Suggestions for MM in Shadowlands.

[Sondrelk]

*Reposted from the official forums*


Suggestions on changes to MM going into Shadowlands, compiled after reading posts on the Alpha feedback forums.

Not currently invited to Alpha, so take this post with a grain of salt.

Trueshot Aura
Currently this cooldown is not very strong thematically, it shortens your cast times and allows you to shoot more aimed shots. The problem faced here is that this is not an ability worthy of the name, instead being more fitting if we still had it named Rapid Fire.
Secondly the talent itself poses problems for hte rotation, not doing much more than speed it up, often to its detriment as focus cost and aimed short charges do not always line up, especially if the idea is to use this ability to strengthen your rotation as a whole. Either you use it to get loads of Aimed shots, in which case you end focus starved, or you attempt to weave in different abilities, which often leads to ending with too many charges on aimed shot.

A suggestion i have after reading some other suggestions would be to change the ability ot be more flavorful, briefly empowering the hunter back to the Legion era where you had wind arrows. In this version any Precise shot buffs would instead cause you to instantly fire the arrow as a wind arrow, both freeing up the buffs without feeling like you waste them, as well as reusing the animations from Legion.

Rapid Fire (Read: Seizure shot)

Rapid fire is a pretty bland ability overall, serving no good purpose not as an impactful ability, nor as a focus builder. Currently in BfA the ability is only propped up by Azerite traits, as well as Trick shots, in single target the ability neither looks nor feels good to use.

A suggestion would be to replace this ability completely with Chimaera shot. This ability was always iconic to MM, and while i personally would prefer it to be renamed to Twin shot as the Chimaera shot always felt like a survival ability, i cannot deny that the ability felt good to use.
The ability could either use the Marked shot visuals, with a glyph or talent for the old version, or vice versa.
This ability could addiotnallly fill in the missing piece of cleave which was once integral to the MM spec identity, possibly even proccing trick shots for extra flavor.

Steady shot

This ability is another that feels mostly abandoned in the current rotation. Now arguably this is because of Rapid fire, but as has been noted on the Alpha forums the focus regen has been increased, further pushing this ability down the priority list. This has effects on talent choices and could do with redesign.

My suggestion would either be to remove Rapid fire, pushing steady shot further up the priority list, and allowing talents and abilities that shorten its cast time to shine.
Another suggestion could be to bake in the Azerite trait that was once prevalent in Uldir that increased Aimed shot damage when you cast steady shot. A suggestion could be to increase crit chance each time you use it.

Kill shot

As far as i can see on the Alpha this ability currently simply floats in the ether, not doing much more than allow you to press an extra button during execute phases.

My suggestion would be to attach a small buff when used. Perhaps something as elegant as it putting a DoT on the enemy that increases haste or crit each time it is used.
This would however likely push the relative strength of the Venthyr covenant ability further up, so you would likely need to add a caveat to said ability to not have it proc the haste, or otherwise tune the ability such that you cannot keep building the haste buff on the proc alone.

Hopefully this is easily digestible. Further suggestions welcome.

- - - Updated - - -

Not at all a comprehensive list of changes, rather some more directed improvements I would like to get some feedback on.

[docterfreeze]

The current alpha version of master marksman is so uninteresting, i'd think it was a placeholder if similar talents didn't already exist (streamline). It would be exceptional if it was instead the version of master marksman we had in cata/MoP which made steady shot generate stacks that eventually gave a free instant aimed shot. This would have great synergy with steady focus which is currently never used. I also think adding the steady aim azerite trait to steady focus would be a good idea to boost its viability.

Trueshot needs to do more. Currently we only spend precise shots during trueshot if we have master marksman. Since master marksman is being changed, we will completely ignore precise shot procs during trueshot which is bad design. Casting rapid fire or a couple steady shots during trueshot can easily cause you to overcap aimed shot charges.

Why does aimed shot even need a cooldown or charges? Focus already limits how much we can spam it.

Would prefer if the new kill shot talent made kill shot work as it did in WoD, get one reset if it doesn't kill and a heal if it kills. Stacking aimed shot CDR from kill shot with aimed shot CDR from trueshot is going to be impossible to manage properly.

[Sondrelk]

I suppose at the very least with Azerite being removed Rapid fire will lose most of its relevance, meaning the spec can attempt branching out in different areas. While it might have been broken, I did remember enjoying the playstyle we had in Uldir with building stacks of Steady shot to spend on a giant Aimed Shot crit, at least that made it feel like the hardcast was warranted, as it stands the only reason we are supposed to feel good about ussing Aimed shot is because it does most of our damage.

Master Marksman I would argue is problematic at this point because it is gearing up to be the go-to talent for that row regardless. The way MM is structured right now barely leaves enough room for the few active talents we do use. Not to mention netierh Serpent sting nor Murder of Crows is the kind of ability that screams MM spec fantasy.

Careful aim is also one of those talents that I dislike for being the only one worth taking. even with the changes to Explosive shot the meta would have to be heavily geared in favor of AoE to be worth taking, and barrage has barely been relevant for several expansions now, the only time I can remember actively using it is for when I need a mass AoE for transmog runs or low level questing.

But hey, at least MM gets its iconic Chimaera shot back, you just need to actually pick it as a talent. Never mind that this is some right bullshit, and this is coming from someone who never liked the spec fantasy of Chimaera shot to begin with.
On a sidenote, why in the world doesnt it proc trick shots? would have been the perfect talent to take for cleave bosses, finally allowing MM to be able to actually cleave again, the thing that once upon a time was the bread and butter of the spec.

Must be said though, was nice of Blizzard to at least have 2 DPS rows where you get to feel like you have a realistic choice, instead of picking the choice best in all situations ever. I might actually swap back and forth between Dead Eye and Double Tap in Shadowlands. Same with Calling the Shots and Volley.


In my post above I mentioned replacing Rapid fire with Chimaera shot, but thinking about it, what it should swap places with is Double Tap. Now that is a talent that speaks to what MM is good at now, and gives a sorely needed ability that makes you feel good about hardcasting Aimed shot.

[The Butt Witch]

According to the alpha, there are almost no changes compared to BFA. The extra buttons are just bloat, and MM hunters are still training dummies for melee in pvp.

Looks like another expansion of BM if you're interested in both pve and pvp, because MM sure as hell can't pvp.

[Kaver]

Why is everyone so afraid of a little cast time. Pushing more button doesn't necessarily make a rotation more interesting

[The Butt Witch]

Why is everyone so afraid of a little cast time. Pushing more button doesn't necessarily make a rotation more interesting

Raids these days require a lot of movement. If you're moving, then you're not casting. If you're not casting, then you're doing crap damage with only instants.

Cast times are also stupid in PVP, because if you're moving, then you're not casting, and if you're not moving, then the mouth breathing melee is bashing your face in.

Best hunter spec is BM because it may do lower burst, but you're not encumbered by the terrible mobility of practically all ranged specs.

On the other hand if all you do is M+ and world quests, by all means, there is no problem whatsoever, play whatever you want.

[Dejiko]

I think the most disappointing part of MM in BFA is the lack of utility and having
Aimed Shot on a charge system.

I would like Double Tap baseline, Aimed Shot useable whenever you have enough Focus.
A way to dispell magic and enrage, getting this in the form of Tranq Shot in SL.
I miss Exotic Munitions also, would be cool to get it back.

I`m not sure why my character leans back and roars when i use Trueshot,
a different animation for it would be good, it doesn`t really fit a sniper or bowman to
shout out in anger when they get ready to place a well aimed shot.

[shade3891]

Double tap effect should be added to trueshot. And chimera shot should apply trick shots. Also sequential Steady shot casts should lower the cast time of your next Aimed shot.

[Ginji]

According to the alpha, there are almost no changes compared to BFA. The extra buttons are just bloat, and MM hunters are still training dummies for melee in pvp.

Looks like another expansion of BM if you're interested in both pve and pvp, because MM sure as hell can't pvp.

yeah it's pretty sad...
Legion MM was so much better

[Sondrelk]

yeah it's pretty sad...
Legion MM was so much better

I dunno what it was people saw in Legion MM. I honestly thought it felt a bit shitty that the Marked Shot mechanic meant that you never wanted to cast Aimed Shot without it.
Personally I would prefer WoD MM back. The mastery would require a few tweaks, or perhaps even better a simple extra utility button that makes it more dynamic.

That being said I do not dislike the idea of Aimed Shot as it currently stands in BfA, I just don't think the rotation as a whole supports it. There isnt really much in the rotation that makes you feel like you should feel good by using Aimed Shot. It does a shitton of damage, sure. But compared to even the Uldir build where you built up double damage 100% crit Aimed Shots it feels lacking.

[OFiveNine]

They should just revert MM to MoP MM in shadowlands and change numbers

[RsinRC]

So some changes I'd like to see

Aimed Shot - No charges or Cooldown. Can cast while moving but if casted in it's entirety while still it would get a buff.
I also like the idea of being able to hold Aimed Shot down with the damage scaling with the length of time held, with a cap. As Aimed Shot powers up it makes your character power up visually as well.

Steady focus should be baked into steady shot but slightly reworked. Casting 2 steady shots increases your casting speed by 5% stacking 2 times.

Here's a new one for Trueshot. Leave it as is except during Trueshot your Arcane Shots may become more empowered. Currently Aimed Shot may trigger 1 or 2 stacks of Precise Shots. During Trueshot the '2 charge' Precise Shot proc changes into an empowered Arcane for lack of a better name that deals more damage.

Freezing trap should give us 100% crit on the next player casted ability on the frozen target.

Imo, Rapid Fire is a good aoe filler but have to admit the visual of seeing my toon shot 10-12 shots in 3s isn't particularly kool.

Trailblazer redesigned. Active abilty with 2 charges, off the gcd and works exactly like Highmountain Tauren racial Bullrush without the stun effect.

What I think about the first talent row is if they plan on making a pseudo rsurv playstyle then they can leave it, if not then those 2 talents should be replaced.

Imo the first row should be about how aimed shot does damage. Master Marksman should stay the same, another gives it armor piercing and the third talent would give Aimed Shot a bleed effect that scales with Aimed Shots damage.

I cant wait to get the alpha lol

[Pigglix]

They should just revert MM to MoP MM in shadowlands and change numbers

as long they keep lone wolf baseline

[OFiveNine]

as long they keep lone wolf baseline

Sure, lets turn survival into a tanking spec too while we're at it

[Sondrelk]

They should just revert MM to MoP MM in shadowlands and change numbers

I would much rather have WoD MM. Just add an extra ability that instantly reapplies the standing still buff so you can move and still get right back into the rotation.