The Blood Elves discussion thread

[matrix123mko]

Greetings.

As there are a lot of threads for Alliance elves: high elves, void elves and night elves, I believe there should be at least one thread for our beloved Sin'dorei. We deserve our own place where we can discuss the story, art and gameplay of blood elves without having to address them by comparison to Alliance elves. This way, all our suggestions will be as visible as these numerous night elf rants.

In case of elf haters, "hold your head high".

Active thread warnings:

Let's not veer off-topic here, this thread is about Blood Elves primarily - let's keep the discussion focused on them as opposed to Night Elves or Nightborne.

[Reinhart11]

Wait a second. I didn't know that proper Blood Elves still exist in this game.

[matrix123mko]

Wait a second. I didn't know that proper Blood Elves still exist in this game.

That's because their niche is populated by an invasive species called nightborne.

But now being serious, as I see that arcane part of blood elf fantasy is taken by nightborne, I think blood elves should put emphasis on Fel, as they were the only race to fully control it. Maybe Kael'thas can help them in that development.

[Vaedan]

That's because their niche is populated by an invasive species called nightborne.

But now being serious, as I see that arcane part of blood elf fantasy is taken by nightborne, I think blood elves should put emphasis on Fel, as they were the only race to fully control it. Maybe Kael'thas can help them in that development.

This is what I agree with. While void elves managed to get their unique place in the Alliance without dilluting themes of night elves, Nightborne offers almost nothing new to the Horde. Basicly almost everything they represents have been in the Horde since TBC. The only difference is that blood elves are fair skinned elves with solar themes, nightborne are dark skinned elves with stellar themes.

I know you won't like it, but I believe Blizz has taken blood elves to the direction of the light worshipping race on the Horde, which is probably going to be the most significant part of blood elven identity now. Unfortunately, the spark blood elves had back in TBC now belongs to void elves. Blood elves are now more fancy humans on the Horde side. Let's see what Kael will bring in SL.

[matrix123mko]

This is what I agree with. While void elves managed to get their unique place in the Alliance without dilluting themes of night elves, Nightborne offers almost nothing new to the Horde. Basicly almost everything they represents have been in the Horde since TBC. The only difference is that blood elves are fair skinned elves with solar themes, nightborne are dark skinned elves with stellar themes.

I know you won't like it, but I believe Blizz has taken blood elves to the direction of the light worshipping race on the Horde, which is probably going to be the most significant part of blood elven identity now. Unfortunately, the spark blood elves had back in TBC now belongs to void elves. Blood elves are now more fancy humans on the Horde side. Let's see what Kael will bring in SL.

I have similar predictions. This is not good, as Light is a theme more desirable on Alliance side. As I said, Fel may be a good alternative to it but it needs some build up. We have to hope that Kael'thas(would calling him a warlock hurt?) will add some fresh air to Quel'thalas.

[Vaedan]

I have similar predictions. This is not good, as Light is a theme more desirable on Alliance side. As I said, Fel may be a good alternative to it but it needs some build up. We have to hope that Kael'thas(would calling him a warlock hurt?) will add some fresh air to Quel'thalas.

Well, Kael is one of those unique characters. For most of his life, he was powerful mage. In his last years, he become in touch with Fel a demon magic, which is clearly a warlock thing, but he still kept his significant mage abilities, like Pyroblast. I view him as a combination of warlock and mage.

You know, the biggest issue here is the Sunwell. While it is generally good elves got it restored, it made the whole story of thalassians difficult. Blood elves lost their appeal as a race desperate enough to dabble into dark magics to sustain themselves. I loved original Blood Knights. They were perfect opposition to standard paladin orders, which Blood Knights viewed as proud, self-righteous and unable to act. They openly mocked them and were eager to show them their hypocrisy. Now, they joined them and became the most devout followers of the Light.

I think Sunwell should be destroyed again. It's a pitty BfA didn't come to this. Datamined Eversong Warfront promised so many things.

[Shadowtwili]

I think blood elves should put emphasis on Fel, as they were the only race to fully control it. Maybe Kael'thas can help them in that development.

Partial agree. I agree that the blood elves should be given more emphasis on their TBC aspects as a whole, their entire society changed and then they got the Sunwell back and suddenly al the Fel-users or those that bend the Light to their will dissappeared? I have my doubts.

BUT, the blood elves never "controlled" Fel better then the orcs or other races did, those that overfed still became evil demonic biengs that turned against their people within a heartbeat.

That aside, I would love to see Felblood elf customisation options for the blood elves, to make them more unique compared to the void elves now that the most major difference (skin colour) is dissappearing.

[Mace]

Wait a second. I didn't know that proper Blood Elves still exist in this game.

How do you think a night elf feels? with all these derivative groups stealing the limelight and spotlight on everything?

On a more serious note

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That's because their niche is populated by an invasive species called nightborne.

But now being serious, as I see that arcane part of blood elf fantasy is taken by nightborne, I think blood elves should put emphasis on Fel, as they were the only race to fully control it. Maybe Kael'thas can help them in that development.

This is the danger I warned of in the Legion alpha/beta discussions in an open letter to the devs where I explored the merits and demerits of the Nightborne becoming playable and joining either or both factions. They aren't needed on the horde with the blood elves - and risked just being absorbed and used as purple blood elves in skinny night elf bodies with upturned ear tips.

I felt they would lose their unique identity, supplant the blood elves arcane role while being joined to the hip, so effectively blizzard would only show them when coming to the blood elves, and you'd instead have some blood elf magister npcs replaced with Nightborne ones - the uniqueness of the Nightborne would fade to and absorbed in the blood elf goal, but your observation would also happen, as in Nightborne would be used for all arcane matters. This is not a good situation, not for Nightborne (and night elf fans who like them) nor for blood elves.

1. They'd have been better off either neutral, in both factions, only on the alliance, or an independent group on the horde, not associated to the blood elves (at least initially) - that way blood elf matters would only have blood elves involved not both.

2. They should alter them, make them more kaldorei, use them to give the horde a bit more of the kaldorei, not just the arcane kaldorei side (though that is the main thing) but also kaldorei Elunism and druidism - albeit in smaller quantities and ratios than in the actual kaldorei) this at least gives them some unique function in the horde and can distinguish them further.

3. Use them as an elven bridge between the factions. Make Nightborne and Night elves good friends, those 2 races are the best example currently in lore to use as the example for cross faction friendship and have the Nightborne dedicate themselves to restoring the unity of the elves, with strong support from the Highborne Kaldorei, a good half of the Priesthood of Elune, and agreement (but without much interest) in the druids who really actually want all creatures to get along in harmony, including all races.

This way Nightborne have an important and fixed role and don't have to "replace" blood elves for horde arcane matters, they are already serving the function of unity promoters and kaldorei philosophy of leading younger races (the good version of what Staghelm intended), this restores the type of nobility we saw Thalyssra display in 7.0.1 - but it also allows for interesting dynamics, especially when we meet night elves and blood elves who don't want this and the teething problems such an endeavour might occur.. you could spin lots of interesting stories from this, but the night group of elves have just been freed from the legion and it's grasp and effects, they are more likely to be interested in rebuilding themselves now that huge threat is over and their numbers are severely depleted. The Nightborne are one of the few horde groups (along with the highmountain) that the night elves can tolerate from the horde after the WoT, but they have much closer bonds and ties to them than any other horde race. Blizzard can use the desire of the Nightborne to honour and repay the good ness of their kin as motivation to seek friendship, the need of the night elves after the WoT, and instruction from Elune aiding in that, complimenting the ambition of the Highborne to rebuild and the compassion of the druids to ensure the night group never fall out of balance. There is motivation in most of the night groups for this to work.

[Rhlor]

Wait a second. I didn't know that proper Blood Elves still exist in this game.

if you want to play as a blood elf from the illidan forces of wc3 those are the DH

[Phaelia]

It took less than a day for this to have a night elf fan come and write an essay.

Blood Elves have been my favorite race since WC3, and I was dismayed when they weren’t initially added to WoW but overjoyed when they were added to the Horde. I do miss their diabolical nature from BC, though. The Leper Gnome sweatshops at the tailoring shop being one of my faves. When they became redeemed, they lost their flavor, and I worry that is going to happen to the Forsaken and Goblins as well

[matrix123mko]

Well, Kael is one of those unique characters. For most of his life, he was powerful mage. In his last years, he become in touch with Fel a demon magic, which is clearly a warlock thing, but he still kept his significant mage abilities, like Pyroblast. I view him as a combination of warlock and mage.

As I like saying, the most important part of mage class fantasy is becoming a warlock/necromancer/voidmancer.

You know, the biggest issue here is the Sunwell. While it is generally good elves got it restored, it made the whole story of thalassians difficult. Blood elves lost their appeal as a race desperate enough to dabble into dark magics to sustain themselves.

They can research it without being desperate. This is what Dath'remar would do. The real problem is that they are bound to the Sunwell, which is corrupted by Light, slowly taking their free will away.

I loved original Blood Knights. They were perfect opposition to standard paladin orders, which Blood Knights viewed as proud, self-righteous and unable to act. They openly mocked them and were eager to show them their hypocrisy. Now, they joined them and became the most devout followers of the Light.

They were made really boring. What are they if not prettier humans.

I think Sunwell should be destroyed again. It's a pitty BfA didn't come to this. Datamined Eversong Warfront promised so many things.

That's why I liked warfronts. They were an opportunity to drive racial stories.

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It took less than a day for this to have a night elf fan come and write an essay.

Blood Elves have been my favorite race since WC3, and I was dismayed when they weren’t initially added to WoW but overjoyed when they were added to the Horde. I do miss their diabolical nature from BC, though. The Leper Gnome sweatshops at the tailoring shop being one of my faves. When they became redeemed, they lost their flavor, and I worry that is going to happen to the Forsaken and Goblins as well

I am sure goblins and Forsaken will lose their flavour. Their only advantage is that they aren't corrupted by Light yet, so they can be redeemed if the writers change.

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if you want to play as a blood elf from the illidan forces of wc3 those are the DH

Can you guess what I am using as a tank alt?

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Partial agree. I agree that the blood elves should be given more emphasis on their TBC aspects as a whole, their entire society changed and then they got the Sunwell back and suddenly al the Fel-users or those that bend the Light to their will dissappeared? I have my doubts.

The best explanation is that Sunwell is influencing their minds.

BUT, the blood elves never "controlled" Fel better then the orcs or other races did, those that overfed still became evil demonic biengs that turned against their people within a heartbeat.

They controlled it. They managed to have huge fel crystals in Eversong without polluting it. The only fools that lost control were weaklings that were expelled from the society.

That aside, I would love to see Felblood elf customisation options for the blood elves, to make them more unique compared to the void elves now that the most major difference (skin colour) is dissappearing.

Let's have fingers crossed.

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This is the danger I warned of in the Legion alpha/beta discussions in an open letter to the devs where I explored the merits and demerits of the Nightborne becoming playable and joining either or both factions. They aren't needed on the horde with the blood elves - and risked just being absorbed and used as purple blood elves in skinny night elf bodies with upturned ear tips.

They aren't a problem. The problem is incompetent writers. Blood elves and nightborne should be written as coworkers that exchange arcane knowledge. You can see similar dynamic between Draenei and humans when it comes to the Light.

I felt they would lose their unique identity, supplant the blood elves arcane role while being joined to the hip, so effectively blizzard would only show them when coming to the blood elves, and you'd instead have some blood elf magister npcs replaced with Nightborne ones - the uniqueness of the Nightborne would fade to and absorbed in the blood elf goal, but your observation would also happen, as in Nightborne would be used for all arcane matters. This is not a good situation, not for Nightborne (and night elf fans who like them) nor for blood elves.

It is possible to give both of these races proper spotlight. The first thing they can do is to not put goblins to arcane matters. They fit but goblins have other niches aswell.

1. They'd have been better off either neutral, in both factions, only on the alliance, or an independent group on the horde, not associated to the blood elves (at least initially) - that way blood elf matters would only have blood elves involved not both.

Except they are perfect allies. It is like not putting Stormwindians next to Kul Tirans.

2. They should alter them, make them more kaldorei, use them to give the horde a bit more of the kaldorei, not just the arcane kaldorei side (though that is the main thing) but also kaldorei Elunism and druidism - albeit in smaller quantities and ratios than in the actual kaldorei) this at least gives them some unique function in the horde and can distinguish them further.

No. There is no place for disgusting elunism in the Horde. Also, they are unique anyway as nightborne arcane magic is more utility based(stealth, teleports, illusions) compared to blood elf battlemagic.

3. Use them as an elven bridge between the factions. Make Nightborne and Night elves good friends, those 2 races are the best example currently in lore to use as the example for cross faction friendship and have the Nightborne dedicate themselves to restoring the unity of the elves, with strong support from the Highborne Kaldorei, a good half of the Priesthood of Elune, and agreement (but without much interest) in the druids who really actually want all creatures to get along in harmony, including all races.

What about no? Horde doesn't need more traitors. You have tauren already.

This way Nightborne have an important and fixed role and don't have to "replace" blood elves for horde arcane matters, they are already serving the function of unity promoters and kaldorei philosophy of leading younger races (the good version of what Staghelm intended), this restores the type of nobility we saw Thalyssra display in 7.0.1 - but it also allows for interesting dynamics, especially when we meet night elves and blood elves who don't want this and the teething problems such an endeavour might occur.. you could spin lots of interesting stories from this, but the night group of elves have just been freed from the legion and it's grasp and effects, they are more likely to be interested in rebuilding themselves now that huge threat is over and their numbers are severely depleted. The Nightborne are one of the few horde groups (along with the highmountain) that the night elves can tolerate from the horde after the WoT, but they have much closer bonds and ties to them than any other horde race. Blizzard can use the desire of the Nightborne to honour and repay the good ness of their kin as motivation to seek friendship, the need of the night elves after the WoT, and instruction from Elune aiding in that, complimenting the ambition of the Highborne to rebuild and the compassion of the druids to ensure the night group never fall out of balance. There is motivation in most of the night groups for this to work.

They aren't friends and they should not be. Do Kul Tirans love Forsaken? No, they don't.

[Mace]

if you want to play as a blood elf from the illidan forces of wc3 those are the DH

They should allow other classes to use the customisation - warlocks for starters, but they really are fel elves, they use fel, their melee class is DH, their cater class is warlock.

Same with night elves, they could open up the warlock class to night elves and allow it to use the Illidari model exclusively like a DH - could add the priest and hunter class to also have access to the customisation, they won't be moon priestesses or sentinel hunters ofc, but the Illidari dark casters and fel hunters if you decide to run with that customisation for your hunter or priest. The main difference would be that DH and warlock night elves can only use the Illidari customsiations, so you can't turn off the blindfolds

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snip.

You know, I didn't write any of that because I have some agenda to dissociate blood elves from Nightborne or secretly trying to disadvantage the horde to prop up the alliance or anything like that. I think you would have responded differently if you knew that, even if you didn't like the thought.

MY objective there was to strengthen the identity and carve out a direction for the Nightborne they could own, allowing the blood elf to continue to shine in it's quarter without needing to mix/fuse the two on everything, they are two different elven races afterall, they are not sub-races of each other, it is in their interest to have strong separate identities and it doesn't preclude close friendships.

The perfect friendship we see is eroding them I feel. If that's what blizzard want to use them for, fine, I just think there are more interesting paths that do not involve merging them into one. But as bad as it is it's not as bad as the horde and alliance been written as races of themselves with empire grade nations which is eroding the individuality of the races and cutting away their screen time in favour of "lumping together" the easy route.

I'm a big supporter of racial quests, campaigns and still want a race centred expansion. I also strongly feel that race stories should continue past level 20 and should have progression every expansion.

[Kithelle]

I have similar predictions. This is not good, as Light is a theme more desirable on Alliance side. As I said, Fel may be a good alternative to it but it needs some build up. We have to hope that Kael'thas(would calling him a warlock hurt?) will add some fresh air to Quel'thalas.

The Fel theme has flown the coop a long time ago, better chance of asking for playable Man'ari (Which I'd actually like because I'd make a Eradar Warlock in a heartbeat)

[Mungho]

I think Sunwell should be destroyed again. It's a pitty BfA didn't come to this. Datamined Eversong Warfront promised so many things.

I think it'd been interesting if during her brief visit, Alleria destroyed the sunwell. Or, if they were REALLY not committed to updating the BC starter zones, her presence causes a chain reaction from the sunwell interacting with the void to completely destroy Quel'thalas(the Blood Elves manage to evacuate their population in time).

Either way, the outraged Blood Elves would have complained to Sylvanas, who uses it as an excuse for war. The blood elves could go back to their BC edge, and in the 'destroy Quel'thalas' scenario, maybe settle in Orgimmar and help redecorate it. Less, spikes, more fel crystals!

[Aucald]

Let's not veer off-topic here, this thread is about Blood Elves primarily - let's keep the discussion focused on them as opposed to Night Elves or Nightborne.

[Rhlor]

Well, Kael is one of those unique characters. For most of his life, he was powerful mage. In his last years, he become in touch with Fel a demon magic, which is clearly a warlock thing, but he still kept his significant mage abilities, like Pyroblast. I view him as a combination of warlock and mage.

You know, the biggest issue here is the Sunwell. While it is generally good elves got it restored, it made the whole story of thalassians difficult. Blood elves lost their appeal as a race desperate enough to dabble into dark magics to sustain themselves. I loved original Blood Knights. They were perfect opposition to standard paladin orders, which Blood Knights viewed as proud, self-righteous and unable to act. They openly mocked them and were eager to show them their hypocrisy. Now, they joined them and became the most devout followers of the Light.

I think Sunwell should be destroyed again. It's a pitty BfA didn't come to this. Datamined Eversong Warfront promised so many things.

it's called story development! blood elves have a story and it is a story that many people like!
if you want to play with corrupt elves with power-hungry dark powers who go crazy listening to voices of evil beings you can play with a void elf who they are former blood elves

[CoolOnlineDog420]

Regardless of what anyone says about Blood Elves being in the Horde, I think the existence of a race like them being in the Horde is genius. The dynamic of them merging and teaming up with completely opposite cultures is pretty interesting and could make for some good story telling (if only Blizzard took advantage of it.)

I'm really glad Horde have them.

[matrix123mko]

it's called story development! blood elves have a story and it is a story that many people like!
if you want to play with corrupt elves with power-hungry dark powers who go crazy listening to voices of evil beings you can play with a void elf who they are former blood elves

What about giving night elves progression that they become tinkers now as Elune ignored their prayers during War of Thorns?

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I think it'd been interesting if during her brief visit, Alleria destroyed the sunwell. Or, if they were REALLY not committed to updating the BC starter zones, her presence causes a chain reaction from the sunwell interacting with the void to completely destroy Quel'thalas(the Blood Elves manage to evacuate their population in time).

Either way, the outraged Blood Elves would have complained to Sylvanas, who uses it as an excuse for war. The blood elves could go back to their BC edge, and in the 'destroy Quel'thalas' scenario, maybe settle in Orgimmar and help redecorate it. Less, spikes, more fel crystals!

That could have actually given Sylvanas a casus belli that even Alliance couldn't question.

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The Fel theme has flown the coop a long time ago, better chance of asking for playable Man'ari (Which I'd actually like because I'd make a Eradar Warlock in a heartbeat)

I would like Man'ari in Horde too.

[Vaedan]

it's called story development! blood elves have a story and it is a story that many people like!
if you want to play with corrupt elves with power-hungry dark powers who go crazy listening to voices of evil beings you can play with a void elf who they are former blood elves

I actually play void elf as my main, thanks for your advise.

My point is that blood elves were introduced as reckless, power-hungry and most of them had this "ends justifies means" approach, which made them unique and separated them from other brand of elves both in the warcraft universe, and even to the others. They were beautiful, but they were not innocent, and they were deadly. That's what people liked about them. While I agree with you that they got development, it robbed them of the spirit in which they were implemented. What's even worse, it made blood elves even less fitting race in the Horde. Now, they are now just handsome elves with human culture and human values. You know, I wonder how mag'har reacts to the blood elves, which are now all about using Light, given that they have pretty big issue with this cosmic force, but this will be probably never shown. The same thing goes to the void elf - lightforged interactions on the Alliance.

If the blood elves are to be Horde's race of light users, then they can use light in a way more relatable to the Horde side and more true to their origins. Let them remain to be "true masters of the Light" and have their shady blood knight practises. It is still better than being pointy-eared human on the red side of the world.

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What about giving night elves progression that they become tinkers now as Elune ignored their prayers during War of Thorns?

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That could have actually given Sylvanas a casus belli that even Alliance couldn't question.

That would be definitely pretty big reason to start a war. Definitely more valid than "I think they will threaten us in the future, because they hate us, because we hate them, and their young inexperienced king will fail to control them. I better slaughter their civilians, so they can hate us more."

I would actually like Eversong Warfront to be Draenei/LF Draenei + Void elves vs Blood elves + Nightborne. That would be the WF that Horde wins in canon and it would definitely bring some conflict between the races, making faction war way more valid and believable. Given how Horde actions were portrayed on the Alliance side, I can easily see draenei being mad at blood elves to turning on them after all they did for them back in TBC. On the Horde, you could see treacherous ren'dorei, delivering valuable secrets of the Sin'dorei to the Alliance and helping them to conquer all that blood elves strived to build after the scourge invasion...

[Soon-TM]

I loved the edgy belfs of BC. Kael was also my favourite character from WC3, and I loved the sharp contrast between the nature-aligned, militant, elusive night elves, and the arcane-aligned, decadent, but comparatively less xenophobic blood elves. Them having to resort to desperate measures in the wake of the Scourge invasion made them quite relatable, and the overall narrative managed to avoid the usual pitfalls of "vanilla" (not the game) elves.

But, as the saying goes, good things don't last long. And in the case of belfs, it only took until the end of BC for them to be completely neutered, taking away all their edge, and effectively turning them into a misplaced Alliance race.