Another "I can't breath" death: Police Reform & Protests in the USA

[Elegiac]

oh look at those goal post move. racist squirm when their views of hatred are exposed.

What goal posts? I've consistently maintained that the benchmark for "What is racist?" is "Is it buttressing a system of oppression and erasure? If so, yes. If not, it's not racist." Y'all just keep using the word racism incorrectly.

Nor is it particularly prejudiced against white people since it's an observation of a known cultural phenomenon rather than like, an indictment against white people for being inherently evil or whatever you seem to think the claim is.

[Elegiac]

Caps were on the bit that said I can't click on the blue chevrons to go to the post since apparently you can't fucking see them since you decided to lie while quoting them.

This is what we mean by white fragility.

"white people hold a lot of biases or are racist due to systemic issues within education and culture in this country"

you

"This is bigotry against white people! I hope something is done about this"

yes that's the problem, we are in a topic about a black man being killed by officers with systemic issues around officers and minorities being the topic.

And you lot want to bitch and fucking moan about how fucking bad you have it as white people???????

Please don't say another word, you're doing no good.

I mean therein is the wild thing.

We point out the phenomenon of white people getting defensive in response to being confronted with the existence of systemic racism in terms of examples of reaction to George Floyd's murder and the resulting BLM protests, and the response has been....a parade of white people clutching their pearls and bemoaning how much hatemongering there is against white people, and how questioning systemic racism is promoting hatred towards them.

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nope... a system of oppression doesn't need to exist for racism to exist...

Yep, you don't know what racism means.

[Themius]

i think you have no idea of any cultural narratives or how the educational system is set up here...

want some perspective on cultural narrative? i'm told i look sick because i'm pale. how's that for white superiority?

You mean like how in the south civil war was about "state rights not slavery" and the slaves were happy to be slaves? Oh yeah... that's totally not an issue here.







Versus you know:



A mother begging while her child is sold.

The south have it as though a black man shakes hands and then sells himself!

[Elegiac]

yeah, i do... it's antagonism towards someone because of perceived superiority based on race or ethnicity...

That's prejudice, not racism.

Context, who is she?

[Themius]

I mean therein is the wild thing.

We point out the phenomenon of white people getting defensive in response to being confronted with the existence of systemic racism in terms of examples of reaction to George Floyd's murder and the resulting BLM protests, and the response has been....a parade of white people clutching their pearls and bemoaning how much hatemongering there is against white people, and how questioning systemic racism is promoting hatred towards them.

It's just... disgusting frankly. The very issue we are talking about, they are actively doing yet do not see it. I mean today we have Trump calling BLM on 5th avenue as hate speech. These people here just remind me of him.

[Elegiac]

It's just... disgusting frankly. The very issue we are talking about, they are actively doing yet do not see it. I mean today we have Trump calling BLM on 5th avenue as hate speech. These people here just remind me of him.

Hey, mission accomplished for the arsonists who spent all their time complaining about the author of one of many books on the subject rather than like...actually disputing that it was a thing.

It would not rankle me so much if a lot of these arsonists weren't masquerading as leftists but there you have it.

[Themius]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/08/us/ge...pts/index.html

After George Floyd repeatedly told police that he couldn't breathe, former Minneapolis police Officer Derek Chauvin said, "Then stop talking, stop yelling, it takes a heck of a lot of oxygen to talk," according to transcripts of police body camera footage.

"Come on, man. Oh, oh. I cannot breathe. I cannot breathe. Ah! They'll kill me. They'll kill me. I can't breathe. I can't breathe. Oh!" Floyd said in response to Chauvin, according to the transcripts.
Minutes later, Floyd was unresponsive and was later pronounced dead.

Before Floyd was forced into the ground, he told officers that he couldn't breathe, shared that he had suffered from Covid-19 and was claustrophobic, according to the transcripts.
Floyd was scared as officers tried to place him in a squad car, the transcripts detail, and told officers to "tell my kids, I love them. I'm dead."
Later, as Floyd was pinned to the ground, Lane asked Chauvin if the officers should move Floyd to his side, raising concerns about a potential medical emergency, according to the transcripts.
"No, he's staying put where we got him," Chauvin replied, the transcript states.
According to the motion, Lane asked two times if Floyd should be moved to his side. Chauvin, a training officer and 20-year veteran, told Lane to keep him there until the ambulance arrived, according to the motion. Lane was assured by Chauvin that Floyd was fine and Lane was unable to see any "visible intentional infliction of harm," the motion says.

Lane is trying to get off, Lane is also to blame. he's an office, why the fuck is he behaving like a meek punk-ass little bitch?????

[Rozz]

Keep in mind that discussion is supposed to stay tied to events, not back and forth debating over what is/isn't racism and which forms are/aren't real.

This will be added to the OP.

[Edge-]

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/m...-dc-protesters

“We’ve had that discussion a few times,” Esper said when asked where exactly the order came from. “We had it the other day with Secretary [Ryan] McCarthy and Major General [William] Walker, and it’s still unclear to me who gave the direction to clear the park at that moment in time.”

“See, I find that hard to believe,” Smith pushed back. “I’m sorry, but it’s, like, a pretty big decision. A lot of people there, everyone’s there, and it just sort of... happened?”

Esper, seemingly contradicting himself, told Smith he hasn’t pursued definitive answers as to who ordered the use of force.

“I’m just saying, I don’t know, I’ve never pursued it with anybody because we get caught up in other things more relevant,” Esper said.

The Trump administration, who ordered that peaceful protesters be tear gassed and assaulted to make way for a photo-op, still has no idea who ordered the assault. That, or they're lying and don't want to say.

Neither option is good.

[Felya]

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/m...-dc-protesters

The Trump administration, who ordered that peaceful protesters be tear gassed and assaulted to make way for a photo-op, still has no idea who ordered the assault. That, or they're lying and don't want to say.

Neither option is good.

Which is an absurd lie... Trump wouldn’t take time away from checking bunkers, if protestors were in the way. Didn’t they kick out some old lady from attending his rally, because she had a BLM shirt?

[Edge-]

http://longisland.news12.com/story/4...ing-hit-by-car

So one guy lied about getting hit by a car during a BLM protest, but a car did indeed, again, speed through a crowd and actually hit one of the protesters who was sent into the air.

This, as with most of these incidents, isn't an accident, and the driver is currently charged with assault.

[wunksta]

Using caps isn't going to help excuse the obvious racism displayed here away..

The claim is that because western institutions are designed to be systematically racist, it teaches and train people to be prejudiced. It's a self-perpetuating system that western societies are still struggling with. People aren't just born this way or adopt these viewpoints in a vacuum.

[Zython]

So, is someone who does not consciously uses them racist? Is someone who engages in White Fragility when confronted with such possibility racist?

Well, if you have an interest in being anti-racist, why would you have a hostile reaction to information that will aid in that endeavor?

[Masark]

More delightful cops in LA.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-c...-gang-n1233412

[Shalcker]

Well, if you have an interest in being anti-racist, why would you have a hostile reaction to information that will aid in that endeavor?

Because i don't believe that it helps anti-racism cause, duh.

Because it is seen as power play at other people expense. Privileged consultant punching down.

[wunksta]

Of course any argument brought forth for more solidarity and self-determination amongst the working class people gets abusedly labeled as: "Anti-intellectualism" nowadays. With their pish posh NYTimes and Forbes ivory tower news articles written by those same pseudo-experts of the middle management ranks.

Can you provide an example of this?

[Felya]

For me it's another example of (middle-)management trying to attack the working class people. And also another example of principles of social justice taken to dangerous extremes.

Did you just use a qualifier to split the middle class?

Of course any argument brought forth for more solidarity and self-determination amongst the working class people gets abusedly labeled as: "Anti-intellectualism" nowadays. With their pish posh NYTimes and Forbes ivory tower news articles written by those same pseudo-experts of the middle management ranks.

What? Your argument is one of splitting what middle class constitutes, to pretend that the difference between middle class and upper middle class, is not negligible when it comes to power brokers. Your argument is what justified Trump removing deductibles, to give out a 15% corporate tax cut. You are using the very same argument, that pretended deductibles impacted the upper middle class, so it doesn’t count as a working class tax increase.

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Can you provide an example of this?

You got to love the “middle” qualifier for management. Just wanted to make sure we knew he didn’t mean CEOs or the elite? WTF?

[Zython]

For me it's another example of (middle-)management trying to attack the working class people. And also another example of principles of social justice taken to dangerous extremes.

Of course any argument brought forth for more solidarity and self-determination amongst the working class people gets abusedly labeled as: "Anti-intellectualism" nowadays. With their pish posh NYTimes and Forbes ivory tower news articles written by those same pseudo-experts of the middle management ranks.

Generally, the people who complain about this stuff are middle-management/petit bourgeoisie.

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Because i don't believe that it helps anti-racism cause, duh.

Because it is seen as power play at other people expense. Privileged consultant punching down.

You don't see how culture and propaganda might cause racism?

Either you believe racism is valid, or it comes from nowhere.

[Felya]

Don't even bother. I was talking specifically about "middle management" and the people who end up in those positions. I wasn't talking about the middle class.

Oh, I will bother... what class are middle management? When you are talking middle management, you are talking middle class. Specifically, pointing at middle class, asking to ignore CEOs and corporate owners. Your argument is what is splitting the middle class, to protect the wealthy elite. What power do you think middle management has?

[Easo]

Anyone remember the couple of lawyers who felt threatened that protesters were marching in front of their house? Turns out they’ve got a... colorful history.

And? Let's assume they are pieces of shit. How does it matter what they may or may not have done in the past? The whole incident is dumb. Protesters went where they are not supposed to, a private property, marked as such, read, they are not allowed there. Then this couple came out and started waving guns, debate is up in the air whether that was justified, or how much it was justified.
The gate is strange too, video with the first protesters entering shows it undamaged, but later there are pictures with smashed gate doors. So what happened when?