In TBC a top tier guild rerolled and cleared all content in 1 week, who was it?

[Deferionus]

He's wrong, just like the people that said vanilla was hard were wrong, just like the people who claim prog players in TBC and wrath were better then mythic raiders today are wrong.

Seriously nostalgia jerking aside. Comparing players in the past to modern players is like comparing an ancient greek olympian to a modern one, discounting the scientific, dietary and technical advantages and believing the ancient greek is better because 'they had it tough'.

It's a nonsense.

Basically this. Every expansion has had progressively more difficult mechanics and complexity added. I don't think you will see a fight in BC challenge people besides maybe Kael'thas, Illidan, Mu'ru, and Kil'jaeden. I think you would need to get into WOTLK with Yogg 0 and Lich King before you see people start to wipe as these were the first fights I remember having similar difficulty to modern raid bosses.

[deenman]

If you want to argue for the sake of authentictiy, fair enough, but still think it's not good for TBC overall because it will heavily screw with Arena, because T5 is obviously superior than S1 Gladiator gear.
Not to mention that will also invalidate some of the progression from Heroics and Reputation.

After all, we're not just including T5, we also include Hyjal and especially the Archimonde Loot table is completely nuts.

Adhering to authenticity is fine and all, but i think one of the lessons from Classic is adhering to authenticity solely for the sake of it will burn out people from the game faster with little else to gain.

And T4 alongside Heroics absolutely suffices for a first tier in my opinion.

If you follow the release of TBC like in Classic, you will have BT about 4 months after release, while Arena is still stuck in Season one (!), then you get ZA ~6months afterwards, followed by SWP ~5 months later.
Following that release schedule just wastes so much potential and fucks Arena (which is a feature some people are looking forward to) even further, which is already screwed by TBC Class design, no need to further screw with it by making OP PvE items available way before their PvP equivalents are.

well t5 wont be superior than s1 in pvp,resilience is still strong,specialy the tbc resilience that also reduces crit chance,weapons would proly still be better from pve (amusingly early tbc people got the weps for pve until it was changed),but ofc the real power comes when s2 comes out and people can x2 x2 for bonus res

[GreenJesus]

Played on a private server with content tuned harder than it was originally and we steam rolled everything, same reasons you can steam roll Classic only without the annoyances like world buffs. Depends what crafting patterns are available or whatever and sure it's a lot harder than Classic but it will get roflstomped by any skilled and determined guild.

Content is released in chunks anyway so you will never see this. But no its not possible to somehow hit level 70 and in a week and then just clear everything from Kara to Sunwell, unless you're talking WOTLK pre-patch where people were doing like 80% more dps and bosses were nerfed heavily (30% across the board I think).

People on MMO do like to count their WOTLK prepatch kills as TBC kills, seen it brought up before, that's a joke.

Although if Vanilla is using 1.12 the whole time then will BC basically use the end patch of BC as well? So a classic BC would probably be just as faceroll.

[Woobels]

Although if Vanilla is using 1.12 the whole time then will BC basically use the end patch of BC as well? So a classic BC would probably be just as faceroll.

They're not gonna use the pre-WotLK patch, stuff's gonna be really easy but not that easy.

Or I'd assume they'd never do that lol.

[Kralljin]

Got a link for the patch notes with all the nerfs? My phone isn't behaving right now, although I'm sure it's easy to find.

Check out patchnotes on wowpedia, hotfixes and some undocumented ones obviously aren't included but the boss pages itself have some reference to a hotfix.
Almost any major patch in TBC included nerfs for heroics and raids.

Just picking Patch 2.1, cut out the trash changes / nerfs as they're relevant to this discussion.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Patch_2.1.0

SSC:

The Mark of Hydross and Mark of Corruption debuffs can now affect the increases of the nature or frost damage taken up to 500%.
Lady Vashj can no longer use the ability Persuasion.
Toxic Spores no longer deal damage upon impact.
Hydross the Unstable's melee damage has been reduced.
The spawns of Hydross have fewer hit points.
Leotheras the Blind's Chaos Blast radius has been significantly reduced, which will allow additional melee to damage Leotheras while he is in metamorphosis form.
Leotheras the Blind will now also spend less time whirlwinding before shifting into his metamorphosis form.
Leotheras the Blind's hit points have been reduced.
Inner Demons are now slightly easier to kill and deal less damage.
Hydross the Unstable's hit points have been slightly reduced.

TK:

Arcane Resistance will prove much more effective against High Astromancer Solarian's spells.
High Astromancer Solarian now summons fewer Solarian agents, and the Solarium Agents now deal less damage.
The Al'ar encounter has been significantly reworked. Her movement around the room will now be more predictable, Al'ar's hit points have been reduced, and killing the Embers of Al'ar will now be both much more possible and more rewarding to the raid.
High Astromancer Solarian's hit points have been greatly reduced.

Karazhan also got some nerfs, for example, they removed Dragon's Breath from Shade of Aran completely.

[Stardrift]

Classic's overnerfed state gets allways compared to early Vanilla.

Yes of course people play much better now, because Classic draw all those mythic raiders away from the game and thats the reason why the raids are cleared with green geared new players :> Its for sure not the overnerfed patch version they took for the start of classic. Its all pure player skill from the current playerbase.

Omg the denial lol

[Ange]

Omg the denial lol

I did play vanilla, since day 1, enjoyed it and thats it.
I play retail because at some point you either quit the game or get better and demand more to enjoy it.

I don't expect that you see my PoV, how could you?

Since you don't see this in Classic:

[Sarevokcz]

They're not gonna use the pre-WotLK patch, stuff's gonna be really easy but not that easy.

Or I'd assume they'd never do that lol.

Didn't druids get wild growth in the wotlk prepatch and completely trivialized aoe healing in SWP?

[Varaben]

Played on a private server with content tuned harder than it was originally and we steam rolled everything, same reasons you can steam roll Classic only without the annoyances like world buffs. Depends what crafting patterns are available or whatever and sure it's a lot harder than Classic but it will get roflstomped by any skilled and determined guild.

Content is released in chunks anyway so you will never see this. But no its not possible to somehow hit level 70 and in a week and then just clear everything from Kara to Sunwell, unless you're talking WOTLK pre-patch where people were doing like 80% more dps and bosses were nerfed heavily (30% across the board I think).

People on MMO do like to count their WOTLK prepatch kills as TBC kills, seen it brought up before, that's a joke.

Yeah my guild made it to mother in black temple then prepatch hit and we finished BT then went 3/6 sunwell the next week lol. Crazy how much easier it was.

- - - Updated - - -

Didn't druids get wild growth in the wotlk prepatch and completely trivialized aoe healing in SWP?

Ret Paladin got divine storm which did holy damage at the time too. Trivialized aoe stuff.