View Poll Results: Which faction should Covenent Allied Races go to? (Assuming they become ARs)

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  • Horde/Alliance

    11 19.64%
  • Neutral

    45 80.36%
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  1. #21
    The Undying Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    I don't see how they can assign factions to them when our characters can willingly choose any covenant.

    And before people bring up Legion, those were races (Void Elf aside) that had a prior lore connection to an existing aligned race. These are beings from another plane of existence with no concept of Horde or Alliance until we showed up.
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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Leyre View Post
    Fuck races, we need more classes
    Fuck more races and more classes. We need the current classes shaped up.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by shoc View Post
    Easy, Kyrian and Night Fae go Alliance, Necrolord and Venthyr go Horde.

    The main characters of each zone are Uther and Tyrande, Draka and Kael. It's painfully obvious.
    And boring and cliche, but... Yeah.

  4. #24
    Immortal Kithelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nagawithlegs View Post
    Who cares? The devs have officially stated they don't care about lore with the new customization options, so you shouldn't expect them to care about that when adding new races moving forward.

    Also this is unrelated to the topic at hand.
    Because Belves having dark skin is such a lore shattering event right? Because no one who is vain ever got a tan...

    They should probably be neutral to answer the OP.
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  5. #25
    Elemental Lord Kyphael's Avatar
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    Venthyr for Horde and Kyrian for Alliance just makes too much sense to me, aesthetically speaking, of course.

  6. #26
    I've wanted Satyr on the Horde for years, bringing Night-Fae on will destroy that chance, and they will probably be Alliance(if they're not neutral, and if they will be playable at all).

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by SNES-1990 View Post
    They should be neutral, IMO. If you play as a Venthyr for example who decides to venture into the mortal realm and acquire anima for his/her self, you should pick a faction that you think best meets that goal.

    I see a lot of arguments about which side Kyrians etc should take. But it makes more sense to be neutral like Pandaren.

    IMO:
    -Nightborne should have been neutral (received aid from both factions)
    -Highmountain should have been neutral (received aid from both factions)
    -Dark Iron should have been neutral (got treated like shit by Alliance for ages)
    -Mechagnomes should have been neutral (received aid from both factions)

    Heritage gear could have two different colours depending on faction.

    Thoughts?
    I'm not that big a fan of the idea that both factions being involved in the race's story should have that large a bearing on which faction they join, or them remaining neutral.

    Nightborne could've gone either way and been sensible, but I'm satisfied with them playing on the angle of forging a bond the Sin'dorei given the similarities between Sin'dorei and Shal'dorei culture.

    Thunder Totem was not aided by both factions. They weren't aided by either faction, technically. Highmountain owes its story to a lone order hall champion representing the interests of Azeroth against the threat of the Legion. Ultimately, it makes perfect sense that Mayla and Baine forge an easy bond between their cousin races, which didn't have anything to do with the Alliance -- and rightly shouldn't have.

    Same deal with Mechagnomes. Even though Gazlowe and co. were kinda representing the interests of the Horde, it makes more sense to me that Erazmin would go all in with bridging complete relations between the people of Gnomeregan and the people of Mechagon, as one gnomish people, rather than not doing that and dividing the gnomish race even more. I'm happy that Gazlowe's involvement with Mechagon had no bearing on the people of Mechagon's induction into the Alliance. It didn't need to have any bearing.

    Not much to say about the Dark Irons, except that I'd rather see their story continue to develop within the Alliance rather than just tossing some of them to the Horde just because and ultimately diluting their story.

    If the Pandaren representation is any indication of what's in store for races that go neutral, then I hope there's never, ever a neutral playable race again. Because playable Pandaren have no story, nor does it really seem to me that they have much of an avenue for a story to develop for them on either the Alliance or the Horde. The allied races going all in on their respective factions just feels more compelling to me, and diluting that by spreading them around on both factions just feels like it soils any opportunity to develop them in a compelling way.

    So if Venthyr do become playable, send them over to the Horde, and write their introduction in a way that makes me care fully that they're a part of the Horde now. Same thing for Kyrians in the Alliance. I would rather they not be made narratively bland purely for the sake of both factions being able to play them, and I definitely would rather the factional conflict have as little bearing as possible on which side they end up joining.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Nagawithlegs View Post
    What insignificant faction war? Factions existing =/= faction war.
    Fair point, doesn't take apart the point I'm making though. What reason would these have for joining either faction to deal with mortal problems when they're dealing with more important stuff.

  9. #29
    Old God Mirishka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SNES-1990 View Post
    They should be neutral, IMO. If you play as a Venthyr for example who decides to venture into the mortal realm and acquire anima for his/her self, you should pick a faction that you think best meets that goal.

    I see a lot of arguments about which side Kyrians etc should take. But it makes more sense to be neutral like Pandaren.

    IMO:
    -Nightborne should have been neutral (received aid from both factions)
    -Highmountain should have been neutral (received aid from both factions)
    -Dark Iron should have been neutral (got treated like shit by Alliance for ages)
    -Mechagnomes should have been neutral (received aid from both factions)

    Heritage gear could have two different colours depending on faction.

    Thoughts?
    Blizz has stated on several occasions that they wouldn't likely add another neutral race, but the recent blood elf/void elf changes suggest they might be backing down from that stance somewhat.

    Having said that I agree about DI Dwarves and Nightborne, but I don't really see any circumstances where HMT would help alliance fight and kill regular Tauren. Or where Mechagnomes would fight against the standard gnomes that helped and now lead them, under Mekkatorque.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Katchii View Post
    Fair point, doesn't take apart the point I'm making though. What reason would these have for joining either faction to deal with mortal problems when they're dealing with more important stuff.
    When Shadowlands ends we will have presumably solved their problems for them, so it doesn't feel entirely like a stretch to think that at least some of them might want to repay the favor someday.
    Last edited by Mirishka; 2020-06-02 at 11:19 PM.
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  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    When Shadowlands ends we will have presumably solved their problems for them, so it doesn't feel entirely like a stretch to think that at least some of them might want to repay the favor someday.
    And I don't doubt that, a FEW of them might end up helping us mortals out, but that doesn't mean the entire race will join which is typically how the playable races have worked in the past....a few exceptions doesn't mean it will be playable, similar to the night elf paladin, Highmountain warlocks, etc... you see in Legion.

    If Blizzard changes their stance on that, awesome, I'd welcome them.

  11. #31
    Races (aside from Pandaren) join based on aesthetics, not on lore. Lore does not matter in regards to races joining factions.

  12. #32
    If we get allied races tied to Covenants, they will absolutely be neutral. The Covenant system is SL's huge mechanic, with Blizzard hoping to bring back player choice and meaning into WoW's gameplay. They is no way they would penalize a playing joining a faction by having them select it, just to have that Covenant's particular race go to the opposite faction.

  13. #33
    The Lightbringer De Lupe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nagawithlegs View Post
    Who cares? The devs have officially stated they don't care about lore with the new customization options, so you shouldn't expect them to care about that when adding new races moving forward.

    Also this is unrelated to the topic at hand.
    I care. As do several hundred thousand of people who play. Story may be irrelevant to YOU, but other people care very much. The story is half the reason I am able to enjoy expansions (despite them having serious flaws) that other people cry about. Furthermore, the devs haven't stated a damn thing. Adding a faction of Dwarves known to side with the Alliance (Wildhammer) to the customization options for Dwarves doesn't break anything. Fresh Forsaken corpses doesn't hurt any story element, but rather adds to it since Sylvanas raised so many in BFA. So tell me, oh mighty Naga, which customization option is so heinous that it is a disregard for the lore.

    It's nowhere near unrelated. I just chose option three: neither.
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  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by De Lupe View Post
    So tell me, oh mighty Naga, which customization option is so heinous that it is a disregard for the lore.
    Dark Thalassian elves, African and Asian Humans (yes I'm aware they existed in Vanilla, doesn't mean they made sense there either), multiple playable Dark Trolls, Horde-aligned Farraki and Amani, multi-color-eye Forsaken are all against the lore. I don't think it matters that they are but they definitely have no place in the existing story: it remains to be seen if new story will be created for them.

    Does this really matter? No, not really. But it shows that Blizzard doesn't put lore above this.

  15. #35
    The Lightbringer De Lupe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nagawithlegs View Post
    Dark Thalassian elves,
    It's canonically established that the Elves are capable of changing based on the magic they're exposed to. They're one of the most malleable races on Azeroth. Green Orcs are okay but heaven forbid an Elf snack a little too much on another magic source? Or, more simply, got a tan he liked?

    African and Asian Humans (yes I'm aware they existed in Vanilla, doesn't mean they made sense there either)
    The human kingdoms are varied throughout Azeroth's history. The Kul'Tirans are half Drust; Arator Windrunner is half human. Who's to say other ethnicities aren't the result of other heritages? There's no hard rule that says those options don't exist. The only reason they haven't for so long IN GAME is because they weren't designed to be so at the time. Now they can be, so there's no reason for them to shy away from it.

    multiple playable Dark Trolls, Horde-aligned Farraki and Amani
    The Zandalari have an extensive network of ambassadors and representatives from all of the Troll tribes in Azeroth. It's not a hard stretch to say that, through the Zandalari, the other tribes might send some of their people to work for the Horde, if for no other reason, to not make enemies with the Zandalari because, while recently humbled, they are still the most powerful Troll empire right now.

    multi-color-eye Forsaken are all against the lore. I don't think it matters that they are but they definitely have no place in the existing story: it remains to be seen if new story will be created for them.
    I'm not a lore expert, so I'll admit I don't understand what exactly the problem is here. That said, there are two things to note: Sylvanas brought a lot of people back with powerful magic that could result in different colors and the Helm of Domination has been shattered. Surely that last event would have an effect on ALL of the undead of Azeroth.

    Does this really matter? No, not really. But it shows that Blizzard doesn't put lore above this.
    Blizzard still puts a very high priority on lore. You just have to pay attention to the little details.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nagawithlegs View Post
    Races (aside from Pandaren) join based on aesthetics, not on lore. Lore does not matter in regards to races joining factions.
    Lore always matters when races join a faction.

    The Blood Elves joined the Horde because the Alliance spit on them and Sylvanas, the (then) hero who died trying to save them all, gave them an invitation.
    The Dreanei joined the Alliance because the Night Elves met them first and came to their aid.
    The Bilgewater Goblins joined the Horde because they got caught in the crossfire of a fight where the Alliance nearly killed them because "no witnesses" and then Thrall saved them and invited them to join.
    The Gilneans re-joined the Alliance because they were desperate and needed some help, so they turned to an old ally.
    The Highmountain joined the Horde because Baine and Mayla bonded on their people's history.
    The Lightforged joined the Alliance to help their brothers and sisters as well as Turalyon being an already established member of the Alliance and having a great deal of authority over the Lightforged.
    The Dark Iron joined the Alliance long before the Allied Race option was around. They only made it official recently.
    The Mag'Har joined the Horde to escape the insanity of Lightforged Hitler who was literally about to wipe them out.
    The Nightborne joined the Horde because Tyrande is a bitch who couldn't help but throw shade at people she saw beneath her. And then Liadrin swooped in during that window of uncertainty and shared the story of her own people's struggle with magic addiction; instantly creating a sympathetic, understanding bond with people struggling to trust outsiders.
    The Void Elves joined the Alliance because Silvermoon spit on them and Alleria, the first Void Elf, was an already established member of the Alliance.
    The Kul'Tirans joined because the Alliance helped them rebuild their kingdom from the brink of collapse and chose to repay that with their service.
    The Zandalari joined the Horde because their empire was brought to ruin by Zul and only through the Horde's intervention did Talanji save her people.
    The Mechagnomes joined the Alliance because they are Gnomes and legitimately have no reason to side against them.
    The Vulpera joined the Horde because the Alliance as assholes who attack civilians simply for taking a paying job transporting goods. There was no way in hell they were joining the Alliance.

    Even the Pandaren have their reasons with the Alliance Tushui living a venerable life through meditation, rigorous training, and moral conviction while the Horde Huojin firmly believe injustice must be met with a swift and decisive response, though this response should be flexible and calculated for the situation at hand; to the Huojin, the end will always ultimately justify the means. (Wiki)

    Lore is always important.
    Last edited by De Lupe; 2020-06-03 at 12:44 AM.
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  16. #36
    I'm surprised they haven't done more neutral races.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by De Lupe View Post
    It's canonically established that the Elves are capable of changing based on the magic they're exposed to. They're one of the most malleable races on Azeroth. Green Orcs are okay but heaven forbid an Elf snack a little too much on another magic source? Or, more simply, got a tan he liked?



    The human kingdoms are varied throughout Azeroth's history. The Kul'Tirans are half Drust; Arator Windrunner is half human. Who's to say other ethnicities aren't the result of other heritages? There's no hard rule that says those options don't exist. The only reason they haven't for so long IN GAME is because they weren't designed to be so at the time. Now they can be, so there's no reason for them to shy away from it.



    The Zandalari have an extensive network of ambassadors and representatives from all of the Troll tribes in Azeroth. It's not a hard stretch to say that, through the Zandalari, the other tribes might send some of their people to work for the Horde, if for no other reason, to not make enemies with the Zandalari because, while recently humbled, they are still the most powerful Troll empire right now.



    I'm not a lore expert, so I'll admit I don't understand what exactly the problem is here. That said, there are two things to note: Sylvanas brought a lot of people back with powerful magic that could result in different colors and the Helm of Domination has been shattered. Surely that last event would have an effect on ALL of the undead of Azeroth.



    Blizzard still puts a very high priority on lore. You just have to pay attention to the little details.



    Lore always matters when races join a faction.

    The Blood Elves joined the Horde because the Alliance spit on them and Sylvanas, the (then) hero who died trying to save them all, gave them an invitation.
    The Dreanei joined the Alliance because the Night Elves met them first and came to their aid.
    The Bilgewater Goblins joined the Horde because they got caught in the crossfire of a fight where the Alliance nearly killed them because "no witnesses" and then Thrall saved them and invited them to join.
    The Gilneans re-joined the Alliance because they were desperate and needed some help, so they turned to an old ally.
    The Highmountain joined the Horde because Baine and Mayla bonded on their people's history.
    The Lightforged joined the Alliance to help their brothers and sisters as well as Turalyon being an already established member of the Alliance and having a great deal of authority over the Lightforged.
    The Dark Iron joined the Alliance long before the Allied Race option was around. They only made it official recently.
    The Mag'Har joined the Horde to escape the insanity of Lightforged Hitler who was literally about to wipe them out.
    The Nightborne joined the Horde because Tyrande is a bitch who couldn't help but throw shade at people she saw beneath her. And then Liadrin swooped in during that window of uncertainty and shared the story of her own people's struggle with magic addiction; instantly creating a sympathetic, understanding bond with people struggling to trust outsiders.
    The Void Elves joined the Alliance because Silvermoon spit on them and Alleria, the first Void Elf, was an already established member of the Alliance.
    The Kul'Tirans joined because the Alliance helped them rebuild their kingdom from the brink of collapse and chose to repay that with their service.
    The Zandalari joined the Horde because their empire was brought to ruin by Zul and only through the Horde's intervention did Talanji save her people.
    The Mechagnomes joined the Alliance because they are Gnomes and legitimately have no reason to side against them.
    The Vulpera joined the Horde because the Alliance as assholes who attack civilians simply for taking a paying job transporting goods. There was no way in hell they were joining the Alliance.

    Even the Pandaren have their reasons with the Alliance Tushui living a venerable life through meditation, rigorous training, and moral conviction while the Horde Huojin firmly believe injustice must be met with a swift and decisive response, though this response should be flexible and calculated for the situation at hand; to the Huojin, the end will always ultimately justify the means. (Wiki)

    Lore is always important.
    Well that's because they write it that way.

    The real reason Blood Elves went to Horde is because they needed more players on the Horde, and it just so happens that elves are the #1 played race, so having elves on both would theoretically balance it out, which it actually did.

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