An early look at them great vault, i.e. the new weekly chest.

[Gorsameth]

I don’t think this system makes it to live. The time/effort=reward in regards to M+ is simply not tuned, it should be 1-3-7 or something.
Also going to be fixed is the ”lowest” key thing. As it stands now; lets say I do 4 15+, one 14 and then help a friend do a 2. I get a 2 instead of a 14.

No, it doesn't for the 5 run option it takes your highest 5, 15,15,15,15,14 and then you get your lowest. 14. The 2 is not counted because its not in your top 5.

[Kul]

No, it doesn't for the 5 run option it takes your highest 5, 15,15,15,15,14 and then you get your lowest. 14. The 2 is not counted because its not in your top 5.

Thats not great though. So I change my runs to 15, 15, 15, 14 then help a friend. I get a 2.

https://www.wowhead.com/news=317215/...-chest-is-dete

[Orwell7]

Thats not great though. So I change my runs to 15, 15, 15, 14 then help a friend. I get a 2.

https://www.wowhead.com/news=317215/...-chest-is-dete

Yes, there are scenarios where you shoot yourself in the foot.
However, why did you do only 4 high level keys and not 5?
If the rule is the lowest of top 4, you do 3 high levels and 1 low and complain?
If the rule is the lowest of top 3, you do 2 high level keys and 1 +2 and complain?

This is not a "bad" system, as you cannot do 1x +15 and then 4x +2, or 14x +2 and get additional rewards, WHICH IS a really boring time investment for additional RNG protection.

[Nnyco]

Thats not great though. So I change my runs to 15, 15, 15, 14 then help a friend. I get a 2.

https://www.wowhead.com/news=317215/...-chest-is-dete

Thats like complaining you dont get a weekly chest right now, because you killed 3 out of 4 bosses in a dungeon. You want the reward, you gotta hit the quota to earn it.

[Kul]

Yes, there are scenarios where you shoot yourself in the foot.
However, why did you do only 4 high level keys and not 5?
If the rule is the lowest of top 4, you do 3 high levels and 1 low and complain?
If the rule is the lowest of top 3, you do 2 high level keys and 1 +2 and complain?

This is not a "bad" system, as you cannot do 1x +15 and then 4x +2, or 14x +2 and get additional rewards, WHICH IS a really boring time investment for additional RNG protection.

My main point is that I think the effort in doing 15 +15 runs is insane and that even 5 +15 runs is pushing it, which is why 1-3-7 is my suggestion.

[Twdft]

Thats not great though. So I change my runs to 15, 15, 15, 14 then help a friend. I get a 2.

https://www.wowhead.com/news=317215/...-chest-is-dete

What was the alternative to help your friend through a +2? If you didn't do the run you wouldn't get a second option anyway.

That said, the system promotes selfishness. Because if players have only time for 1 more m+ and the alternatives are helping a friend through a +2 or pugging a +15 for themselves... not everyone will help a friend out.

Btw, the datamined string is:

Complete Mythic Level %1$d dungeons. The reward is based on the lowest level of your top %2$d runs.

Note the different variable names. We still don't know if for the 5 dungeons option it really is the 5th lowest run that counts. In the example you linked it could also be the 4th lowest because they did a +10 both as 4th and 5th lowest.

[Kul]

Thats like complaining you dont get a weekly chest right now, because you killed 3 out of 4 bosses in a dungeon. You want the reward, you gotta hit the quota to earn it.

And the quota is currently not tuned correctly. Or do you think killing 10/12 raidbosses or getting 250 conquest is equal to doing FIFTEEN 15+ per week.

[Nnyco]

And the quota is currently not tuned correctly. Or do you think killing 10/12 raidbosses or getting 250 conquest is equal to doing FIFTEEN 15+ per week.

Of course not 250conquest points is such a joke number compared to 10 raid bosses(esspecially once you hit farm) and even more to 15m+, but we mainly talk right now about the m+ way to earn it.

[Gorsameth]

Thats not great though. So I change my runs to 15, 15, 15, 14 then help a friend. I get a 2.

https://www.wowhead.com/news=317215/...-chest-is-dete

And if you don't help your friend you don't get an option at all because you didn't do 5 dungeons. How does that punish you?

You have done 5 +15 runs, you do a +4 to help someone, you will get a +15 ilvl in your 1st and 2nd options. There is no penalty.
You did 4 +15 runs, you get 1 +15ilvl option.
you did 4 +15 runs and a +4, you get 1 +15 ilvl option and 1 +4. There is no penalty because without the +4 there would be no second option.

Edit: Yes, you can certainly argue that 15 is to many.

[Kul]

And if you don't help your friend you don't get an option at all because you didn't do 5 dungeons. How does that punish you?

You have done 5 +15 runs, you do a +4 to help someone, you will get a +15 ilvl in your 1st and 2nd options. There is no penalty.
You did 4 +15 runs, you get 1 +15ilvl option.
you did 4 +15 runs and a +4, you get 1 +15 ilvl option and 1 +4. There is no penalty because without the +4 there would be no second option.

Edit: Yes, you can certainly argue that 15 is to many.

Well, doing a +4 with a friends alt will probably take me as much time as to just do the extra +15 which will make most people do that instead. So I get 2 15 options and my friends alt gets no run...

[Bloodyleech]

Some may forget how much time even 5 15s will take (especially at the start of the exp). 5 15s will be almost equal to heroic-raid one shot clears. Dont even talk about 15 15s - it would be like having 3! more raid nights each week /shrug.
1 / 3 / 7 is way more human and would put the last reward chest on an equal time investment as a full heroic clear.

[munkeyinorbit]

You can do so pretty easily depending on how deep into mythic raiding we are talking... I would say the first few mythic bosses are on par with a 15.

I was actually asking someone who plays the game. Thanks for the laugh though. I know 15s are not even close to the difficulty of a mythic boss.

- - - Updated - - -

Well, doing a +4 with a friends alt will probably take me as much time as to just do the extra +15 which will make most people do that instead. So I get 2 15 options and my friends alt gets no run...

Or you do 6 runs because he's your friend. Or maybe he's not really your friend and you put more value on the possibility of better pixels over friendship. No wonder your friend doesn't like running with you.

[Bloodyleech]

I was actually asking someone who plays the game. Thanks for the laugh though. I know 15s are not even close to the difficulty of a mythic boss.

- - - Updated - - -



Or you do 6 runs because he's your friend. Or maybe he's not really your friend and you put more value on the possibility of better pixels over friendship. No wonder your friend doesn't like running with you.

Time. Always remember that not everyone got infinite time. Maybe he can only play up to 3 hours a week (5 15s + some other stuff)?

[Segus1992]

The fact that people are actually complaining about this new system speaks more about the players than it does the system itself. The amount of entitled children in this thread is hilarious.

The only thing more childish and self-absorbed than complaining about an improved system is complaining about the complaining as if your opinion matters.

[Doffen]

https://www.wowhead.com/news=317215/...-chest-is-dete

Updated how they assume it will work. Note, assume. But if they predict it correctly you can help your friend for option 1 and 2 seeing 1 chest is highest m+ done that week, second chest is the lowest of your 5 top runs. What you do after 5 high keys should not affect choice nr 2.

If you want the 15 to be a 15 however you need 15 of 15+ chests, then you can boost your friend in a 2 if you got time for more...

I guess the 15 runs per week should be slashed to 10 to be more in line with the other choices. Imo.

[Bloodyleech]

And for the vast majority of cutting edge guilds it will take a fair while to get 5 bosses down in 3 hours every week. If anything, the first two tiers of M+ vault choices are easier than the raiding ones.

Heck if Denathrius is as hard as Ghuun, very few guilds will be able to consistently kill him every week; killing him once can be a long distance from having him on farm. The third tier choice at mythic will could easily be inaccessible for many people who can still do 15 dungeons if they have the time.

I wasn't saying anything towards mythic raiding though. Ofc the 2nd and 3rd part of the raiding weekly chest is not that easy if you want to do it on mythic quality.
15 15s still take some time. For most raiding people (2 1/2h-3h raids 2x/week) it would be 3 additional evenings just to get all 15s done. It's not something you can >just< do (same as mythic raiding ofc).

[Bloodyleech]

I am jut saying, the full Mythic clear of raiding is more challenging than M15 Dungeons.
The real question is how the loot will scale with PvP rating. I'd say it's very likely to be the hardest since you cannot just get the easiest dungeon or boss done; you need to get your rating high. And if max ilvl requires 2400, that's harder than any M15 or any Mythic raid's first boss.

We don't know the ilvl yet, but if it's like in BFA, you should get a mythic-raid-quality item via 15s, so I guess you could get a higher-than-mythic item if you do the weekly raid on mythic? I don't really think that we get the same ilvl on every highest-done content wise. Mythic raid and High-end rated should grant slightly higher ilvl than 15s, because, as you already said, 15s are the easiest of these 3. Heroic raid should give the same weekly-ilvl as 15s imo.

[CalamityHeart]

I can agree with the argument that 15 M+ runs might be a bit much. I can see that number being taken down to 10 instead and the number of your top runs that's taken into consideration per tier of choice being 1/4/8 or something like that.

Even though people will definitely game the system by doing 8 high keys and 2 stupid low keys, I feel like it'll be worth it for Blizzard to be slightly lenient and give people room to be able to use those one or two "freebie" runs at the end of the week to help people out who might need it and not feel at all like they'd be being punished for it. It just seems to me like it'd help more than it'd hurt, especially considering that no matter what, you're just gonna get one item out of the chest anyway, which is a strong enough floodgate on the system that that sort of leniency is affordable.

But that's a tuning issue, not an issue with the system itself. I'm still very much of the mind that this system is fine and the naysaying around it is just overblown and insane.

[Gorsameth]

We don't know the ilvl yet, but if it's like in BFA, you should get a mythic-raid-quality item via 15s, so I guess you could get a higher-than-mythic item if you do the weekly raid on mythic? I don't really think that we get the same ilvl on every highest-done content wise. Mythic raid and High-end rated should grant slightly higher ilvl than 15s, because, as you already said, 15s are the easiest of these 3. Heroic raid should give the same weekly-ilvl as 15s imo.

Don't forget the weekly chest is part of the constant 'nerfing' of content by giving you mythic level loot to help you progress. So Mythic+ being an easier way to get Mythic Raid ilvl loot is an intended feature, not a problem/mistake.

[Bloodyleech]

Don't forget the weekly chest is part of the constant 'nerfing' of content by giving you mythic level loot to help you progress. So Mythic+ being an easier way to get Mythic Raid ilvl loot is an intended feature, not a problem/mistake.

I didn't say otherwise. I still hope that the weekly-mythic chest gives higher gear than the 15s chest.