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  1. #1

    Why do you guys think December is fall?

    I doubt when Blizzard said Shadowlands would be by the end of the fall, they meant 4 days before Christmas, most people don't even know about Solstices and equinoxes. I doubt he had Astronomical Seasons in mind when he said the end of the fall but instead was thinking Northern Meteorological Seasons like almost everyone does. Which would be Fall (autumn) runs from September 1 to November 30.

    Are you guys just being pessimistic, trying to sound smart because you know when a Solstice is, or is it just a case of over predict and hope for sooner?

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by joebob42 View Post
    We "think" it is fall because it IS fall.

    Autumn 2020 in Northern Hemisphere will begin on Tuesday, September 22 and ends on Monday, December 21.

    Why are you being purposely ignorant?
    Well said !

  3. #3
    Just going to re-iterate what joe said.
    Blizzard is an American company. They go by a standard system that's been in place here for oh, I dunno, ever. There is no pessimism people are going by. They're just going by what he said and inferring it correctly based on location.

  4. #4
    The Patient Valkari's Avatar
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    Maybe it's just the Alaska in me talking, but anything after Halloween is generally considered winter around here. Sort of surprised me that Fall officially runs halfway through winter.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by joebob42 View Post
    We "think" it is fall because it IS fall.

    Autumn 2020 in Northern Hemisphere will begin on Tuesday, September 22 and ends on Monday, December 21.

    Why are you being purposely ignorant?
    Most people don't know that, most people are ignorant, most companies don't say things that most people wouldn't know. Just because you know a fun fact that Dec 21st is technically the end of Fall does not mean the whole world does. Most people are in 6 feet of snow by then. 4 days before Christmas... I doubt they meant it is all im saying.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by joebob42 View Post
    Autumn 2020 in Northern Hemisphere will begin on Tuesday, September 22 and ends on Monday, December 21.
    At least in Denmark, fall/Autumn in terms of the calendar year refers to September, October and November. The astronomical definition is rarely used if at all.
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  7. #7
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    They should have said Q4. It would have solved the problem.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Unlimited Power View Post
    At least in Denmark, fall/Autumn in terms of the calendar year refers to September, October and November. The astronomical definition is rarely used if at all.
    I live in Canada. Winter appears "really" before 21 december. However, this definition may vary from country to country. Using the formal definition of the fall season (which is the good way because it is based on astronomical events) is the most neutral way Blizzard can go. But no, Blizzard cannot win...jeez.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by BetrayedOf52 View Post
    Most people don't know that, most people are ignorant, most companies don't say things that most people wouldn't know. Just because you know a fun fact that Dec 21st is technically the end of Fall does not mean the whole world does. Most people are in 6 feet of snow by then. 4 days before Christmas... I doubt they meant it is all im saying.
    If you think the fact that he said "Fall" was an estimate based on a hunch and not a choice of words based on internal discussions and corporate decisions, you're more than a little naive. He didn't say it as a vague estimation because there's no room for him to do that.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by BetrayedOf52 View Post
    I doubt when Blizzard said Shadowlands would be by the end of the fall, they meant 4 days before Christmas, most people don't even know about Solstices and equinoxes. I doubt he had Astronomical Seasons in mind when he said the end of the fall but instead was thinking Northern Meteorological Seasons like almost everyone does. Which would be Fall (autumn) runs from September 1 to November 30.

    Are you guys just being pessimistic, trying to sound smart because you know when a Solstice is, or is it just a case of over predict and hope for sooner?
    I can't recall them saying end of fall? I believe all they said was fall, which could be anywhere from september to mid decemeber.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by joebob42 View Post
    We "think" it is fall because it IS fall.

    Autumn 2020 in Northern Hemisphere will begin on Tuesday, September 22 and ends on Monday, December 21.

    Why are you being purposely ignorant?
    Why are you being purposely ignorant?

    https://www.ncei.noaa.gov/news/meteo...omical-seasons

    Both are correct.

    By Meteorological reckoning winter starts on December 1st. By Astronomical reckoning it starts on winter solstice.
    Last edited by IIBloodXLustII; 2020-07-16 at 05:16 PM.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Valkari View Post
    Maybe it's just the Alaska in me talking, but anything after Halloween is generally considered winter around here. Sort of surprised me that Fall officially runs halfway through winter.
    To be fair you only have 2 seasons, winter and almost winter.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by joebob42 View Post
    We "think" it is fall because it IS fall.

    Autumn 2020 in Northern Hemisphere will begin on Tuesday, September 22 and ends on Monday, December 21.

    Why are you being purposely ignorant?
    He isn't being purposefully ignorant.

    Everything he has said is totally spot on. One guy even said that if you asked anyone where he lived when Winter starts, they will say December 21st - which I find totally disingenuous. Most people refer to seasons in the traditional sense of Spring = March, April, May, Summer = June, July, August, Autumn = September, October, November, Winter = December, January, February. It is the way people are taught in schools as children, it is the way common folk refer to them. I'm asking you to go out to your city centre and ask the first 10 people you see when they think the Autumn months are; and don't lie about it when you come back either to ''prove a point''. I bet you a million pounds that I don't have, that all of them would say September, October, November. I bet none of them would consider December to be Autumn.

    I asked my work office of around 10 people which they consider to be the Autumn months and the Winter months. Shocker, every single of them went with the traditional sense. There was no disagreements on the matter, no debates, no ''well actually the winter solstice begins...''. One guy even said that anyone who considers December to be Autumn is out of their mind.

    This forum, and only this forum and only ever during pre expansion launch months, has been the only place, and the only people I have ever debate meteorological(traditional) seasons vs. astronomical seasons. I can swear to you, I have never seen this debate anywhere else before. I certainly have never seen anyone refer to seasons in the astronomical sense.

    Let me give you a hint, one is referred to as the traditional seasons, the other astronomical. The clue is in the name - TRADITIONAL. Astronomical seasons are not used by the common folk, because they hold no bearing to how common folk measure seasons and months. I can bet you my mortgage, that Blizzard are not sat around saying ''well actually the Winter solstice begins on 21st December'' so we have up until then to release our expansion. Why on earth would they refer to them in the astronomical sense when the majority of their consumer base have no idea about the astronomical seasons and go by the traditional sense(hence why they're called traditional) instead?

    OP is right. I think a great deal many of people on this forum are simply arguing this in an attempt to seem more intelligent than they are, whilst I don't doubt some are doing it as Blizzard fan boys to justify a late December release too.

    Ironically, this entire debate has happened twice already during pre expansion launch months. The usual suspects on this forum were arguing that both Legion and BfA would be released at the end of September, because Blizzard promised both would be released by the end of Summer, and both expansions had a deadline for the end of September. Majority of folk assumed the expansions would be released in August, because you know, traditionally Summer ends with the tail end of August and Autumn begins with September. But, certain people on this forum both times brought out their google research history and began to cite the astronomical season dates, and were dead set that Blizzard, for some unknown reason to me and a great deal many others for sure, categorically go by the astronomical seasonal months and not the traditional seasonal months.

    SPOILER WARNING - Both times they were wrong and the expansions released in August. That alone should tell you how Blizzard view the seasonal months.

    History is once again repeating itself. Certain forum posters are once again, falling back onto their astronomical seasons spiel and once again, those posters will be proven wrong when Shadowlands launches either end of October or start of November, you know - during the autumn months.

    Its just like clockwork.
    Last edited by Santandame; 2020-07-16 at 05:20 PM.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Dahij View Post
    I can't recall them saying end of fall? I believe all they said was fall, which could be anywhere from september to mid decemeber.
    My statement stays true, even if I got that small detail wrong.

  14. #14
    Lol should of said “Fall + or - a handful of days into the previous and subsequent season(s)”

    Prob be late fall, around Thanksgiving before Christmas which is good since it gives more time to polish, but don’t take anything wholesome deadlines get pushed all the time.

  15. #15
    Because people think that they would be stupid enough to say fall as a sneaky way of putting it mid-December, when they know that by saying Fall they are setting consumer and investor expectations before then.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by BetrayedOf52 View Post
    My statement stays true, even if I got that small detail wrong.
    The large detail you got wrong is to assume he was talking like a regular Joe rather than the massive corporation representative he is.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nagawithlegs View Post
    Because people think that they would be stupid enough to say fall as a sneaky way of putting it mid-December, when they know that by saying Fall they are setting consumer and investor expectations before then.
    Consumers may be stupid enough to do that, but that's some shitty investors if they don't know what "fall" means.

  17. #17
    I think if Shadowlands ships anywhere between September 1 - December 21, then they've technically honored their statement since that would cover all time for either way of defining 'Fall'. Personally, I've always thought of fall in line with the Solstice, but maybe I'm not the common case. That's what I was taught growing up, but that was in the early 80s.

    I hope they release early November or right after Thanksgiving in the US, so that there is less interference with holidays.

  18. #18
    In North America, Fall ends in December not sure why it is so hard to comprehend lol.

    Expansion is likely launching close to Halloween because it fits the theme of the expansion though, not sure why people think it will be close to xmas. They have had almost twice as long to develop this as BFA from what I can tell and the last few Betas only lasted an average of like 4 months.
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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Segus1992 View Post
    The large detail you got wrong is to assume he was talking like a regular Joe rather than the massive corporation representative he is.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Consumers may be stupid enough to do that, but that's some shitty investors if they don't know what "fall" means.
    Aye, I'm sure all those investors are budding astronomers.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by BetrayedOf52 View Post
    Most people don't know that, most people are ignorant, most companies don't say things that most people wouldn't know. Just because you know a fun fact that Dec 21st is technically the end of Fall does not mean the whole world does. Most people are in 6 feet of snow by then. 4 days before Christmas... I doubt they meant it is all im saying.
    Most people have access to Google and can figure it out. Most people understand that ignorance isn't a good excuse.

    When video game companies specify a season for a release window, they do so very intentionally. If they specified fall, then they mean that it could come out at any point, including at the very end of fall.
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