Another "I can't breath" death: Police Reform & Protests in the USA

[Bakis]

you'd get off with even killing them if you catch them in the act in sweden if they refuse to give the stuff back and start fighting you and die as a result of that...

You just inserted 'they start fighting with you' which wasn't in the post.
So to get this straight, you actually believe that a person stealing, assaulting and killing you would not grant them a sentence?

[Bakis]

you have a legal right to take back stolen goods if you catch them in the act... if they don't hand it over and you use force to obtain and they start fighting you and die as a result of that... no, you're not going to be sentenced...

You need to clarify the wording I use force - they start to fight.
I'm honestly at a loss here, not ironic, but you using force is not the same as you starting to pick the fight?
And this if having context of where it takes place in mind, at home or not as well legal as in every state.
If so it seems I dont know enough ebout US legislation.
However his comments about a person stealing, starting an assaulting and killing you not rendering a crime in Sweden is incorrect.

[Bakis]

lol... you have no fucking clue then if you think it's not legally considered nödvärn if a guy is refusing to give back your property when caught in the act and you use force to get it back...

lol back, you dont think the Swedish law takes context into account. It's a difference legally of someone entering your house and stealing your tv (or photos) compared to you sitting on a bus reading a newspapers and someone takes it.
Nödvärn and envarsgripande never been a carte blanche of using force something you would have known by either having a degree in law and/or having done military service.

[Bakis]

how the fuck would someone steal my childhood photos on a bus...

Clearly my point flew right over your head, context. The example was given to highlight how arbitrary you described nödvärn as.
Almost as silly as one of your other posts claiming someone stealing from you, assaulting you and in the end killing you would in some cases not be consired a crime.

[downnola]

"just a few bad apples"

I've seen some heartbreaking shit in my day but goddamn. That one left me speechless.

[Edge-]

I've some heartbreaking shit in my day but goddamn. That one left me speechless.

I'm what kind of pieces of shit would laugh and cheer over hurting a 70+ year old woman to begin with, much less one suffering from dementia.

Like, that's psychopath "Do you also skin small animals alive while masturbating?" type shit.

[downnola]

I'm what kind of pieces of shit would laugh and cheer over hurting a 70+ year old woman to begin with, much less one suffering from dementia.

Like, that's psychopath "Do you also skin small animals alive while masturbating?" type shit.

Everything about it is sociopathic and deeply cruel. From throwing her to the ground, breaking her arm, mouthing off the bystander, laughing and beating off at the footage, not contacting her family, and keeping her in the cell for six hours howling in pain.

How is any of that "protecting and serving"? They certainly went out of their way to get vengeance for the Pepsi and laundry detergent she almost walked out of Walmart with. It's almost like the police literally exist just to protect capital and sometimes make the state some money by nailing people with traffic violations.

What else do you expect from an organization founded to catch slaves, I guess.

[Edge-]

Everything about it is sociopathic and deeply cruel. From throwing her to the ground, breaking her arm, mouthing off the bystander, laughing and beating off at the footage, not contacting her family, and keeping her in the cell for six hours howling in pain.

This sounds more like shit you'd expect to hear from authoritarian police forces with no accountability.

Weird that it is exactly what US law enforcement also do.

Seriously, the lack of empathy cops have for the people they serve is a huge, massive problem. The 80's action movie mentality some have, thinking back to John Oliver's show on raids and the police fist bumping each other and saying how awesome they looked while watching video of them breaking into the wrong dam house, while still in that wrong god-damned house.

The entire institution of law enforcement needs to be burned to the ground wholesale, and reimagined.

[Felya]

"just a few bad apples"

Yeah, by the amount of footage out there, so fast... I think her kids got some money to spend on lawyers... this is going to get bigger.

- - - Updated - - -

I've seen some heartbreaking shit in my day but goddamn. That one left me speechless.

Look at the female cop reaction... covering her face and ears... they are going down for this... they say they love it, while she responds that she hates it...

[Edge-]

Look at the female cop reaction... covering her face and ears... they are going down for this... they say they love it, while she responds that she hates it...

I'm wondering where the "good cop" who says, "Yo, this is fucked up and sadistic and y'all are gross as fuck, I'm outta here." is.

[Felya]

Video Appears To Show Louisiana Cop Planting ‘Crack’ On Handcuffed Black Suspect
https://newsone.com/3913359/jefferso...drugs-suspect/

“Ain’t no crack in that bag!” the man exclaimed. “Where the crack at?”

In a split second later, the cop who was looking around is shown producing a piece of a white substance in his left hand — out of nowhere — and putting it down on the grass beneath them. The onlookers could quickly be heard saying that the officer planted the substance near the suspect. His body language seemed to indicate that he had just found something.

“She’s recording!” one woman could be heard saying.

The officer then looks up, apparently sees he is being recorded, gets up and walks hurriedly in the direction of the camera.

“Get out the way!” a voice says, probably directed to the person filming. “Go inside! Go inside now!”

From last year, but still...

[downnola]

I'm wondering where the "good cop" who says, "Yo, this is fucked up and sadistic and y'all are gross as fuck, I'm outta here." is.

Cube asked the same thing.

[Felya]

I'm wondering where the "good cop" who says, "Yo, this is fucked up and sadistic and y'all are gross as fuck, I'm outta here." is.

This shows what happens to the good cops... one is covering her face, while the two bad cops are showing her the ropes.

[Edge-]

Video Appears To Show Louisiana Cop Planting ‘Crack’ On Handcuffed Black Suspect
https://newsone.com/3913359/jefferso...drugs-suspect/



From last year, but still...

Jesus, I could have sworn that video is older but I guess it really was only from last year.

Jives with other instances we've seen like Baltimore cops carrying around a toy gun to plant on people they murdered - https://www.vice.com/en/article/8xvz...-reveals-vgtrn

[Felya]

Jesus, I could have sworn that video is older but I guess it really was only from last year.

Jives with other instances we've seen like Baltimore cops carrying around a toy gun to plant on people they murdered - https://www.vice.com/en/article/8xvz...-reveals-vgtrn

I’m sorry... but, what the fuck?

and the 86 people fatally shot by police in 2015 and 2016 who were spotted carrying toy guns.

[Orange Joe]

so what? it's morally acceptable to kill someone when you're trying to take your stuff back if that's what it leads to when they won't give it back... if they want to die over something that's not even worth anything to them... that's their choice... a stupid choice but still their choice...

Not in the real world it isn't. Maybe in your fantasy world it is but we don't live there.

- - - Updated - - -

man... people sure like to think you should go easy on criminals if they steal stuff that can't be replaced and has no monetary value...

Who are you? Judge Dredd?

[Endus]

how the fuck would someone steal my childhood photos on a bus...

i wouldn't even care if someone steals my tv... it can be replaced... that's what insurance is for... i wouldn't even fight them even if caught in the act if they refuse to give the tv back... taking my childhood photos on the other hand? yes... that will be a confrontation... they have no monetary value, insurance can't replace them...

Going off this; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-defense_(Sweden)

"Proportional response" is still a requirement, and murdering someone over some pictures is wildly disproportional, so I don't see any possible argument that you're actually correct about Swedish law.

Feel free to link, like, literally any case where this happened and the killer's self defense claim was accepted, where the thief wasn't attacking them first with lethal intent. Literally just one case.

[Elegiac]

it is proportional response if they happen to die as a result of escalating violence

Not when you're the one escalating the violence, sweaty.

Murder is not a proportional response to property damage - shitty photographs are not worth anyone's life.

[Edge-]

you have a legal right to take back your property... if they put up a fight instead of handing it over, they're the ones that are committing an additional crime... and opens up to the one taking their property back claiming self-defense...

Is there any like, precedent for such a notion? A legal ruling or the likes?

Or is this all fanfiction?

[Endus]

it is proportional response if they happen to die as a result of escalating violence when they won't give you your stuff back and fight you when you try to take it back lol...

In every single hypothetical you've provided, you are the one escalating violence, not the thief.

You keep having to insert a hidden "if they try and kill me first" clause without admitting that's what you're doing.