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  1. #461
    Quote Originally Posted by Throwme View Post
    why did you post this in the WoW section of the forums?
    Yeah my bad, saw it too late.

    Quote Originally Posted by Throwme View Post
    So what is your point with this thread
    Literally the first sentence I wrote was my point: "Yeah, didn't some people say Blizzard pay their people a really bad salary?"

  2. #462
    Quote Originally Posted by kodemonkee View Post
    Literally the first sentence I wrote was my point: "Yeah, didn't some people say Blizzard pay their people a really bad salary?"
    The first sentence you wrote was: "What is this?"

  3. #463
    Quote Originally Posted by kodemonkee View Post
    Literally the first sentence I wrote was my point: "Yeah, didn't some people say Blizzard pay their people a really bad salary?"
    Literally the first sentence was "what is this", which doesn't really open up for a whole lot of discussion on any given topic.

  4. #464
    My takeaway isn't so much that the salaries are terribly low (some are, they seem to underpay non senior artists), but rather that their salary bands are all over the place and way too wide. They have some seriously massive gaps between people doing the same job, which is going to be a problem along the way. I'm guessing they had to do some emergency hiring and tossed money at people to get them.
    Last edited by jellmoo; 2020-09-04 at 04:16 PM.

  5. #465
    Stood in the Fire Krimzin's Avatar
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    If you aren't getting paid what you think you are worth, leave. Go somewhere else that is willing to pay you what you think you are worth.

    You notice since Covid shit started, you haven't heard to much about this. Now these same people are just damn glad that they have a job.

    Go Figure.
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  6. #466
    I see a ton of competitive wages, especially for california living. Even some CS and GM's in there are 20+ an hour; and these are most likely remote positions as well.

  7. #467
    To be honest I consider most of these bad. I live in South Carolina and am currently projecting around 95k this year and there's people holding job titles there considered higher than mine making the same or less than me in California. Granted that is going just off of job title and no responsibilities, actual effectiveness of the employee, years worked, education, etc. But when you consider cost of living differences and the fact my benefits are better there is no way I would leave where I am to work at Blizzard because of the severe effective earnings difference I would make. This is true across the video game industry where employees are under valued.

  8. #468
    I think the bigger issue the leaked document is trying to show, especially if you read some comments in it, is a lot of people are not getting fair yearly raises.

  9. #469
    How are any of those wages bad for what the job is? These people need to get a grip...

    Quote Originally Posted by mr120 View Post
    I think the bigger issue the leaked document is trying to show, especially if you read some comments in it, is a lot of people are not getting fair yearly raises.
    People aren't all entitled to the same raise. We have a 9 block system at my work. 80% of people fall into the "5" (average performance category). If you land there, you can expect a wage increase that matches basically the expected inflation, which means you really don't get any wage increase as far as the actual value is concerned. If you suck, you get the minimum (1%). If you're good, you can get up to 10%. Assuming blizzard follows a similar suit, their numbers seem fine...

  10. #470
    Pandaren Monk taishar68's Avatar
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    When it comes to salary, it isn’t always about getting what you’re worth, as much as what you can leverage.

    Really hard worker with proven productivity? Doesn’t mean as much when business is booming and hungry people surround you.

    A bit lazy in an under-represented niche, with the certifications needed to satisfy standards? Start cashing in.

    These are just generalities, of course, but in the white collar world, there is a disparity in salaries that you generally don’t find in blue collar industries where unions are more prevalent. Not that I’m all on board with the homogenization of unions that don’t allow individual excellence to be rewarded, but there are protections there that you don’t see at the middle management level.
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  11. #471
    The Insane Daemos daemonium's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr120 View Post
    I think the bigger issue the leaked document is trying to show, especially if you read some comments in it, is a lot of people are not getting fair yearly raises.
    Seems like there just vastly over valuing them selfs. Most are already getting paid a fair wage they shouldn’t be expecting huge raises.

    Pretty much no worker is going to say they aren’t worth more then they are making rather that is true or not is another thing.

  12. #472
    people tend to forget that companies are always going to be willing to take advantage of people looking for a passion project. In almost every industry, working for the "cool" company pays significantly less than the same skill set can earn elsewhere. This happens a lot, particularly in the gaming industry, when people are willing to work for less if they can work on their favorite game or franchise. It is usually why we see junior, or easily replaceable, positions significantly lower than industry standard and then when you get to mid/senior level they become more competitive.

    There is nothing inherently wrong with the situation, at the end of the day Blizz is a business that is designed to focus on profits. If their employees get value from their projects in addition to their salary then its up to them.

  13. #473
    Test Analyst $24.49 a year....

    Associate Software Engineer in Test $79,000 a year...

    i don't think i'd want to be the first one if that's all you get a year

  14. #474
    Quote Originally Posted by kodemonkee View Post
    Yeah my bad, saw it too late.



    Literally the first sentence I wrote was my point: "Yeah, didn't some people say Blizzard pay their people a really bad salary?"
    No.

    Literally your first sentence was "What is this?". Your second was a link to a Google document. You didn't say that until your third sentence.

    This thread is a bit of a train wreck and I'm saying this as someone who actually played vanilla.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nizah View Post
    why so mad bro

  15. #475
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    I don't know about other locations, but on the Irvine campus, Blizzard has been notorious for underpaying its staff for years. Anyone know knows anyone that works there has known that they package up "but you get to work for Blizzard!!!" as a tradeoff for being under market value. Multiple people warned me of this when I applied there myself years ago. There is a reason a significant portion of the staff in Irvine commutes from another area; Blizzard's salaries aren't enough that many people can live in the area the company is located. I'd guess only senior staff and developers can stay close by without a zillion roommates.

    Some of those salaries look fine on paper (especially if you're comparing them to places with lower costs of living), but they're under what someone would get paid doing the same job somewhere else in California, sometimes by quite a lot. That was the main reason for the controversy afaik. It would be a different matter if this was a start up or tiny studio, but it's Blizzard; they rake in billions and their execs make crazy money.

    As a general rules, I feel that if people feel they aren't paid what they're worth, then they should find another job, and its on them if they don't. But I also feel like it's shitty to pay under market value because you think your "coolness" has more worth than income (I am sure Blizzard is not the only company to do this either). Pay should also scale to the cost of living in a particular area. You can't pay people who work in Irvine the same amount as you would if your business was located in Tampa or whatever. And most of all, I feel like Blizzard of all companies can afford to treat its employees right.
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  16. #476
    Spam Assassin! MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kodemonkee View Post
    Yeah, didn't some people say Blizzard pay their people a really bad salary? I mean what I see here doesn't look that bad, depends where you live of course, if it is in California then some of those $/hour are bad.
    That also doesn't appear to include benefits for non-hourly (exempt) employees. That can often be a very substantial thing. Nonetheless those salaries appear to be low- to middle- range salaries for positions that can pay more elsewhere.
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  17. #477
    Quote Originally Posted by Tziva View Post
    But I also feel like it's shitty to pay under market value because you think your "coolness" has more worth than income (I am sure Blizzard is not the only company to do this either).
    From an idealist perspective I agree. But it's just not how market economies work. If you have ten qualified engineers willing to work for $120k, why would you pay $180k? I am not aware of any size-able company that pays considerably more than they need to maintain the quality of staff they aim for. Companies change their compensation both when too many people are leaving and when too few are. Personally I do not get why a talented engineer would give up $20-80k a year to work for Blizzard but to each his own.

  18. #478
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    This has been moved to a more appropriate subforum as it has nothing really to do with WoW specifically.
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  19. #479
    And merged with the existing thread on the topic to avoid duplicate threads.

  20. #480
    The Insane Daemos daemonium's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tziva View Post
    But I also feel like it's shitty to pay under market value because you think your "coolness" has more worth than income (I am sure Blizzard is not the only company to do this either). Pay should also scale to the cost of living in a particular area. You can't pay people who work in Irvine the same amount as you would if your business was located in Tampa or whatever. And most of all, I feel like Blizzard of all companies can afford to treat its employees right.
    I think “coolnes” is something they absolutely should levy when it comes to comparing to what other companies pay as long as it’s still a fair amount. Sure you can say things like people get paid more at riot but if the off shoot of that is that you have to put up with things like the reported harassment then that’s something people should weight when it comes to looking for a job and likely something the company’s who protect said harassers also take into account when it comes to paying more/trying to buy silence.

    I can only speak for my self but I would take the job that pays less but keeps me in a better state of Mental health even if it’s under the supposed market value.

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