Why do you guys think December is fall?

[Onikaroshi]

If someone from the US talks about "fall" in casual conversation, they most likely mean any time between September 22 and December 21. That's just what "fall" is for most Americans. Further, the way John Hight phrased it was more of a confirmation - not like revelatory news. As in, "yes, we can still confirm that Shadowlands is coming out this year," and not "WHOA guys guess what, we're moving up our release window by a month! Crazy!" If they considered "fall" to mean Sept-Nov, then it would have been a more exciting announcement.

I don't think it's being pessimistic to interpret it that way. It could easily come out in November, but yeah, I think it's reasonable to assume that the release date window doesn't end until December 21, based on the info we have now.

It's not like Dec. was really an overly good guess for the month of release anyway.

[MoanaLisa]

Seasons are well defined. Most of December is Fall. I don't think you get to have your own definition of seasons. I very much doubt that Blizzard is using meteorological reasons either. Nonetheless the expansion won't be dropped 4 days before Xmas.

[Zendhal The Black]

Using American measurement methods to describe something to the rest of the world is very bad idea

[Onikaroshi]

Seasons are well defined. Most of December is Fall. I don't think you get to have your own definition of seasons.

Actually, there is 2 definitions of seasons.

Astronomical (based around solstices and equinoxes), in which fall is Sept 20 to Dec 21 (ish)
Meteorological (based around avg temperature), in which fall is Oct 1 to November 30

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Using American measurement methods to describe something to the rest of the world is very bad idea

It's not "american" it's just a different scientific reasoning that some countries use, some don't

[Mirishka]

I doubt when Blizzard said Shadowlands would be by the end of the fall, they meant 4 days before Christmas, most people don't even know about Solstices and equinoxes. I doubt he had Astronomical Seasons in mind when he said the end of the fall but instead was thinking Northern Meteorological Seasons like almost everyone does. Which would be Fall (autumn) runs from September 1 to November 30.

Are you guys just being pessimistic, trying to sound smart because you know when a Solstice is, or is it just a case of over predict and hope for sooner?

Its a case of 'I don't give a shit because I'd rather it release with as much polish/development time as possible'.

And for all your 'well ackchewally' talk - as long as it releases before 12/31, they've honored their pre-order guarantee.

[WhiteWolf]

I mean, the date for when Shadowlands is gonna release at the latest is still shown as December 31st, so I don't know why people like you think December isn't gonna happen.

[Onikaroshi]

I mean, the date for when Shadowlands is gonna release at the latest is still shown as December 31st, so I don't know why people like you think December isn't gonna happen.

If it hits december we won't see it til january.

There is just no good release date in December. Unless they want to piss off anyone and everyone who does any sort of end game by delaying it for 5 weeks or more.

[crakerjack]

I think we're either looking at a november release or they'll say we were wrong and release it Q1 2021. My reasoning for this is that blizzard last year around christmas time put off 8.2 because they didn't want players to feel pressured to prioritize playing the latest patch instead of spending time with family during the holidays. There's no way they release a full blown expansion right around the holiday times when they've held content back specifically because it was the holiday times. It makes me think we'll see a November release.

[WhiteWolf]

If it hits december we won't see it til january.

There is just no good release date in December. Unless they want to piss off anyone and everyone who does any sort of end game by delaying it for 5 weeks or more.

End game is always delayed by a couple of weeks. They have done that for several expansions now.

[Onikaroshi]

End game is always delayed by a couple of weeks. They have done that for several expansions now.

3, and that's already pushing it. We'd be talking at least 5 weeks.

That's no M+, no PvP beyond random bgs, no raiding.

[Azerate]

At the very beginning, SL was said to be released no later than December 2020. It is NOT AT ALL farfetched to think that it will be released in December.

Oh, and Cata was released in December, so it's not like it's impossible to release an expansion then.

[literallysame]

I googled it, and this was the top result:


Not saying you are wrong, since we clearly know what you mean now after several confirmations for us Fall non-believers, but to say end of story and google it when you can get another answer than yours isn't a done deal. Just to make a pun, it's literally(the)same anyway.

[Doffen]

https://i.imgur.com/Af96wow.png

https://i.imgur.com/qdSfu7m.png

Sure, but that wasn't the point, the point is that you get different results. So just tell someone to google it might offtrack them. You are of course correct, I didn't mean to take that away!

[cuafpr]

b.c. it is fall? yeah i tend to feel like its winter.. but what i feel =/= what it is in fact, which is fall.

[SirBeef]

Most people don't know that, most people are ignorant, most companies don't say things that most people wouldn't know. Just because you know a fun fact that Dec 21st is technically the end of Fall does not mean the whole world does. Most people are in 6 feet of snow by then. 4 days before Christmas... I doubt they meant it is all im saying.

Sorry, but this shit is basic knowledge and common sense. Companies have always used localities when referring to releases and openings. No one thinks Blizzard is not an American company.

As for fall. If someone doesn't know that the 1st day of fall is Sept 21/22 and last day is Dec 20/21, they never went to grade school or are lying. For those that may have not been taught this, a simple cursory Google search would have provided answers.

[RobertMugabe]

He isn't being purposefully ignorant.

Everything he has said is totally spot on. One guy even said that if you asked anyone where he lived when Winter starts, they will say December 21st - which I find totally disingenuous. Most people refer to seasons in the traditional sense of Spring = March, April, May, Summer = June, July, August, Autumn = September, October, November, Winter = December, January, February. It is the way people are taught in schools as children, it is the way common folk refer to them. I'm asking you to go out to your city centre and ask the first 10 people you see when they think the Autumn months are; and don't lie about it when you come back either to ''prove a point''. I bet you a million pounds that I don't have, that all of them would say September, October, November. I bet none of them would consider December to be Autumn.

I asked my work office of around 10 people which they consider to be the Autumn months and the Winter months. Shocker, every single of them went with the traditional sense. There was no disagreements on the matter, no debates, no ''well actually the winter solstice begins...''. One guy even said that anyone who considers December to be Autumn is out of their mind.

This forum, and only this forum and only ever during pre expansion launch months, has been the only place, and the only people I have ever debate meteorological(traditional) seasons vs. astronomical seasons. I can swear to you, I have never seen this debate anywhere else before. I certainly have never seen anyone refer to seasons in the astronomical sense.

Let me give you a hint, one is referred to as the traditional seasons, the other astronomical. The clue is in the name - TRADITIONAL. Astronomical seasons are not used by the common folk, because they hold no bearing to how common folk measure seasons and months. I can bet you my mortgage, that Blizzard are not sat around saying ''well actually the Winter solstice begins on 21st December'' so we have up until then to release our expansion. Why on earth would they refer to them in the astronomical sense when the majority of their consumer base have no idea about the astronomical seasons and go by the traditional sense(hence why they're called traditional) instead?

OP is right. I think a great deal many of people on this forum are simply arguing this in an attempt to seem more intelligent than they are, whilst I don't doubt some are doing it as Blizzard fan boys to justify a late December release too.

Ironically, this entire debate has happened twice already during pre expansion launch months. The usual suspects on this forum were arguing that both Legion and BfA would be released at the end of September, because Blizzard promised both would be released by the end of Summer, and both expansions had a deadline for the end of September. Majority of folk assumed the expansions would be released in August, because you know, traditionally Summer ends with the tail end of August and Autumn begins with September. But, certain people on this forum both times brought out their google research history and began to cite the astronomical season dates, and were dead set that Blizzard, for some unknown reason to me and a great deal many others for sure, categorically go by the astronomical seasonal months and not the traditional seasonal months.

SPOILER WARNING - Both times they were wrong and the expansions released in August. That alone should tell you how Blizzard view the seasonal months.

History is once again repeating itself. Certain forum posters are once again, falling back onto their astronomical seasons spiel and once again, those posters will be proven wrong when Shadowlands launches either end of October or start of November, you know - during the autumn months.

Its just like clockwork.

I was taught in school that winter starts December 21st...

Not sure where you live, but that's whaz most people think of at least im central and south eastern europe.

[ReVnX]

Most people don't know that, most people are ignorant, most companies don't say things that most people wouldn't know. Just because you know a fun fact that Dec 21st is technically the end of Fall does not mean the whole world does. Most people are in 6 feet of snow by then. 4 days before Christmas... I doubt they meant it is all im saying.

All people SHOULD know that.

[WhiteWolf]

3, and that's already pushing it. We'd be talking at least 5 weeks.

That's no M+, no PvP beyond random bgs, no raiding.

If it releases late in November, then raids would release around Christmas, too.

[Unholyground]

On the east coast where I live we generally don't see snow staying on the ground until around December 15 anyways so it even fits here, sometimes January.

[SirBeef]

Actually, there is 2 definitions of seasons.

Astronomical (based around solstices and equinoxes), in which fall is Sept 20 to Dec 21 (ish)
Meteorological (based around avg temperature), in which fall is Oct 1 to November 30

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It's not "american" it's just a different scientific reasoning that some countries use, some don't

And no one, let me repeat, no one legitimately uses meteorological definitions for seasons unless they are arguing in bad faith. Period.