Has the world truly gone mad?

[Tesshin20]

A bit of retorical title of the thread, but there is some seriousness to my question.

I see so many things going on in the real world with the protests and now what is happening in the gaming world that I am seriously scared what will happen next. I think its very safe to say that as a collective, we aren't exactly improving on how to deal with issues like these.

What social media is now doing to our culture is starting to get insane in my view. I have read many of these stories from girls who have been victims of sexual assault and I see the "twitter mob" being out for blood and want to crucify every person that has a accusation leveled at them.

A common theme in these stories is that the girls in most cases never said "No" while in bed with the guy. They describe in detail how they lie there in shock and horror and discomfort for 30 minutes while they guy is touching her. I would dare to say that most intimate situations in all cultures across the planet happens this way. A guy will make a move on a girl and just being allowed (as far as he understands) to share a bed with a girl will be some kind of confirmation of interest from the girl as well. I would again dare to suggest that most guys in that situation would do some kind of move, and I think many girls would expect it as well.

It what happens next that's important. If she says "No" or show bodysigns of not being interested then the guy has to stop. But I can't see that happening in these situations.

Disclaimer: I think its horrible when a girl experience unwanted situations like these. But I think girls should be encouraged to have more guts to say no, while do I think many guys have job to do as well, for example to not assume concent based on nothing in many situations.

But why are we seing hundreds of girls now sharing their story about things like this on social media? It doesn't belong there in my view. It's an issue between those to people. The girl could talk to the guy the next day and if there is some sense to him, he would apologize and promise to not do so again.

Why has social media become a battleground for these situations? This, on top of people rioting and tearing down statues while totally forgotten what they protested about in the first place, makes me worried.

I would never guess this would happen 5 years ago, yet here we are. Makes me worried for what will happen the next 5 or 10 years.

What are your thoughts on what can be done to save the situation?

[s_bushido]

just being allowed to share a bed with a girl will be some kind of confirmation of interest from the girl as well. I would again dare to suggest that most guys in that situation would do some kind of move

TIL: Most guys are rapists. You should probably have a chat with the "not all men" crowd. They might not like your assertion.

But why are we seing hundreds of girls now sharing their story about things like this on social media?

Because they're no longer afraid of the dipshits who tell them to shut up and accept it because it's normal?

And lol @ "riots wouldn't happen 5 years ago." It's ironic that people complain that tearing down statues means that we lose our history, and yet here you are demonstrating that you have no idea about that history in the first place.

[Wilfire]

Society is failing young girls. Instead of having positive role models that would encourage self-development and the pursuit of your hobbies, young girls are bombarded with borderline pornographic oversexualized bimbos on social media and mainstream entertainment. Are you surprised young girls have chronically low self-esteem and are afraid to draw clear boundaries when mainstream media advances the idea that women's worth hinges entirely upon their looks and that saying "no" would result in a violent rape and a beating (a HUGE % of porn nowadays depicts real or simulated rape).

The situation with Josh wouldn't have happened in the first place if young girls weren't brainwashed by media, porn and their friends to try to hook up because sex is empowering y'all and all that bullshit. When my generation was 13, we were studying hard to get admitted into colleges and pursuing our hobbies in what little spare time we had. No one was talking to creepy strangers on Discord.

[Tesshin20]

TIL: Most guys are rapists. You should probably have a chat with the "not all men" crowd. They might not like your assertion.



Because they're no longer afraid of the dipshits who tell them to shut up and accept it because it's normal?

And lol @ "riots wouldn't happen 5 years ago." It's ironic that people complain that tearing down statues means that we lose our history, and yet here you are demonstrating that you have no idea about that history in the first place.

"Most guys are rapists" What kind of statistics or evidence can you share to prove this? I would say it has something to do with culture. Which is why in my country, 80% of all the rapes are being commited by guys from the middle-eastern countries or Africa.

I agree girls be able to speak about it. But why on Twitter in public? Why not face to face with the other person?

Okey, so what kind knowledge of history do you seem to think that I am missing?

- - - Updated - - -

Society is failing young girls. Instead of having positive role models that would encourage self-development and the pursuit of your hobbies, young girls are bombarded with borderline pornographic oversexualized bimbos on social media and mainstream entertainment. Are you surprised young girls have chronically low self-esteem and are afraid to draw clear boundaries when mainstream media advances the idea that women's worth hinges entirely upon their looks and that saying "no" would result in a violent rape and a beating (a HUGE % of porn nowadays depicts real or simulated rape).

The situation with Josh wouldn't have happened in the first place if young girls weren't brainwashed by media, porn and their friends to try to hook up because sex is empowering y'all and all that bullshit. When my generation was 13, we were studying hard to get admitted into colleges and pursuing our hobbies in what little spare time we had. No one was talking to creepy strangers on Discord.

I like this answer. It makes a lot of sense and you are most likely right.

[Endus]

A common theme in these stories is that the girls in most cases never said "No" while in bed with the guy. They describe in detail how they lie there in shock and horror and discomfort for 30 minutes while they guy is touching her.

Yeah. This is rape.

You're defending rape, because the girl "didn't fight back hard enough" or some bullshit.

And I don't mean "maybe crossing some discomfort lines", I mean "send her attacker to prison" rape.

I would dare to say that most intimate situations in all cultures across the planet happens this way. A guy will make a move on a girl and just being allowed (as far as he understands) to share a bed with a girl will be some kind of confirmation of interest from the girl as well. I would again dare to suggest that most guys in that situation would do some kind of move, and I think many girls would expect it as well.

Speaking as a man, and one who's been of age since before the millenium, no. You're 100% wrong on this. I've never been with a girl who wasn't actively consenting and eagerly participating. The idea of pushing a girl into something she's not super into is fucking gross as fuck.

It what happens next that's important. If she says "No" or show bodysigns of not being interested then the guy has to stop. But I can't see that happening in these situations.

If you kiss a girl and there was not active consent, that's sexual assault. Again, "legal conseqences" levels of assault. Consent comes first, to anyone who isn't an abuser.

This shouldn't even have to be fucking explained. Just fucking gross to attack a woman like that and hope that she's okay with it.

What are your thoughts on what can be done to save the situation?

Maybe stop assaulting women and blaming them for not consenting to the assault?

Why don't you start with that, champ.

[Tesshin20]

Yeah. This is rape.

You're defending rape, because the girl "didn't fight back hard enough" or some bullshit.

No, its not. In order to believe it's rape you must assume a guy can read a girls mind. Which he of course can't.

Speaking as a man, and one who's been of age since before the millenium, no. You're 100% wrong on this. I've never been with a girl who wasn't actively consenting and eagerly participating. The idea of pushing a girl into something she's not super into is fucking gross as fuck.

First, I don't care what you SPEAKING AS, as your arguments have to stand on its own merit. Not your sex. Secondly I am quite sure that human collective experience far outweights your own personal anecdotes. Actively consenting and eagerly participating usually (at least in my scandinavian culture) starts with a guy touching a girl with his hand when they are in bed.

If you kiss a girl and there was not active consent, that's sexual assault. Again, "legal conseqences" levels of assault. Consent comes first, to anyone who isn't an abuser.

What? You have to be trolling. A lot of guys will try to kiss a girl and it goes badly. That's sexual assault. A guy who just kisses a girl at work is a completely different thing mind you.

Why don't you start with that, champ.

It won't be necessary if you stop assuming your own strange little bubble of opinions somehow constitutes facts for the rest of us. Your opinions is so far beyond what's considered normal behavior between men and female in a flirting situation, that it's almost impossible to assume you are not trolling.

[Endus]

No, its not. In order to believe it's rape you must assume a guy can read a girls mind. Which he of course can't.

No active consent? Rape.

It's that simple.

If you're in a position where you'd have to read her mind to tell if she wants to have sex with you, you shouldn't even be thinking about having sex with that person.

You're defending date rape, here.

What? You have to be trolling. A lot of guys will try to kiss a girl and it goes badly. That's sexual assault. A guy who just kisses a girl at work is a completely different thing mind you.

If you try and kiss a girl and she doesn't want you to kiss her, that's sexual assault.

Literally the definition.

How could that be considered "trolling"?

It won't be necessary if you stop assuming your own strange little bubble of opinions somehow constitutes facts for the rest of us. Your opinions is so far beyond what's considered normal behavior between men and female in a flirting situation, that it's almost impossible to assume you are not trolling.

I mean, my stance is backed by actual laws you can be convicted under for acting the way you're suggesting.

So it's clearly not just me.

[Zantos]

Has the world gone mad? No. Its been that way for a long time. You've just recently started to open your eyes to it. This isn't a new, or even recent, thing. Its been around for a long time.

As it stands, there is no saving the situation. Both genders have major issues that continue to perpetuate the problem. Girls have no strong role models and are told that sex makes them stronger and that its empowering to use their bodies to get men to do anything they want. Guys are told they are somehow less then a man if they can't manage to get laid. Then you have the entire problem that in dating, men are typically expected to make the first move. So guys who cant feel like crap and women don't ever feel like they even need to try create a relationship on their own, that they should just wait and hope it works out.

The problem is on both ends and no one wants to acknowledge them. Most want to attack one or the other.

- - - Updated - - -

If you try and kiss a girl and she doesn't want you to kiss her, that's sexual assault.

Literally the definition.

How could that be considered "trolling"?

This is also another way that these problems continue. You have 2 ends of this. On one end, the legal definition says its rape. On the other hand, practicality and actual interactions indicate that most people go in for a kiss, without ever having asked. Both male and female. So, what do you do in that case? Tell every husband who kisses his wife goodbye in the morning that hes raping her since he didn't ask for any type of confirmation? Tell every woman who flirts and gives a kiss that she raped that guy because she didn't ask prior to showing her interest in him via a kiss?

The world isn't black and white. It never will be. Trying to define these things in absolutes causes cracks in the system that makes it weaker and harder to defend against anything.

[Tesshin20]

No active consent? Rape.

It's that simple.

If you're in a position where you'd have to read her mind to tell if she wants to have sex with you, you shouldn't even be thinking about having sex with that person.

You're defending date rape, here.

No. Pushing beyond no active consent is rape. Trying to find out if there is concent or not by using a hand to touch or a kiss on a mouth (within reasonable context) is not rape. If thats the case. There is basically rape going on all over on almost every corner of every city during every hour. And also inside all the nightclubs and between kids in the school yards.

If you try and kiss a girl and she doesn't want you to kiss her, that's sexual assault.

Literally the definition.

How the heck do you even know if a girl will accept a kiss, if you dont try to kiss her first? Any person that asks a girl every time first has not understood how romantic relations between guys and girls work. How many times have we not heard about girls hoping a guy will kiss her on a date. And guess what, she doesn't want him to ask first. So she is actually hoping for sexual assault?

How could that be considered "trolling"?



I mean, my stance is backed by actual laws you can be convicted under for acting the way you're suggesting.

So it's clearly not just me.

Where do you live? In Wonderland?

Where does it say that a guy that kisses a girl without asking is rape? Please show me that law.

[Femininity]

No active consent? Rape.

What's active consent?

[Yadryonych]

What are your thoughts on what can be done to save the situation?

Just stopping to care about what celebrities and media have to say would help greatly. It is their job to create fuzz and noise, it is your responsubility to keep that garbage out of your life. You said yourself, you have read so many of these stories. Why would you do that? What any of these stories have to do with your own life? Consider these fiction reading at best, pulp fiction of 0 value to be fair, don't take these to your heart

[Jester Joe]

As a reminder, the topic of genders isn't allowed on these forums and this is very quickly diving right into that.

So closing this here before it escalates further, as there's not much that can be done to avoid the topic of gender with this discussion.