Prot Warrior - We were lied to!

[Snoowab]

Man....

Before SL launch, the beta testers had me scared to main my Prot Warrior.

Now after doing M+ keys, solo clearing Torgast, and a CN boss, I am very pleased with how it turned out!

Anyone else feel the same or have a different experience?

[Morgaith]

It's currently the worst tank and the worst dps class outside of havoc dhs (which have metaslave vengeance to fall back on)

[Snoowab]

I guess, I just don’t see it.

Pretty fun so far!

[gaymer77]

Tank and healer specs have a handicap when they do solo Torgast so that's not exactly something to base anything on. But when you say you've cleared it, are you talking cleared 6 for both wings or what?

[Snoowab]

Tank and healer specs have a handicap when they do solo Torgast so that's not exactly something to base anything on. But when you say you've cleared it, are you talking cleared 6 for both wings or what?

Yeah cleared 6 on both wings.

Mainly with just happy with my +2 keys. I know it’s not +10’s or Heroic CN, but it feels good

[Snoowab]

Yeah, 6 on both wings.

Only +2’s on my keys, but feels good so far.

[Bigbazz]

Been doing a bunch of keys in the 9-10 range, and my friends (who have ran a lot more M+ than I have to be fair) have been doing a load in the 10-14 range. Seems pretty clear that Prot Warrior is the weakest tank. It does kinda depend because doing M+ is massively dependent on the player behind the screen knowing routes, kill orders, mechanics, interupt priorities and a bunch of stuff only the beta players and the most dedicated would be familiar with at this point.

So for example a top level Warrior (or just one who's very familiar with the dungeons) is better than any average/mediocre (or just new to dungeons, regardless of skill) of another class regardless of how weak the spec is, but if you're comparing like for like Warrior is pretty bad right now. The reality is that it has to choose between damage and mitigation and rage is precious. If you're talking about low keys of course it doesn't matter and Torghast is an entirely separate game mode where balance is vastly different due to anima powers.

Anyone else feel the same or have a different experience?

And to talk about my personal tanking experience (since I main Arms), this is my first experience tanking M+ since Legion and back in Legion I felt like Arnold Schwarzeneggar in Commando, just like roiding out on every pull, in SL I feel like a withered looking for his next fix of mana, only it's rage. Like I don't really know how it was in BFA from personal experience, but Warriors were the top tank spec for M+ in 8.3 so I imagine it's no surprise beta testers were less than thrilled.

[lordzed83]

Man....

Before SL launch, the beta testers had me scared to main my Prot Warrior.

Now after doing M+ keys, solo clearing Torgast, and a CN boss, I am very pleased with how it turned out!

Anyone else feel the same or have a different experience?

Well i feel TRASH compared to other tanks. Dps is also crap. Maybe try something 8+ and then post....

[Prag]

A lot of these M+ dungeons have incredibly high magic damage and we're just getting shit on because of it. My Prot Paladin feels significantly stronger in the same dungeons thanks to Holy Shield and BoSW. No equivalent talents for Warrior.

[lordzed83]

A lot of these M+ dungeons have incredibly high magic damage and we're just getting shit on because of it. My Prot Paladin feels significantly stronger in the same dungeons thanks to Holy Shield and BoSW. No equivalent talents for Warrior.

Yup some mobs got magic damage that reks me like rag doll.

[Toppy]

A lot of these M+ dungeons have incredibly high magic damage and we're just getting shit on because of it. My Prot Paladin feels significantly stronger in the same dungeons thanks to Holy Shield and BoSW. No equivalent talents for Warrior.

Doesn't account for the warrior also having shit damage in comparison too.

[Aggrophobic]

Man....

Before SL launch, the beta testers had me scared to main my Prot Warrior.

Now after doing M+ keys, solo clearing Torgast, and a CN boss, I am very pleased with how it turned out!

Anyone else feel the same or have a different experience?

Warrior is quite litteraly the worst tank and DPS in game.
The synergies that made prot fun in last expansions are killed off and the reductions in sats makes the class feel almost painfully slow to play.

Nah, I don't have the same "experience".

[LazyCoding]

I do rather low keys(up to +6) with Arms and I am actually happy with both play and damage. But I can't say those who do high keys and HC/M raiding are lying or exaggrating about shit dps. If anything they are probably right as I don't see many things that scale good or helpfull in difficult content.

[Shelly]

My general experience:

DPS as Fury - I'm working my ass off just to get mediocre damage when I should be blowing things up. A lot could be fixed by just reversing the nerf to Rampage and have it again provide 25% attack speed. The fact that there's just not really a good legendary for Fury doesn't help either - the one giving chance on hit for siegebreaker just isn't all that hot. Maybe things will pick up once I can get the Ascended legendary and convince a few raid/group members to do the same.

Arms - How do you even play this thing? It's slow as hell, you have to feel out whether it's ok to slam or not, it's rough determining when you should hit execute/condemn too. I know I have like zero experience with the spec but I've never been able to get behind it since the Legion rework.

Prot - Needs tweaks bad. For starters their comment about "we think the choice between spending resources on damage or mitigation is interesting" is terrible since so often in a fight you don't have resources to spend anyway. That said survivability isn't that terrible, we're still learning where to best hit spell reflect and all that. The resource gain and management though is trash. Give it the Fury version of execute/condemn, make shield block free, keep ignore pain as a resource spender/dump.

Other than that the main problem for Prot is the problem most folks are having right now. Our survivability has not scaled with key level. It's all about pump and dump. Charge in, shockwave, TC, Revenge, tab through everything and then heroic leap away or intervene to a ranged dps and kite around. On lower keys you can take it to the face on most, but as the keys get higher the trash is just so brutal in so many of the dungeons.

[lordzed83]

My general experience:

DPS as Fury - I'm working my ass off just to get mediocre damage when I should be blowing things up. A lot could be fixed by just reversing the nerf to Rampage and have it again provide 25% attack speed. The fact that there's just not really a good legendary for Fury doesn't help either - the one giving chance on hit for siegebreaker just isn't all that hot. Maybe things will pick up once I can get the Ascended legendary and convince a few raid/group members to do the same.

Arms - How do you even play this thing? It's slow as hell, you have to feel out whether it's ok to slam or not, it's rough determining when you should hit execute/condemn too. I know I have like zero experience with the spec but I've never been able to get behind it since the Legion rework.

Prot - Needs tweaks bad. For starters their comment about "we think the choice between spending resources on damage or mitigation is interesting" is terrible since so often in a fight you don't have resources to spend anyway. That said survivability isn't that terrible, we're still learning where to best hit spell reflect and all that. The resource gain and management though is trash. Give it the Fury version of execute/condemn, make shield block free, keep ignore pain as a resource spender/dump.

Other than that the main problem for Prot is the problem most folks are having right now. Our survivability has not scaled with key level. It's all about pump and dump. Charge in, shockwave, TC, Revenge, tab through everything and then heroic leap away or intervene to a ranged dps and kite around. On lower keys you can take it to the face on most, but as the keys get higher the trash is just so brutal in so many of the dungeons.

Yup as prot with shit droprate im not even looking pass +6 just gimping the grup by existing in it.

[nocturnus]

Man....

Before SL launch, the beta testers had me scared to main my Prot Warrior.

Now after doing M+ keys, solo clearing Torgast, and a CN boss, I am very pleased with how it turned out!

Anyone else feel the same or have a different experience?

Look, it's good that you're having fun and all. But warriors are utter bottom both as dps and as tanks, which is ridiculous, considering how iconic the class is and how easy the tuning should be, according to blizzard.

I mean, good luck finding a group as DPS ever and past +8 no one in their right minds would invite a prot warrior to tank; why would you? You're just making it harder on everyone in the group.

They only way you're able to play as a DPS warrior is by running your own keys and geeking out on raider.io to form a group that's able to boost our shitty deeps. Something that I despise but am guilty of right now, in order to get past 8.

[Zendhal The Black]

dunno... one WF guild is using prot warr since start of the race and the other one switched for the latest boss...

Monk is all cool and dandy untill you realise the staggered damage is just a dot on them that you can sometimes clear. While shield block taked that damage and sends it into shadowed lands taking next to no damage when it crits

[Shelly]

dunno... one WF guild is using prot warr since start of the race and the other one switched for the latest boss...

Monk is all cool and dandy untill you realise the staggered damage is just a dot on them that you can sometimes clear. While shield block taked that damage and sends it into shadowed lands taking next to no damage when it crits

Or they just realized that windwalker brings the 5% damage buff to physical while doing 2x the damage of Fury or Arms and you can just have a prot warrior do their shout for the AP buff.

Plus in general warriors do have better raid/party mitigation in the forms of the legendary that gives the entire group shield wall at 50% as well as rally.

Oh and since Prot dps is about the same as fury right now and BrM dps is pretty cruddy unless you're willing to give up a survival legendary it's not like you're losing a ton. And the fact is that raid bosses are easier to tank than M+, by like a lot just by virtue of design.

There's a reason people like watching the MDI and we don't have a Mythic Raid Invitational.

[Zendhal The Black]

Or they just realized that windwalker brings the 5% damage buff to physical while doing 2x the damage of Fury or Arms and you can just have a prot warrior do their shout for the AP buff.

Limit had prot and arms warr on generals soooo... that means prot wasn't there just for the shout

[Shelly]

Limit had prot and arms warr on generals soooo... that means prot wasn't there just for the shout

Just means prot does more DPS than BrM with similar if not better mitigation and they needed two rallying cries.

Again, raid tanking much easier than M+ tanking and having high dps can matter more than survivability.