No Bards in Lore?

[FossilFree]

So DKs fit in WotLK, DHs fit in Legion, Monks fit in MoP, but Bards don’t need to fit in an expansion theme ( despite Blizzard saying that new classes must fit an expansion’s theme) because they’re “special”.

By your own standard, that means a tinker will never happen since it didn't happen in 8.2.

[Teriz]

I'd think the Lorewalkers and Tortollans to be way more than just "several".

Which are only Bards in your head canon.

Standards that are nothing but bullshit since those are nothing but your own arbitrary rules that you never, ever have been able to show any evidence for (i.e., any official statement from Blizzard) yet you love to dishonestly tout as if you're the one controlling Blizzard with an iron gauntlet.

Is this enough of an official statement for you (of course it won't be);

“I’ll also add that when we’re making those choices for classes and races and things like that, a lot of it’s informed by setting and story,” said Kubit. And looking at the setting of the Shadowlands, there wasn’t a class that jumped out like the Demon Hunter did in the past with Legion for example. So a lot of our focus is more on building the world of the Shadowlands.”

https://www.polygon.com/interviews/2...ll-human-dwarf

In other words, a class needs to fit an expansion's theme or setting. Good luck finding a theme or setting suitable for a class with zero lore in the game.

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By your own standard, that means a tinker will never happen since it didn't happen in 8.2.

Yeah, Blizzard doesn't release classes mid expansion. Considering that 10.0 is going to be a time skip, that could facilitate a steampunk themed expansion, depending on the whereabouts of Gazlowe and Gelbin during Shadowlands. There could also be an expansion involving the Undermine, and/or the secretive "War" taking place beneath the surface of Azeroth between titan constructs.

That's the benefit of having a class concepts backed up with actual lore and actual lore characters that are part of the story. Not one offs who pop up and disappear never to be seen again.

[Ielenia]

Which are only Bards in your head canon.

And calling Chen Stormstout a "monk" before MoP was also "head canon". The organizations and characters fit the bard concept to a "T".

Is this enough of an official statement for you (of course it won't be);

https://www.polygon.com/interviews/2...ll-human-dwarf

In other words, a class needs to fit an expansion's theme or setting. Good luck finding a theme or setting suitable for a class with zero lore in the game.

And none of that disqualifies the bard. It says nothing about this "needs to be based off a Warcraft 3 unit" nonsense you always repeat. It says nothing about "needs major lore character" which is also another nonsense you love to tout.

[Teriz]

And calling Chen Stormstout a "monk" before MoP was also "head canon". The organizations and characters fit the bard concept to a "T".

Not really, considering that it was mentioned that the Brewmaster hero was using Pandaren martial arts.

And none of that disqualifies the bard. It says nothing about this "needs to be based off a Warcraft 3 unit" nonsense you always repeat. It says nothing about "needs major lore character" which is also another nonsense you love to tout.

How can a Bard fit a setting if there's no major lore character that is a Bard? That means that there is no character available to drive the setting or theme of an expansion.

[Ielenia]

Not really, considering that it was mentioned that the Brewmaster hero was using Pandaren martial arts.

Except it was never mentioned, at all, whatsoever.

How can a Bard fit a setting if there's no major lore character that is a Bard?

I feel like I need to explain that "2+2=4", here. Simple: you either go the monk route, by "upgrading" an existing character to be a representative of the new class, like it happened to Chen, or, I don't know... create a new character. Shocking news, I know. Blizzard creating new characters for the game? Never heard that before, either.

That means that there is no character available to drive the setting or theme of an expansion.

Care to tell me how much did Chen "drove the setting or theme of an expansion"? Because, as far as I know, Lorewalker Cho did most of the "driving" during MoP.

In Wrath, Arthas was the main bad guy. In Legion, Illidan "drove" nothing. He was absent through half the expansion, barely even talking to the demon hunters, and on the second half... did basically nothing.

[Aucald]

There are a handful of Bards in WoW lore, including the following:

• Helgus
• Russell Brower
• Hired Bard
• Russel the Bard
• Grenja
• Jay the Tavern Bard

An argument could also be made for:

• Perry Gatner
• The members of Blight Boar (Devlynn Styx, Cage Head, Jon Graves, and Fiddlesticks).
• The Death Metal Knight
• The members of Elite Tauren Chieftain (Samuro, Sig Nicious, Bergrisst, Mai'Kyl, and Chief Thunder-Skins).

As for where Bards could fit in as an expansion centerpiece - that's a bit harder to factor. I think the best fit for them would be a looser and non-centrally themed expansion based on exploration and travel, such as a South Seas style expansion or one that simply doesn't have a centralized storyline.

[Ielenia]

There are a handful of Bards in WoW lore, including the following:

• Helgus
• Russell Brower
• Hired Bard
• Russel the Bard
• Grenja
• Jay the Tavern Bard

An argument could also be made for:

• Perry Gatner
• The members of Blight Boar (Devlynn Styx, Cage Head, Jon Graves, and Fiddlesticks).
• The Death Metal Knight
• The members of Elite Tauren Chieftain (Samuro, Sig Nicious, Bergrisst, Mai'Kyl, and Chief Thunder-Skins).

I'm pretty sure a case could be made about Brann Bronzebeard, as well. He's an adventurer, and he loves finding and telling new stories, which is one of the defining characteristics of the bard concept. Same with the Tortollans and the Lorewalkers, too. Cho even actually sings.

[Aucald]

I'm pretty sure a case could be made about Brann Bronzebeard, as well. He's an adventurer, and he loves finding and telling new stories, which is one of the defining characteristics of the bard concept. Same with the Tortollans and the Lorewalkers, too. Cho even actually sings.

Brann is probably a bit too specialized and high profile to be a Bard, though I don't deny an argument could be made. The Tortollans and Lorewalkers seem like a good fit, too; it would be pretty awesome to see Lorewalker Cho become a marquee Bard example.

Bonus points for Xarantaur the Witness, as well, a Tauren granted eternal life by the Bronze Dragonflight and charged with cataloging all lore on Azeroth.

[FossilFree]

There are a handful of Bards in WoW lore, including the following:

• Helgus
• Russell Brower
• Hired Bard
• Russel the Bard
• Grenja
• Jay the Tavern Bard

An argument could also be made for:

• Perry Gatner
• The members of Blight Boar (Devlynn Styx, Cage Head, Jon Graves, and Fiddlesticks).
• The Death Metal Knight
• The members of Elite Tauren Chieftain (Samuro, Sig Nicious, Bergrisst, Mai'Kyl, and Chief Thunder-Skins).

As for where Bards could fit in as an expansion centerpiece - that's a bit harder to factor. I think the best fit for them would be a looser and non-centrally themed expansion based on exploration and travel, such as a South Seas style expansion or one that simply doesn't have a centralized storyline.

Also, any NPC called a skald is also a bard. Skalds are the Norse version of bards. Also, bards or ollaves are Gaelic and scops are Anglo-Saxon.
https://www.historyonthenet.com/viki...d-storytellers

Example:
https://www.wowhead.com/npc=23657/winterskorn-skald

[Aucald]

Also, any NPC called a skald is also a bard. Skalds are the Norse version of bards. Also, bards or ollaves are Gaelic and scops are Anglo-Saxon.
https://www.historyonthenet.com/viki...d-storytellers

Example:
https://www.wowhead.com/npc=23657/winterskorn-skald

Don't know if Vrykul Skalds are 1:1 the same thing they are in real-wold Norse history and mythology, but it works for me. Would be really weird if an expansion featuring a Bard class also happened to include Vrykul as a playable race.

[FossilFree]

Don't know if Vrykul Skalds are 1:1 the same thing they are in real-wold Norse history and mythology, but it works for me. Would be really weird if an expansion featuring a Bard class also happened to include Vrykul as a playable race.

It could just be a human tradition passed down from their Vrykul skald ancestors. Especially if we ever got Azotha customization options!

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...1#post25945409

[Teriz]

Except it was never mentioned, at all, whatsoever.

From WC3:

The Brewmasters of Pandaria have emerged from the bamboo forests of their ancestors to bring their unique fighting style (and robust ales) to the highest bidder. Attacks land units.

I feel like I need to explain that "2+2=4", here. Simple: you either go the monk route, by "upgrading" an existing character to be a representative of the new class, like it happened to Chen, or, I don't know... create a new character. Shocking news, I know. Blizzard creating new characters for the game? Never heard that before, either.

Except they didn’t need to “upgrade” Chen. He was already a popular character, and he (and the Brewmaster) was already associated with martial arts via WC3, The WC RPG, and the card games.

Care to tell me how much did Chen "drove the setting or theme of an expansion"? Because, as far as I know, Lorewalker Cho did most of the "driving" during MoP.

In Wrath, Arthas was the main bad guy. In Legion, Illidan "drove" nothing. He was absent through half the expansion, barely even talking to the demon hunters, and on the second half... did basically nothing.

I wasnt talking about narrative, I was talking about setting. In other words, having a popular lore character be the face of an expansion, and match its general setting. There’s nothing like that for the Bard.

[Ielenia]

From WC3:

Which does not mean "oriental style martial arts" or "monks" whatsoever. In fact, by going through the April Fools mock-up race page, it says pikemen, bladedancers and geomancers. Again: nothing about "monks" or "oriental style martial arts" whatsoever.

Again: it was never mentioned, at all, whatsoever.

Except they didn’t need to “upgrade” Chen.

You do know that the "upgrade" I mentioned meant going from a simple drunkard who loves making beer, into an actual monk, right?

He was already a popular character,

So "popular" people didn't know who he was, and was barely only mentioned in WoW in one small three-quest chain, and even then many people would just not find that quest because it was started by finding a quest-starting item in the world, back in the day when quest-starting items did not have an exclamation over their heads, did not glow, and did not show on the mini-map.

and he (and the Brewmaster) was already associated with martial arts via WC3,

No. He wasn't. He truly, objectively, wasn't.

The WC RPG,

Which aren't canon. Just like April Fools jokes aren't canon.

I wasnt talking about narrative, I was talking about setting. In other words, having a popular lore character be the face of an expansion, and match its general setting. There’s nothing like that for the Bard.

And who said we need a class representative on the cover of the box? All we need is to show a relevant character in the box, and that character could be just the bad guy of the expansion.

[gobio]

We should consolidate these special ideas so it is easier for blizzard to handle.

THE THIRD DEMON HUNTER SPEC SHOULD BE BARD.

[Teriz]

Which does not mean "oriental style martial arts" or "monks" whatsoever. In fact, by going through the April Fools mock-up race page, it says pikemen, bladedancers and geomancers. Again: nothing about "monks" or "oriental style martial arts" whatsoever.

Two things: 1. The Monk class in WoW is using Pandaren Martial Arts, not “oriental” martial arts. Unless you can find an “oriental” martial art where someone splits into three different elements to fight.

2. That lore quote comes from the Brewmaster hero, not the April Fools day write up.

You do know that the "upgrade" I mentioned meant going from a simple drunkard who loves making beer, into an actual monk, right?

Yeah, he wasn’t a “simple drunk” in WC3 either. He was called a “peerless warrior” in that game.

So "popular" people didn't know who he was, and was barely only mentioned in WoW in one small three-quest chain, and even then many people would just not find that quest because it was started by finding a quest-starting item in the world, back in the day when quest-starting items did not have an exclamation over their heads, did not glow, and did not show on the mini-map.

Yeah, so popular that his race was the most requested WoW race for years. Considering that Chen was the only known Pandaren at the time, that popularity obviously stemmed from him.

No. He wasn't. He truly, objectively, wasn't.

Fighting Style means martial art.

Which aren't canon. Just like April Fools jokes aren't canon.

Which is irrelevant. They were licensed Blizzard products, and for years between WC3 and MoP they showed Brewmasters as martial artists and monks.

And who said we need a class representative on the cover of the box? All we need is to show a relevant character in the box, and that character could be just the bad guy of the expansion.

LoL! So you think the bad guy if an expansion is going to be a Bard? What expansion theme would allow something like that? WoW the Musical?

- - - Updated - - -

Btw, I think it’s interesting that Blizzard never had a Bard class in their table top RPG either.

[Ielenia]

Two things: 1. The Monk class in WoW is using Pandaren Martial Arts, not “oriental” martial arts. Unless you can find an “oriental” martial art where someone splits into three different elements to fight.

Ever heard of Kung Fu? I mean, it's quite varied. And it's not the only one.

2. That lore quote comes from the Brewmaster hero, not the April Fools day write up.

Which is basically none: comes from Pandaria, and likes beer. That's all that it says. It says nothing about "oriental style martial arts" or even mentions the word "monk".

Yeah, he wasn’t a “simple drunk” in WC3 either. He was called a “peerless warrior” in that game.

Which could mean anything, even just a "simple drunk" who becomes too unpredictable in his movements when fighting due to being drunk. "Peerless" does not necessarily mean "unique fighting style". It can also mean great skill. Turalyon is a "peerless paladin". Velen is a "peerless priest". Thrall was a "peerless shaman".

Yeah, so popular that his race was the most requested WoW race for years. Considering that Chen was the only known Pandaren at the time, that popularity obviously stemmed from him.

And yet you've failed to show a single shred of evidence of that. Not a single forum thread pre-MoP in which the most requested race was the pandaren. Or even being "one of" the most requested. I've been on this site and playing WoW for over ten years, and I've never seen the pandaren even come up once in race request threads and polls.

Fighting Style means martial art.

No. It means "fighting style". The warrior class, for example, has three fighting styles: sword-and-board, single weapon, and dual-wielding.

Which is irrelevant. They were licensed Blizzard products, and for years between WC3 and MoP they showed Brewmasters as martial artists and monks.

It's not irrelevant, because, by nature of being non-canon, it means the developers of those games did not have to adhere to the Warcraft lore. A big example of that is how we have "Ragnaros, Lightlord" in Hearthstone.

LoL! So you think the bad guy if an expansion is going to be a Bard?

Once again, dishonesty at best, since I never said that.

[Teriz]

Ever heard of Kung Fu? I mean, it's quite varied. And it's not the only one.

Please show me anywhere in Warcraft lore that a Pandaren Martial Arts is called “Kung fu”.

Which is basically none: comes from Pandaria, and likes beer. That's all that it says. It says nothing about "oriental style martial arts" or even mentions the word "monk".

Because Pandarens don’t do “oriental” martial arts. The do Pandaren Martial arts. Again, show me anywhere in Warcraft where the Pandaren are referred to as “oriental”.

Which could mean anything, even just a "simple drunk" who becomes too unpredictable in his movements when fighting due to being drunk. "Peerless" does not necessarily mean "unique fighting style". It can also mean great skill. Turalyon is a "peerless paladin". Velen is a "peerless priest". Thrall was a "peerless shaman".

If someone is purposely using alcohol to enhance their fighting ability, they’re not “simple drunks”. They’re martial artists who are using alcohol to enhance their fighting ability.

And yet you've failed to show a single shred of evidence of that. Not a single forum thread pre-MoP in which the most requested race was the pandaren. Or even being "one of" the most requested. I've been on this site and playing WoW for over ten years, and I've never seen the pandaren even come up once in race request threads and polls.

During an interview with Game Front, Lead Quest Designer Dave Kosak, who also was on the panel with Metzen, echoed the sentiments that Mists of Pandaria may seem more light-hearted, but it's just as important to the overall WoW experience as the previous expansion sets. Kosak also said that a playable pandaren race is “by far” the most asked-for World of Warcraft feature among fans.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/History_of...en_in_Warcraft

No. It means "fighting style". The warrior class, for example, has three fighting styles: sword-and-board, single weapon, and dual-wielding.

We’re not talking about WoW, we’re talking about WC3. And yes, fighting style is synonymous with martial art. You claimed that the Brewmaster wasn’t using a martial art at all.

It's not irrelevant, because, by nature of being non-canon, it means the developers of those games did not have to adhere to the Warcraft lore. A big example of that is how we have "Ragnaros, Lightlord" in Hearthstone.

It is irrelevant because they HAVE used that material for WoW lore. Baron Razdunk for example only existed in the RPG books, yet he made his first appearance in WoW during BFA. Heroes of the Storm is not canon, but Blizzard pulls concepts and abilities from it constantly.

Btw, you can add this to the material from Blizzard pushing Chen Stormstout before MoP;



That action figure is from 2009.

Anything like that for Bards?

Once again, dishonesty at best, since I never said that.

You’re implying it. You’re also purposely steering this conversation away from Bards because you know they have zero lore to base anything concrete on.

[Ielenia]

Please show me anywhere in Warcraft lore that a Pandaren Martial Arts is called “Kung fu”.

Adding fantastical, fantasy powers does not make the inspiration for said fighting style to be any less inspired in the chinese fighting styles and folklore.

Because Pandarens don’t do “oriental” martial arts. The do Pandaren Martial arts.

Read above. The whole "pandaren martial arts" is obviously heavily influenced by the oriental martial arts.

If someone is purposely using alcohol to enhance their fighting ability, they’re not “simple drunks”. They’re martial artists who are using alcohol to enhance their fighting ability.

No, not necessarily. And it really doesn't necessarily mean "martial arts".

https://wow.gamepedia.com/History_of...en_in_Warcraft

Again: I have never seen any single thread or post, in this fan forum or in the official ones, of people ever asking for pandaren as a playable race. Ever. The question for playable pandaren also never came up in any developer interview, whatsoever.

We’re not talking about WoW, we’re talking about WC3.

Both are "warcraft". But if that's the way you want to, all that the "pandaren fighting style" boils down to is to slam people on the head with a keg. Nothing more, nothing less.

And yes, fighting style is synonymous with martial art.

No. It's not. No more than "method of transportaion" is a synonym for "car".

You claimed that the Brewmaster wasn’t using a martial art at all.

The Warcraft 3 Pandaren Brewmaster neutral hero unit is not using martial arts at all.

It is irrelevant because they HAVE used that material for WoW lore. Baron Razdunk for example only existed in the RPG books, yet he made his first appearance in WoW during BFA. Heroes of the Storm is not canon, but Blizzard pulls concepts and abilities from it constantly.

It's still non-canon. Everything in the TCG and other RPG books are non-canon until they are officially made canon by implementing them into the actual game and lore.

Btw, you can add this to the material from Blizzard pushing Chen Stormstout before MoP;

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/BNkAA...wsu/s-l640.jpg

That action figure is from 2009.

Anything like that for Bards?

"You’ve probably run into his empty keg in your travels through the Barrens — now you can own a collectible action figure of Azeroth’s most renowned pandaren wanderer. Capturing the spirit (and spirits) of Chen Stormstout, the Pandaren Brewmaster Deluxe Action Figure is a limited-edition, premium-sculpted piece that stands at a colossal 8 inches and features Chen’s signature bamboo bo staff and brewmaster’s keg. The Pandaren Brewmaster Action Figure is available in limited quantities and can be ordered exclusively through the online Blizzard Store. Head over there today to order one for the budding Brewmaster in your life."

Notice a complete lack of mention of anything "oriental style martial arts" and the complete absence of the word "monk".

You’re implying it.

No, I'm not, because I never, ever, talking about who could be the bad guy in an expansion that introduces bards. This is just your twisted, dishonest pseudo-logic.

You’re also purposely steering this conversation away from Bards because you know they have zero lore to base anything concrete on.

I'm steering the conversation away from bards... by talking about bards and showing precedence for their existence in the lore and possible implementation as a playable class. What.

The fact of the matter is: oriental-style monks (i.e. pandaren monks) did not exist, whatsoever, in the lore until Mists of Pandaria came along and they were officially retconed into the lore. Chen was not a monk until MoP came along and "upgraded" him to monk status (i.e. retconed his "class"). This is something similar to the current Bard situation, only with bards (as per their RPG trope concept) already exists in the lore, so that's one thing that bards have over the monk class.

[Teriz]

Adding fantastical, fantasy powers does not make the inspiration for said fighting style to be any less inspired in the chinese fighting styles and folklore.

So you don't think a Panda man with the name "Chen" also isn't inspired by China and Chinese culture, since Pandas are only found in China?

Read above. The whole "pandaren martial arts" is obviously heavily influenced by the oriental martial arts.

Which would also mean that Chen and the Brewmaster is also inspired by Chinese martial arts.

No, not necessarily. And it really doesn't necessarily mean "martial arts".

Please find a context where "fighting style" is used and it isn't associated with Martial Arts.

Again: I have never seen any single thread or post, in this fan forum or in the official ones, of people ever asking for pandaren as a playable race. Ever. The question for playable pandaren also never came up in any developer interview, whatsoever.

So do you feel that Dave Kosak is lying about playable Pandarens being the most asked for feature in WoW?

Both are "warcraft". But if that's the way you want to, all that the "pandaren fighting style" boils down to is to slam people on the head with a keg. Nothing more, nothing less.

Yeah, but your argument is that martial arts were never mentioned in association with the Brewmaster before MoP. WC3 lore clearly states otherwise.

No. It's not. No more than "method of transportaion" is a synonym for "car".

False. You can interchange "fighting style" with "martial art" in any context and it makes perfect sense; Ex. Boxing is my fighting style/martial art. Karate is a fighting style/martial art from Japan.

The Warcraft 3 Pandaren Brewmaster neutral hero unit is not using martial arts at all.

WC3 disagrees. They call them a peerless warrior with a unique fighting style/martial art.

Case closed.

It's still non-canon. Everything in the TCG and other RPG books are non-canon until they are officially made canon by implementing them into the actual game and lore.

Which is irrelevant to the fact that Blizzard put a lot of lore into the Brewmasters and Pandaria from those sources which was eventually used in MoP and became canon.

Notice a complete lack of mention of anything "oriental style martial arts" and the complete absence of the word "monk".

Which wasn't the point of me using that example. The point was to show how popular of a character Chen Stormstout was BEFORE MoP. Again, I'd love to see a Bard character with that level of popularity.

No, I'm not, because I never, ever, talking about who could be the bad guy in an expansion that introduces bards. This is just your twisted, dishonest pseudo-logic.


I'm steering the conversation away from bards... by talking about bards and showing precedence for their existence in the lore and possible implementation as a playable class. What.

The fact of the matter is: oriental-style monks (i.e. pandaren monks) did not exist, whatsoever, in the lore until Mists of Pandaria came along and they were officially retconed into the lore. Chen was not a monk until MoP came along and "upgraded" him to monk status (i.e. retconed his "class"). This is something similar to the current Bard situation, only with bards (as per their RPG trope concept) already exists in the lore, so that's one thing that bards have over the monk class.

The Monk situation is nowhere close to the Bard situation. There were multiple monk characters in WoW with abilities (and they were actually called Monks), we had a Pandarens Monk companion who tied the concept of Monks and Pandaren together (sent by Chen Stormstout himself) in WotLK, we had a WC3 hero heavily based on Chinese martial arts whose concept was reinforced through WC RPGs and the TCG card game, we had Pandaren being the most requested feature in WoW, and we had a major lore figure in Chen Stormstout and Pandaria who could tie the entire thing together.

Again, NOTHING like that exists for Bards.

[Ielenia]

So you don't think a Panda man with the name "Chen" also isn't inspired by China and Chinese culture, since Pandas are only found in China?

"Culture", and, by proxy, "folklore", are not "martial arts".

Which would also mean that Chen and the Brewmaster is also inspired by Chinese martial arts.

Inspired by Chinese pop culture, maybe. Martial arts? Nope. Zero "martial arts" on that WC3 unit. Me grabbing a keg and smacking someone on the head with it does not make me a martial artist.

Please find a context where "fighting style" is used and it isn't associated with Martial Arts.

A bar patron who likes to use a broken bottle as a weapon has a "fighting style", for example. And, again, when we say "martial arts"

So do you feel that Dave Kosak is lying about playable Pandarens being the most asked for feature in WoW?

He could very well have been, in an attempt to hype them.

Yeah, but your argument is that martial arts were never mentioned in association with the Brewmaster before MoP. WC3 lore clearly states otherwise.

Warcraft 3 lore says absolutely zilch about pandaren martial arts. Even the April Fools mock-up said nothing about any sort of martial arts used for the monk class.

False. You can interchange "fighting style" with "martial art" in any context and it makes perfect sense; Ex. Boxing is my fighting style/martial art. Karate is a fighting style/martial art from Japan.

Except we're talking about "oriental style martial arts", here. More specifically, the "martial arts" people think about when they hear the name. The kind of stuff you see Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan do.

WC3 disagrees. They call them a peerless warrior with a unique fighting style/martial art.

Case closed.

You not understanding what words mean doesn't mean you "win", Teriz. "peerless" does not mean 'unique fighting style'. The WC3 description never mentions "unique fighting style".

Which is irrelevant to the fact that Blizzard put a lot of lore into the Brewmasters and Pandaria from those sources which was eventually used in MoP and became canon.

It's not irrelevant because those books and games are officially non-canon. And everything written in them is non-canon, until Blizzard decides to make them canon. And I know how much you want to disregard the non-canonicity of those books and games, because 'tinker' is a playable class in them.

Which wasn't the point of me using that example. The point was to show how popular of a character Chen Stormstout was BEFORE MoP. Again, I'd love to see a Bard character with that level of popularity.

It doesn't show popularity. Again, you've failed to provide any thread or poll from players actually requesting or even talking about pandaren as a playable race.

The Monk situation is nowhere close to the Bard situation. There were multiple monk characters in WoW with abilities (and they were actually called Monks) (1), we had a Pandarens Monk companion who tied the concept of Monks and Pandaren together (sent by Chen Stormstout himself) in WotLK (2), we had a WC3 hero heavily based on Chinese martial arts (3) whose concept was reinforced through WC RPGs and the TCG card game (4), we had Pandaren being the most requested feature in WoW (5), and we had a major lore figure in Chen Stormstout(6) and Pandaria (7) who could tie the entire thing together.

1) None of them even come close to the 'oriental martial arts' style of the playable monk class and lore.
2) Which is non-canon, unless you want to argue that "cock-fights" and slavery are commonplace in WoW that nobody bats an eye to a human making a pandaren cub (due to its size) to fight for his amusement.
3) He was not "heavily based on martial arts", at all. There was zero martial arts on the character. No attack animations, no idle animations, not even a single voice line.
4) Which are all officially non-canon, which allows those games' developers to do what they want with the concepts without having to adhere to strict lore.
5) Which you've so far failed to show any request for pandarens...
6) Minor. Extremely minor. He was a side-character in the WC3 campaign, and was never mentioned in World of Warcraft save for a single three-quest chain which you could only acquire by finding his empty keg that spawned anywhere around the Barrens and did not look out of place in the map whatsoever, and did not glow, did not show a golden exclamation point over it, and did not show on the mini-map.
7) "Pandaria" is not martial arts.

Again, NOTHING like that exists for Bards.

Russell Brower and Hearthsinger Forresten are two NPCs currently in the game with offensive and defensive abilities. And the Lorewalkers and Tortollans are very bard-like groups. Tortollans also have seen being able to cast magic.