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  1. #141
    Honestly at least LFR/Heroic/Mythic would be better. Normal and LFR is honestly useless but I think removing normal would benefit EVERYONE. LFR players would still be able to see the content.

    Now that I say that, just rename heroic to normal and mythic to heroic.

    At the end of the day I'd love to see just heroic/mythic exist but that's NEVER going to happen.

    It's no wonder balancing issues happen lol

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Team View Post
    Honestly at least LFR/Heroic/Mythic would be better. Normal and LFR is honestly useless but I think removing normal would benefit EVERYONE. LFR players would still be able to see the content.

    Now that I say that, just rename heroic to normal and mythic to heroic.

    At the end of the day I'd love to see just heroic/mythic exist but that's NEVER going to happen.

    It's no wonder balancing issues happen lol
    The problem I see is that there a lot of players/guilds which only raid normal and cannot raid heroic (maybe because of skill or what ever) and to force them into the LFR is just bonkers.
    For me personally scrap the loot out of LFR so it's just about the story.
    Scrap the loot out of Mythic so it's just for challenge with some titels/mounts/tmogs.
    Make NHC and HC a little bit harder.
    M+ 15 dungeon chest 10 ilevel less than HC raid.
    Weekly chest = HC item level

    New raid tiers should have smaller ilevel increase.
    In BFA you had more or less 150 ilevel difference between Uldir and last raid.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by Mx343 View Post
    The problem I see is that there a lot of players/guilds which only raid normal and cannot raid heroic (maybe because of skill or what ever) and to force them into the LFR is just bonkers.
    For me personally scrap the loot out of LFR so it's just about the story.
    Scrap the loot out of Mythic so it's just for challenge with some titels/mounts/tmogs.
    Make NHC and HC a little bit harder.
    M+ 15 dungeon chest 10 ilevel less than HC raid.
    Weekly chest = HC item level

    New raid tiers should have smaller ilevel increase.
    In BFA you had more or less 150 ilevel difference between Uldir and last raid.
    Yeah that's a decent change I could get behind honestly didn't even think of that lmao.

    The ilevel difference is CRAZY. I remember a few weeks ago I did Glory of the Uldir Raider and with current gear it's literally a joke. So the argument about the ilevel disparity difference is 100% true.

  4. #144
    I liked past systems and i like current system as well.

    My favourite system got to be Cataclysm patch 4.3
    -hit level 85
    -buy some vicious i377 pvp gear on AH (cheap blue pieces, no limit on # you can wear)
    -queue for 4.3 heroics and farm a set of i378 gear
    -fill out missing pieces with Justice Point vendor that sells i378 gear from Firelands (including some tier pieces!)
    -you are also gaining Valor, this can purchase you i397 gear from the vendor = equal to Normal current tier
    -there, you're ready to raid current tier which is 397-403 / 410-416.

    I really missed that type of gearing. Zero questing, zero vision grinding, zero rep farming, zero essence farming. No time gated content except for Valor Point vendor being capped at 1000 VP a week.

    The raid of patch 4.3 (DS) was a pile of garbage but the gearing system was damn near perfection. No RNG whatsoever, you get the item A it is always item A.

  5. #145
    Herald of the Titans Amaterasu65's Avatar
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    They could have added tokens to 2 last bosses' loot table that would be used on a mythic raid loot and increase its ilvl to 485 minus Azerite.

  6. #146
    I am Murloc! Logwyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A Chozo View Post
    If raiding feels meaningless just because there are other forms of gear progression available, then it deserves to die.

    Luckly people do raids for more than gearing so there's hope.
    What reasons are those? Why do a raid difficulty more than a couple of times if you aren't there for the gear treadmill?

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Logwyn View Post
    What reasons are those? Why do a raid difficulty more than a couple of times if you aren't there for the gear treadmill?
    Because raiding is fun & playing with the lads is a good time. Gear is just a tool to do a job.

    I couldn't give a damn about forms of progression I'm not interested in, and there's people who don't give a damn about raiding/dungeon progression - Having options for both sides is great.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Logwyn View Post
    What reasons are those?
    1. Beat the bosses
    2. Socialize with the guild
    3. Collect item appearances
    4. Finish the storyline
    5. Challenge myself
    6. Explore the ambience
    7. Quench my completionism
    8. Try new gameplay
    9. Socialize with NEW people!

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Team View Post
    Honestly at least LFR/Heroic/Mythic would be better. Normal and LFR is honestly useless but I think removing normal would benefit EVERYONE. LFR players would still be able to see the content.

    Now that I say that, just rename heroic to normal and mythic to heroic.

    At the end of the day I'd love to see just heroic/mythic exist but that's NEVER going to happen.

    It's no wonder balancing issues happen lol
    As hard to believe as it may be for MMO-C where everyone is cutting edge on their main and pugs HC in half an hour, normal mode raid has an audience. There actually are people not skilled enough for heroic, friends&family guilds who need 2 months to progress through normal. They do it, they are happy with it. Taking normal away from them will not drivethem into LfR, they can't beat heroic so you would sentence them to stop raiding just because you feel overwhelmed counting to 4 to see how many difficulties a raid has.

  10. #150
    Heroic Raids are too easy, Mythic Raids are too hard, M+ is too rewarding. Take your pick, but it’s been the same for most Heroic Guilds every tier in BFA (and probably Legion, but I didn’t raid Legion).

    Your average Heroic guild will have the raid cleared within a few lockouts. Then what? They step into Mythic and get smashed after progressing through a few farm bosses (for us, that was 5/12M in Ny’alotha). They then spend the rest of the Tier running M+, often is set clique groups of friends. If they keep persisting in Mythic raids, people often burn out and quit. Those who don’t have a M+ Clique also feel alienated with little to do between raid tiers.

    Basically, outside of Mythic, raiding has lost its purpose after progression. I enjoy raiding, I enjoy farming, but there’s no point endlessly farming a raid for zero benefit for anyone as they all geared up in M+.

    This also ties in to the serious gear overlaps. LFR drops what, 430? Normal 445? I have 460+ geared alts who have done nothing but WQ’s and Visions.

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