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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    I don't really understand why anyone would want to work for a triple A firm or would even really want to get into the gaming industry. If you're a talented programmer/analyst, you can get into an analytics firm or something and get a six-figure salary without any trouble.
    There's a reason low 6-figure salaries have such a high suicide rate, esp. ones that need TONS of schooling like doctors and lawyers. All these fools buying into the rat race working at jobs they hate and lives they self-loathe until they eventually just kill themselves.

    Not everyone is a slave to the acquisition of wealth, and in this particular case, people wanting to work for careers they love is being exploited hard.
    Cheerful lack of self-preservation

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Zeek Daniels View Post
    Lets see, engineer. A highly complex job you have to be smart and train for getting over 100k a year or a game tester/ customer service rep that just plays a game or reads from a script getting minimum wage. Sounds right to me. Im not going to pay someone 100k to read from set questions about how to deal with customers. And im not paying someone 100k a year to test my game.
    For sure. Skilled jobs have always attracted higher pay than non-skilled, otherwise, why would one bother putting in the effort to become skilled in the first place?

    One trend I am noticing though, especially at large companies like this, is that those in skilled roles are seeing much MUCH higher wage growth. Not to mention the stock options that are offered to these employees, especially in the tech field. Let alone the obscene growth seen in executive roles.

    The other issue I see is that the value of some roles is more quantifiable than the value of others. It's much easier to measure the value a programmer brings to the table than a support rep. I know it's not that simple, and there are methods to quantify value in both fields, but it's definitely easier to assign value to a programmer than to a support rep or someone who doesn't bring in direct revenue.

    Non-skilled workers are still valuable, the world would stop ticking if all the truck drivers in the world stopped working.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Mysterymask View Post
    dude..have you seen how IT companies treat people in this country....
    Yes, I've been in it. I've worked temp for start up company in which my cousin was the head tech guy. It is shit, but I chose to work there, be it only for a short time. If a company is under paying their workers, especially skilled ones such as programmers that may be hard to replace, they will be incentivized to seek different employment and other businesses will be incentivized to hire them. If, however, those employees are choosing to stay at blizz for the prestige, passion, or simple convenience (they like California for instance), they are not underpaid, but rather have valued those things more highly than a pay increase.

    Still, I like companies that increase compensation when there revenue is high. All employees contributed to that success. It just seems right, but if a company is not obligated via contracts, they do not need to do so.

  4. #44
    This would have been interesting if you actually shared the list. Now all I read is whining people who thought they were getting unrealistic raises and didn’t. This is capitalism. This is what they want. The American dream. They should stop whining or vote for someone who cares about worker’s rights, unions, minimum wages, etc.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Amerissis View Post
    This would have been interesting if you actually shared the list. Now all I read is whining people who thought they were getting unrealistic raises and didn’t. This is capitalism. This is what they want. The American dream. They should stop whining or vote for someone who cares about worker’s rights, unions, minimum wages, etc.
    American dream KekW. There is no more american dream, the right saw to that.

  6. #46
    Immortal callipygoustp's Avatar
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    Gaming industry has ALWAYS had low pay for low end staff. Always. Hell even some dev positions are under payed.

    I worked for Lucas and a place called Broderbund back in the late 80s/early 90s. After a couple years I floated my resume around. Ended up at Autodesk on one of their cad teams. They, nearly, tripled my salary for the same position I had been in. Nearly tripled! I never looked back.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Krakan View Post
    Are we supposed to be outraged a programmer makes more then a customer service rep or a play tester.
    Yes. Its funny that the article even states that top performers got bigger raises (20%) while people who basicly do 9-5 job got 10%. Blizzard alone is company that has tons of low wage positions just because they want engineers and programmers to focus on what's really important for their talent level. The only reason the low wage people have problems is because the company is located in California.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Khelek View Post
    Then why do people choose to work there? If they are being paid less, wouldn't they simply move to a better paying company? This would be a benefit to them and also force blizz to increase pay or risk losing valuable employees.
    supply and demand.

    If there was a shortage of programmers or designers theyd be in a position to make demands since the company wont want to lose them. If its the other way around they are in no position to ask for jack shit and the comapny is worried at all.

    The 2nd scenario is why worker unions came into existance to begin with. To even out the disparity in power between the two.
    Last edited by Aphrel; 2020-08-04 at 06:55 AM.
    None of us really changes over time. We only become more fully what we are.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by XDurionX View Post
    In which universe?

    I don't doubt that companies exploit their employees' passion for games, and not ATVI alone. Workers' rights are generally very poor in the US, people really have to unionize and fight for it to improve.
    in this one...just google it,i think of 3 from recent memory,well 2 of them are japanese so its a bit of a cultural thing for them to be more compasionate

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    in this one...just google it,i think of 3 from recent memory,well 2 of them are japanese so its a bit of a cultural thing for them to be more compasionate
    I've read about these, but they're nothing than mere anecdotes and not representative in any way, shape or form.

  11. #51
    no wonder the game is shit now...
    “Choose a job you love and you'll never have to work a day in your life” “Logic will get you from A to Z; Imagination will get you everywhere.”

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Aflakk47 View Post
    I agree, but I also feel like the employee's were being a tad unrealistic. They did a survey and expected a 10% raise to come from it? Come on. Now, this isn't me defending Activision-Blizzard because they sure as hell could afford it, but if I expected a 10% raise every year my company did our internal survey, I would never be happy because it just won't happen unless the government puts in a minimum wage that bumps it up that much higher every year.
    If they had not gotten a raise in forever then they'd have every reason to expect a bigger raise.
    Hail Lilith and see you in Hell!

  13. #53
    Only good salaries in games industry are reserved for executives. Rest of the money goes to the shareholders.

  14. #54
    As everyone's favorite president said: overpaid CEOs are a total and complete joke.

    And also: It's very hard if you have a free enterprise system to do anything about that. You know the boards of companies are supposed to do it but I know companies very well and the CEO puts in all his friends...and they get whatever they want you know because their friends love sitting on the board. That's the system that we have and it's a shame and its disgraceful.

  15. #55
    "No guys, dont look at this. Look at our rainbow logo instead! See? We care!"

  16. #56
    The Patient Awelon's Avatar
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    This is completely normal about everywhere in IT. New replacements who come in usually get more money than the old ones. The only way to max up your salary is to change your employer every few years. This ain't only your usual day in USA, it's more or less everywhere. Of course since US doesn't really have an active worker unions or anything, this gets more ugly in the States. But on the other hand, the compensation ie. salary is completely off the charts when you compare it to the Europe.

  17. #57
    The thing that blizz does right now which is very elitist.

    Blizz: You want to work with us?
    Unexp employee: Yea ofc!
    Blizz: Awesome, well one thing because we are such a big name we wont pay you, but it will be great on your resume right?
    Unxp employee: Great!!

    If this was a dutch company people would have already roasted the shit out of blizz and all over the news.

    America is great right.

  18. #58
    Dreadlord
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    Quote Originally Posted by emotivex View Post
    Non-skilled workers are still valuable, the world would stop ticking if all the truck drivers in the world stopped working.
    You'll notice the lack of the janitor that cleans your toilets and replaces the soap and paper before you'll notice that the CEO hasn't been at work for a few days...

    Also, these 'unskilled jobs' actually aren't. A good customer service rep or quality control tester is not someone without skills, even if they lack a degree, and while it takes less time to train a decent CSR than a coder, there are plenty of people that you really, really don't want to be interacting with customers. So why not pay the CSRs you have a decent wage, give them good working conditions, and not have to be constantly training new ones because they keep leaving (CSR burnout is incredibly high in just about all industries). Good pay will also attract people who are suited to the role and let you avoid having to take on people who are bad CSRs just to fill slots.

    Even cleaning works like this - pay a terrible wage, and you'll have massive turnover and poorly done jobs because your workforce is made up of people who don't know the job or are simply bad at it.

    Treat people well, pay them enough that they can live with some dignity, no matter what their job is, and you'll get better work from everyone and a better reputation as well. Henry Ford was a right bastard, but he knew this a century ago, and made a huge amount of money by cutting worker hours and increasing pay. Somewhere along the way this has been forgotten in favour of short-term gains that destroy companies and people in the longer term.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by XDurionX View Post
    In which universe?

    I don't doubt that companies exploit their employees' passion for games, and not ATVI alone. Workers' rights are generally very poor in the US, people really have to unionize and fight for it to improve.
    Nintendo's president did it back in the wii u days.Others have done it as well.Maybe do some research before you just disagree in ignorance.

  20. #60
    To infinity and beyond det's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    What is a fair compensation? Because you know, people aren't equal. Having same job title doesn't really make you receive equal payment.

    Quick example, in my previous company we had a developer who got paid about half of what other senior developers received.
    He was only a "senior" because he was already long employed. But... he was straight up bad. Incomparably less efficient and prone to fuck ups.
    Others had to fix his code frequently.

    He knew that, he knew that he was bad, maybe even not suited for the job that required logical thinking. He also knew he was getting paid half.
    Never in that 10 years he asked for a raise.

    My point is: your work is only worth that much how others are willing to pay you.
    If you think you are worth more, fight for it or find a better job. If you are not doing it, means you are fine with what you are getting paid.
    Yeah...I was thinking about this. There are so many different ways that people get paid. One of my friends has a job where he keeps getting more money automatically for every 2 years he is there. I don't hear of a bonus system in many jobs, not among employees. But you also have this "equality in pay" thing, where, if 10 people start the same job at the same time have to be paid the same, no matter of age or gender. In other jobs you negotiate your salary and conditions. And then you have people choosing to work on 20 hrs a week. Others who do overtime get it paid and in some jobs you get free time as compensation for overtime.

    So many different areas with different systems - and the higher ups make still exponentially more money though not in way it is with some CEOs in the US.

    Quote Originally Posted by enigma77 View Post
    Get your guillotines ready, time for Kotick's head to roll.
    ...and there will just be another guy stepping in and happily taking the same amount of money

    Quote Originally Posted by elnimrod View Post
    Should they? I think the problem is the distribution right now is obscenely unequal.
    It probably is - especially in America and not only in the gaming industry. But whenever anyone (in other threads) has pointed to how it is handled differently in ...say...european countries, you always get those smart folks that scream "socialism". Happens also when you mention heath care or some forms of social security.

    So I guess this is the system you chose and enough ppl are happy with.

    Obviously it isn't all bright and shiny...you have billionaires in Germany, too and a small group of people owning a big chunk of the money.

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