was just more profitable to buy your stuff than actually playing.

They changed it after a while, ilvl 60+ gear started to have a chance to drop also in act1, making things slightly more bearable. Then after a while they just normalized levels through all Inferno and introduced monster power instead, but at that point most people just had resorted to buy their gear making it just a multiplier to get your Paragon 100 in Vanilla.

To me, the actual worst part was Inferno Act 1 being totally and reliably farmable but basically useless in terms of loot. Then the jump to Act 2 and the following were insane and completely unneeded imho. MP made the game overall more enjoyable, you could still have a pretty difficult challenge on your hands, and it doesn't look as stupid as "Torment 2362754378". But then again loot was terrible so there wasn't something to strive for.

[chrisnumbers]

I liked it, until I learned how to play PoE.

POE is too much for my casual ass.

[Miyagie]

It was fine during the first seasons since the pace was nowhere near this. Also worth pointing out, Madureira left Blizzard basically just after RoS launched (we know that D3 was basically axed after RoS for whatever reason and expansion 2 was canned, we got necro out of what was done already).

I think the idea was to expand on items and stuff after RoS since they had put a new starting point for the experience, but then again the project was cut abruptly, most of D3 team was moved onto WoW:Legion since the game after WoD was in a terrible state and we get a rinse/repeat cycle of seasons that were always the same thing over and over - hell they didn't even bother to add more unlockable cosmetic sets.

RoS shoved that there was potential in saving D3 (since as you said combat/gameplay is just so good). Unfortunately everything was killed before even trying.

D3 Sold 20+ Million times and RoS just 6 Million thats why it was axed.
Ofc its unfair since the 1 year sub in WoW inflated the numbers.

[Coldkil]

D3 is great but Blizzard abandoned it. My only gripe is how solo-focused and how coop doesn't really feel like coop. It's more coop than Warframe, sure, but it's not Overwatch levels of teamwork. I wish we had more team-work like that in an ARPG and none seem to have it. But D3 still has the most fluid and enjoyable movement and area clearing abilities out there. But it's not too in depth.

And then most of the players actually play the game solo. D2 was the same, D3 just automated most of the grouping process. If anything, group play disrupted solo experience because since "endgame" is just climbing the GR ladder, groups can could consistently hit higher GRs than solo players, this farming more Paragons/gem levels and then conquer easily solo leaderboards.

Diablo isn't a game made for groups in mind, despite how much Blizzard wants to push this concept. It's a casual co-op game based on smelting hordes of monsters, where the only tactic is to be as efficient as possible. I'm happy i can play it with friends or wife, but i love the game because i can just log in, kill demons, log off independently from the time or who is online at the moment.

[PenguinChan]

And then most of the players actually play the game solo. D2 was the same, D3 just automated most of the grouping process. If anything, group play disrupted solo experience because since "endgame" is just climbing the GR ladder, groups can could consistently hit higher GRs than solo players, this farming more Paragons/gem levels and then conquer easily solo leaderboards.

Diablo isn't a game made for groups in mind, despite how much Blizzard wants to push this concept. It's a casual co-op game based on smelting hordes of monsters, where the only tactic is to be as efficient as possible. I'm happy i can play it with friends or wife, but i love the game because i can just log in, kill demons, log off independently from the time or who is online at the moment.

Oh I know what it is, I'm just stating how I wish the co-op had more of that in mind for people who liked it. D3 is definitely meant for people who want to obliterate hordes of enemies with little thought - ala Warframe and its hordes of enemies too. It's enjoyable when I want to play it, but I definitely wish there was an ARPG like D3 (In its smoothness, mobility, etc.) and somewhat simplicity but still retained a modicum of team-play, IE: Overwatch.

I know D4 will not be this either, so I'm not expecting it. Just wishful thinking, I guess.

[Coldkil]

D3 Sold 20+ Million times and RoS just 6 Million thats why it was axed.
Ofc its unfair since the 1 year sub in WoW inflated the numbers.

The 30 million mark was hit at August 2015, more than a year after RoS came out. Also, more than a year after PS4 and XBox versions came out which include both Vanilla and RoS. From the SOURCE it's unclear what the number includes. Anyway, the WoW promotion didn't actually pump numbers much since they are attested to be around 1.2 millions (for sure a good amount in terms of launch sales but a fraction of the total long term).

In another article dated June 2014 they also say that the 20 million benchmark includes digital sales and expansion sales aswell.

So, no one knows the actual numbers. I am sure that RoS sold less of the base game since hype died due to the bad state the game was in, but sales numbers are very well masked and don't say much other than they sold an awful lot of copies of it and made a huge money out of it.

For once, i have 2 copies - i got the WoW promotion, plus physical CE of both base game and expansion. I know multiple people who bought the game for pc and then bought it again for their console of choice. So numbers are also kinda bloated overall - still, one copy sold is still money gained independently if they were all bought by the same person.

I fully acknoledge D3 to have been a financial success. The issue i have with it is the blatant shortcomings the game has, how badly it was managed from the beginning and how it was axed when it was being saved. All of this lead to tremendous brand damage, and now the D4 team has to do a REALLY good job just to prove players they can do a good Diablo game (while what i've seen so far is very promising, though itemization is still in need of work on and talent trees could be much more expanded).

- - - Updated - - -

Oh I know what it is, I'm just stating how I wish the co-op had more of that in mind for people who liked it. D3 is definitely meant for people who want to obliterate hordes of enemies with little thought - ala Warframe and its hordes of enemies too. It's enjoyable when I want to play it, but I definitely wish there was an ARPG like D3 (In its smoothness, mobility, etc.) and somewhat simplicity but still retained a modicum of team-play, IE: Overwatch.

I know D4 will not be this either, so I'm not expecting it. Just wishful thinking, I guess.

I think it's the genre itself leaning towards solo players. I mean, it's an efficiency game and the best way to play it as efficiently as a player wants is to just play solo and not deal with random people. It's a gameplay that simply "cannot" have group content as dungeons or raids for example.

But i really get your point. A fast paced game that has small group organized endgame would be a killer right now.

[PenguinChan]

I think it's the genre itself leaning towards solo players. I mean, it's an efficiency game and the best way to play it as efficiently as a player wants is to just play solo and not deal with random people. It's a gameplay that simply "cannot" have group content as dungeons or raids for example.

But i really get your point. A fast paced game that has small group organized endgame would be a killer right now.

I blame how the games are designed in that regard, honestly. I love playing solo too, and obviously you need to make the game doable / fun while playing solo. But I definitely do think it'd be cool if an ARPG had increased difficulty and synergy between players when you go co-op in them. Or have one that's purely multiplayer, which I believe Riot Games is working on? Something akin to that, anyways.

[Coldkil]

I blame how the games are designed in that regard, honestly. I love playing solo too, and obviously you need to make the game doable / fun while playing solo. But I definitely do think it'd be cool if an ARPG had increased difficulty and synergy between players when you go co-op in them. Or have one that's purely multiplayer, which I believe Riot Games is working on? Something akin to that, anyways.

Makes sense, but usually ARPG players have the "gotta go fast" mentality which clashes with a more organized/planned playstyle. I mean, it can work if desinged ground-up to be like that, but it's gonna be more an MMO-lite and an ARPG. Yeah, it's mostly semantics but it's just how i see it.

[3DTyrant]

It's decent to play on the PS4 with a friend, just have a chilled gaming session, not worrying about feeling the need to do crazy grinding, nor trying to get to the highest GRift we can and do it in the fastest time we can. Just have a relax and have a laugh while we play it. Playing it alone however is a tad boring for me due to the lack of good company that I'd have with my friend.

I do like it, but it's just better playing it with friends.

[PenguinChan]

Makes sense, but usually ARPG players have the "gotta go fast" mentality which clashes with a more organized/planned playstyle. I mean, it can work if desinged ground-up to be like that, but it's gonna be more an MMO-lite and an ARPG. Yeah, it's mostly semantics but it's just how i see it.

Oh of course. You can have a faster paced team-work game AND have it be efficient. Unfortunately since the ARPG is very focused around personal expression in your builds this also means you have to sorta cater to a lot of those builds - and that's a huge thing for the ARPG that many other games don't have anymore.