Orc Discussion Thread

[Skytotem]

Although Shadowlands doesn't have much for Orcs beyond the odd inclusion of Draka in Maldraxxus, I thought it would be interesting to have a thread to discuss orcs throughout the history of warcraft and where they're going next, both in design/themes and in lore, especially after BFA brought in their clan groups from the time-travel mess of WoD.

And so here's some starter questions!

What do you all think about the orcs? Likes/Dislikes, Favorite clans? Least favorites? Groups that you'd like to see back or in the future? Do you want to see Clans redone as military groups like the Vanilla era Shattered Hand being the Horde's rogue group and having trolls in it? Should there be any real distinction between Mag'har and Durotar orcs? Or should both members end up present in all the clans? If they stay separate, what would the Green orcs specialty be beyond fel magic?


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I love the idea of orcs being a 'monstrous' race but not innately evil, and willing to fight people but respectful of worthy opponents or allies. Personally, I was frustrated with Garrosh getting the Villainbat, then a lot of the WoD Orcs being very... stupid-evil, and then Orcs being stupid-evil under Sylv, I'm hoping that we skew a bit more towards the WC3 Horde in the future, but don't go quite as far as Thrall or Saurfang have. More in the realm where orcs are territorial but see living in harsh land as a challenge to meet rather than wanting to steal from others by senseless pillaging or rely on Alliance charity... but willing to fight hard if anyone STARTS a war with them.

Frankly, it'd also be nice to see some new orc characters that are NOT WoD Versions of existing folks, or at least some returning faces from old questing (Shokia, Gorgonna, Belgrom Rockmaul, Jorin Deadeye, etc) . My favorite clan are the Blackrocks, though the Bleeding Hollow's Blood magic and Dire orcs are fantastic, as are the Shadowmoon's void casters and Burning Blade's pseudo-samurai folks. I might be an outlier in this, but I do think it'd be interesting to see other members of the Horde join the orc clans too, since seeing the cultures interacting would be fascinating, though for folks that want to keep them more distinct there could just be military groups they buddy up in.

Going forward, it'd be cool if we saw more orc characters pair their warrior nature up with a philosophical one, or with a trade/skill that compliments their 'class'. Like an orc shaman compiling stories from all the clans not just their own, or an orc warrior who started as a blacksmith or engineer.

[Mungho]

What's to discuss? Orcs have been completely and utter ruined by in this game by Blizzard's terrible writing. There are literally no Orc characters I like left in the game, not even Thrall. I have never seen a company so completely destroy a concept that they popularized (redeemed monsters)and go overdrive into the other direction. All orc fans have to look forward to is Geya'rah future slaughter of innocent draenei.

[Venziir]

Although Shadowlands doesn't have much for Orcs beyond the odd inclusion of Draka in Maldraxxus, I thought it would be interesting to have a thread to discuss orcs throughout the history of warcraft and where they're going next, both in design/themes and in lore, especially after BFA brought in their clan groups from the time-travel mess of WoD.

And so here's some starter questions!

What do you all think about the orcs? Likes/Dislikes, Favorite clans? Least favorites? Groups that you'd like to see back or in the future? Do you want to see Clans redone as military groups like the Vanilla era Shattered Hand being the Horde's rogue group and having trolls in it? Should there be any real distinction between Mag'har and Durotar orcs? Or should both members end up present in all the clans? If they stay separate, what would the Green orcs specialty be beyond fel magic?


---
I love the idea of orcs being a 'monstrous' race but not innately evil, and willing to fight people but respectful of worthy opponents or allies. Personally, I was frustrated with Garrosh getting the Villainbat, then a lot of the WoD Orcs being very... stupid-evil, and then Orcs being stupid-evil under Sylv, I'm hoping that we skew a bit more towards the WC3 Horde in the future, but don't go quite as far as Thrall or Saurfang have. More in the realm where orcs are territorial but see living in harsh land as a challenge to meet rather than wanting to steal from others by senseless pillaging or rely on Alliance charity... but willing to fight hard if anyone STARTS a war with them.

Frankly, it'd also be nice to see some new orc characters that are NOT WoD Versions of existing folks, or at least some returning faces from old questing (Shokia, Gorgonna, Belgrom Rockmaul, Jorin Deadeye, etc) . My favorite clan are the Blackrocks, though the Bleeding Hollow's Blood magic and Dire orcs are fantastic, as are the Shadowmoon's void casters and Burning Blade's pseudo-samurai folks. I might be an outlier in this, but I do think it'd be interesting to see other members of the Horde join the orc clans too, since seeing the cultures interacting would be fascinating, though for folks that want to keep them more distinct there could just be military groups they buddy up in.

Going forward, it'd be cool if we saw more orc characters pair their warrior nature up with a philosophical one, or with a trade/skill that compliments their 'class'. Like an orc shaman compiling stories from all the clans not just their own, or an orc warrior who started as a blacksmith or engineer.

The evolution of the Burning Blade clan was odd though. Originally (as in back in Warcraft 2), they were supposed to be the most brutal, chaotic, bloodthirsty and corrupted clan - a clan so violent and so anarchistic, that they didn't have a leader. Then suddenly, they they were super honorable samurai, with an incredible strong sense of honor. That was a wierd one....

[McNeil]

Orcs should have won the Second War. No more boring humans

[Kyphael]

Yeah, Blizzard has unceremoniously butchered Orc lore, and Orcs had some of the richest, most distinct lore among all races between all the tribes; Blackrock, Dragonmaw, Laughing Skull, Shadowmoon, Shattered Hand, and Warsong. These clans should all be part of The Horde today, and represented in different parts of Orgrimmar instead of having a slum for Goblins, areas for Tauren and Darkspear Trolls who need to get their own home. Instead, they were all vilified and destroyed one by one to make loot pinatas. The most legendary Orc characters who should today make for an intriguing and polarizing Horde are all dead. Unfortunately, there's very little to discuss other than what if's and what should have been.

[Venziir]

Yeah, Blizzard has unceremoniously butchered Orc lore, and Orcs had some of the richest, most distinct lore among all races between all the tribes; Blackrock, Dragonmaw, Laughing Skull, Shadowmoon, Shattered Hand, and Warsong. These clans should all be part of The Horde today, and represented in different parts of Orgrimmar instead of having a slum for Goblins, areas for Tauren and Darkspear Trolls who need to get their own home. Instead, they were all vilified and destroyed one by one to make loot pinatas. The most legendary Orc characters who should today make for an intriguing and polarizing Horde are all dead. Unfortunately, there's very little to discuss other than what if's and what should have been.

Members of both Blackrock, Warsong and Shattered Hands all joined the current Horde - not all of them obviously, as seen by Rend's "Dark Horde". Though they changed quite a bit and were assimilated into the Horde as the clan identity was, more or less, completely disolved - minus the Warsong and Frostwolf, but that's most likely because of their relations to the PvP environment than actual story reasoning.

Laughing Skull, however, were traitors who remained on Draenor and the Dragonmaw abandoned the rest of the Horde... Twice.

Though "thanks" to WoD, they are now all again part of the Horde (minus Dragonmaw because they never existed... Apparently).

[Ardenaso]

Nazgrel should come back and succeed Thrall while Thrall lazes around in Nagrand

[Mungho]

Nazgrel should come back and succeed Thrall while Thrall lazes around in Nagrand

Yeah! Why did Blizzard just forget about him? And Samuro the Blademaster? We're so thin on the ground for Orc characters...

[Ardenaso]

And Samuro the Blademaster? We're so thin on the ground for Orc characters...

I'm thinking Samuro was also killed by the Naga

But anyway, we have more Classic Warcraft entities that aren't even shown yet or at least given closure in WoW:

Zul'dare
Nendis
Dagren the Orcslayer
Beve Perenolde
Isiden Perenolde
Lord Blackthorn
Jennalla Deemspring
Samuro

[Skytotem]

The evolution of the Burning Blade clan was odd though. Originally (as in back in Warcraft 2), they were supposed to be the most brutal, chaotic, bloodthirsty and corrupted clan - a clan so violent and so anarchistic, that they didn't have a leader. Then suddenly, they they were super honorable samurai, with an incredible strong sense of honor. That was a wierd one....

I think the WoD folks went out of their way to make it that a lot of clans turned into their opposite as a result of the world starting to die from too much fel

1. The burning blade which was honorable fell into barbarism

2. The Laughing skull became morose

3. The Dragonmaw ate their rylak mounts