EVO 2020 cancelled, and not because of COVID.

[Bigbazz]

There is literally DMs from him still doing the same shit 5 and 7 years ago. Also I pointed out the title was clickbait in post number 2, but there is no need to use it as a defense for this. Kind of weird defense you're putting up my dude.

Defense? What do I have to defend? I see a clickbate title, a hot take for an opening line and a vague article talking about something that might have happened 25 years ago. I'm criticising, not defending.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

Defense? What do I have to defend? I see a clickbate title, a hot take for an opening line and a vague article talking about something that might have happened 25 years ago. I'm criticising, not defending.

You cited another event as a means to distract from the topic, that is whataboutism. Someone pointed that out and you either weren't aware of what the term is or you're feigning ignorance while engaging in it. The point stands, you were engaging in whataboutism as a means of minimalizing the topic. It is a form of defense because it is designed to deflect the discussion away from the original topic.

If you find my explanation lacking, here is this. https://www.merriam-webster.com/word...origin-meaning

If you don't want people jumping on you for relying on logical fallacies or propaganda tactics, I suggest not using them.

[Tech614]

The only thing that bothers me about these situations is when people paint the whole community with the same brush because one individual did something.

Happens constantly in gaming communities, and it's absurd.

Absolutely the entire community is not to blame.

That said people should seriously be questioning all of the old guard at this point. Not saying they all knew but I have a hard time believing they all didn't. Watson hinted at this awhile ago about dirty secrets being kept but no one takes his ramblings serious after the crowd funding superarcade shenanigans.

People like Valle, Aris, Killian, Chen, Floe, Choi etc... I worry about how many of these knew about this shit and never did anything. The old guard is pretty tight nit so I find it literally impossible that all of them where completely clueless on the matter.

[Bigbazz]

You cited another event as a means to distract from the topic, that is whataboutism. Someone pointed that out and you either weren't aware of what the term is or you're feigning ignorance while engaging in it. The point stands, you were engaging in whataboutism as a means of minimalizing the topic. It is a form of defense because it is designed to deflect the discussion away from the original topic.

If you find my explanation lacking, here is this. https://www.merriam-webster.com/word...origin-meaning

If you don't want people jumping on you for relying on logical fallacies or propaganda tactics, I suggest not using them.

I obviously thought he was referring to the part about COVID, and not the part about the "major problem in the fighting community" which is constantly blown out of proportion with molehills turned into mountains, which I was addressing. And of course I'm criticising the clickbate nature of the thread, the ridiculousness of comparing a deadly global pandemic to "accusations" of sexual misconduct concerning one man.

Maybe there is more to the story, certainly isn't included in the linked article.

I dunno about that.

I mean, peoples own families - even their spouses - often don't know when someone is engaging in really bad behavior. At best, they might know that the person is "acting fishy" or something, but no one sits there and suspects that a family/friend/etc is luring kids for sexual favors.

A guy that used to come see our band regularly is currently in jail for charges concerning grooming young boys. Until the day he went to jail (after finally being convicted) even his friends didn't know anything. He was kicked out of the first responders for the ambulance service for some weird shit (turning up to patients houses to "check up" on them) and he was an army cadet, but nobody suspected anything other than he was a bit stereotypically "gay".

This guy spent a year free after first being contacted by police, nobody had a clue.

[breadisfunny]

No, it got cancelled because of something MUCH worse.

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/ev.../1100-6479302/



This is around the same time a bunch of Smash players were accused of sexual misconduct, so this seems to be a major problem in the fighting game community. How can we fix this problem?

i think half a million dead people is much much worse.

[Tech614]

I dunno about that.

I mean, peoples own families - even their spouses - often don't know when someone is engaging in really bad behavior. At best, they might know that the person is "acting fishy" or something, but no one sits there and suspects that a family/friend/etc is luring kids for sexual favors.

Uhh, this shit was happening at public gatherings in the fgc and he was even registering people for evo for favors.

If you really think people didn't know about this idk what to tell you, you can bury your head in the sand but it ain't real life. Again, not saying all of the old guard knew but if you're telling me none of them knew I have to call a gigantic amount of BS on that. Especially since Watson knew.

[Tech614]

At this point it's just you assuming, and essentially accusing people of being accessories to child molestation.

Pardon me if not just agreeing with that is "burying my head in the sand".

Let me guess you still think Joe Paterno didn't know.

And no, I didn't accuse anyone of anything. I said it's near impossible that damn near all of those people knew nothing and it absolutely is. Claiming otherwise is just you trying to defend the scene for the sake of it. The old guard, especially west coast old guard should be highly questioned at this point. Notice I say questioned, not convicted.

[Triceron]

Lets get this straight then

Evo 2020 was cancelled due to COVID19. Evo 2020 online was cancelled because of something the CEO did 20+ years ago. Is something that happened in the 90s indication of a problem in the FGC now? Because I've been following the FGC for years, and this is the first I've heard of such a thing. Either way, one man being a pedo in 1995 is not worse than hundreds of thousands of people dying to a worldwide pandemic, and that is what the OP appears to suggest.

Still has nothing to do with what you said regarding a deflection towards false accusations. You are now doing that by excusing it happening a long time ago.

It doesn't matter if this is the first time you heard it or not, it does not make it a non-issue just because you weren't aware of its existence, nor is it a causation of some false accusation from girls writing articles.

If you have fault with it being compared to a pandemic, fine. Carry on. But you are not stopping there and going out of your way to dismiss the rest of it all, and I'm not sure why you feel the need to do so. Because you deem this clickbait? Because you are criticizing the OP? Please, there were no mentions of microaggressions in this thread or even indicated in the article.

[Bigbazz]

Still has nothing to do with what you said regarding a deflection towards false accusations. You are now doing that by excusing it happening a long time ago.

It doesn't matter if this is the first time you heard it or not, it does not make it a non-issue just because you weren't aware of its existence, nor is it a causation of some false accusation from girls writing articles.

If you have fault with it being compared to a pandemic, fine. Carry on. But you are not stopping there and going out of your way to dismiss the rest of it all, and I'm not sure why you feel the need to do so. Because you deem this clickbait? Because you are criticizing the OP? Please, there were no mentions of microaggressions in this thread or even indicated in the article.

It's more the issue that claiming something that happened 25 years ago is both much worse than a deadly global pandemic and also somehow evidence of a greater overall problem in the community. It's like the community is gigantic, in any large community you will find bad people. MTG had problems with pedos a few years back, does that mean there is a great problem in the larger community? I don't think so.

What about my post do you have issue with? I'm criticising the clickbait, silly claims, the silly comparison (Covid) and the vague article. Is there more to the story as some people have elaborated? I don't know, but the article is talking about the 90s and the OP is clickbait.

[Triceron]

It's more the issue that claiming something that happened 25 years ago is both much worse than a deadly global pandemic and also somehow evidence of a greater overall problem in the community. It's like the community is gigantic, in any large community you will find bad people. MTG had problems with pedos a few years back, does that mean there is a great problem in the larger community? I don't think so.

What about my post do you have issue with? I'm criticising the clickbait, silly claims, the silly comparison (Covid) and the vague article. Is there more to the story as some people have elaborated? I don't know, but the article is talking about the 90s and the OP is clickbait.

Pretty clear on my first response to you about your whataboutism regarding false sexual conduct allegations by girls.

You don't criticize something by projecting your own frustrations of clickbait to support your argument. Its nit criticism if you're not actually talking about the article or OP that you are criticizing and making blanket statements about things that aren't relevant to the case
.
'It's more the issue that claiming something happened 25 years ago is worse than a pandemic' does not excuse your own 'whatabout' examples. Two wrongs don't make a right, and you aren't even acknowledging the things you actually said, you just keep deflecting.

[Bigbazz]

Pretty clear on my first response to you about your whataboutism regarding false sexual conduct allegations by girls.

You don't criticize something by projecting your own frustrations of clickbait to support your argument. Its nit criticism if you're not actually talking about the article or OP that you are criticizing and making blanket statements about things that aren't relevant to the case
.
'It's more the issue that claiming something happened 25 years ago is worse than a pandemic' does not excuse your own 'whatabout' examples. Two wrongs don't make a right, and you aren't even acknowledging the things you actually said, you just keep deflecting.

Why are you adamant to continue arguing semantics and overanalysing intent/projecting? is it not pretty clear where I stand on the topic? Do we have to go around in circles all night? You keep saying I'm deflecting but I still feel very much that my first post was right on the mark. You keep feigning ignorance on what I meant in my post to try to get me to dance to your tune? I've even clarified it for you a couple of times now and you keep deflecting away from that, in an attempt to draw this out.

Can we stop the pointless semantics? If you have something you'd like to say regarding what I actually said then I'm happy to continue, but the thread (and my posts) had already moved past this point and you're stuck trying your best to argue over something utterly pointless.

[NihilSustinet]

edit: somehow ended up in the wrong thread.

[Triceron]

Why are you adamant to continue arguing semantics and overanalysing intent/projecting? is it not pretty clear where I stand on the topic? Do we have to go around in circles all night? You keep saying I'm deflecting but I still feel very much that my first post was right on the mark. You keep feigning ignorance on what I meant in my post to try to get me to dance to your tune? I've even clarified it for you a couple of times now and you keep deflecting away from that, in an attempt to draw this out.

Can we stop the pointless semantics? If you have something you'd like to say regarding what I actually said then I'm happy to continue, but the thread (and my posts) had already moved past this point and you're stuck trying your best to argue over something utterly pointless.

Well so you want to pretend you didn't say the things you said despite it clearly being there on the first page?

If you didn't mean it, just say so. Except you aren't, you're just pretending it's not what you meant and it's semantics.

You have been asking ME what the problem with your post was, and I'm pointing it out.

[Malikath]

Let's not derail this with whataboutism.

That's not whataboutism, as he's not diverting to another topic but instead calling into question the validity of the claims.

Then pointing out the absurdity of the exaggeration.

[Kathranis]

Absolutely the entire community is not to blame.

That said people should seriously be questioning all of the old guard at this point.

This is something I've been finding myself saying a lot lately, but people need to realize that twitch, esports scenes, social media, etc. are basically the perfect environments for predators. There needs to be more education and policing going on.

These are hierarchical communities with imbalanced power dynamics. It's pretty much built on charisma/personality (streamers, hosts, competitors). For the most part it's entirely parasocial, with a few individuals having one-sided relationships with often young, immature, and naive audiences. And to top it all off, there are layers of anonymity, moderation, private communication channels, etc. inherently integrated into most of these platforms.

It is just such a seemingly easy environment to groom and abuse people. Like, literally you've got streamers with thousands of fans, many underage, desperate for some kind of connection (to the extent that they'll pay upwards of $100 just to have a comment seen). And this dynamic extends to esports competitors and commentators, and many other aspects of the gaming industry as a whole.

[StrawberryZebra]

This is something I've been finding myself saying a lot lately, but people need to realize that twitch, esports scenes, social media, etc. are basically the perfect environments for predators. There needs to be more education and policing going on.

Certainly an interesting take on the subject and one that I hadn't at all considered.

I think people in general need to be more aware of the risks posed by streamers and streaming. Against all kinds of predators. Everything from pedophiles to buying used bathwater. As to how you would go about doing that I don't really know. For younger children, it could certainly be an extension of the tried and tested message of not talking to strangers.

Unfortunately it's an area that's relatively new and educating people about it's dangers also requires them to have an understanding of the platforms, how they work, and how they're used. Without that baseline understanding, getting a simple and straight forwards message out there is difficult to impossible.

There are actually a few streamers I stopped watching because I realized that they - and their communities - were all kids and it started to feel weird. I didn't want to be that guy. ><

As much as I hate to admit it, you're right here. Most streamers tend to be in their late teens to early 20's, and their fans are almost exclusively younger than they are. I've never really seen the appeal of streaming myself - Which I think is telling of it being more for a younger audience. Or I'm getting old. Probably both.

I think the only FGC content I really watch anymore is Maximilian Dood. And that's less streaming and more YouTube content.