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  1. #201
    Stood in the Fire Recovery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    I was wrong - I thought after the shit show of BfA and Blizzards statements about taking more time, especially with how lack luster the end game content is they wouldn't release too soon again. They're still consistently 'reworking' classes and many classes are flat out fundamentally broken on many levels. How many major class changes do we see every week with notable reworks to abilities, new talents, reworks to the structure of the class.

    I still stand by the fact that this is way too soon, by at least a month. We'll see when the expansion is released though but my hopes are sadly no longer high.
    i knew as soon as we started seeing actual class tuning that it was close. Its the same as its always been. Toward the end of beta, right before pre patch, they start balancing.

    They will balance between now and release.. After release, theyll do a big balance patch right before mythic raid is released..

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    I simply do not buy a world where this expansion is released any earlier than the latter half of November, and if I could bet money I would bet on December 8th, with the Tuesday prior to that as my back up, and the one prior to that as my other backup.
    Well this aged terribly. Good thing you didn't bet money.

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    I was wrong - I thought after the shit show of BfA and Blizzards statements about taking more time, especially with how lack luster the end game content is they wouldn't release too soon again. They're still consistently 'reworking' classes and many classes are flat out fundamentally broken on many levels. How many major class changes do we see every week with notable reworks to abilities, new talents, reworks to the structure of the class.

    I still stand by the fact that this is way too soon, by at least a month. We'll see when the expansion is released though but my hopes are sadly no longer high.
    Well we all know release is actually “beta” for everyone. 9.1 will be when they will fix broken shit. Or perhaps even later..

  4. #204
    Fluffy Kitten Malefic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Recovery View Post
    i knew as soon as we started seeing actual class tuning that it was close. Its the same as its always been. Toward the end of beta, right before pre patch, they start balancing.

    They will balance between now and release.. After release, they'll do a big balance patch right before mythic raid is released..
    The problem isn't that balance is the issue right now. In theory numbers can be balanced in a week.

    It's the fundamental play style of many classes. Some classes/specs don't follow a logical basis for their rotations or the way their abilities function, we're still seeing the introduction of new talents and the rework of abilities. Look at Boomkin for example and the changes last night - they received brand new talents, adjustments to the core base of what the class has or doesn't have. These aren't things that take a patch to 'balance'. These are things that need to be experienced in multiple scenarios, raids, dungeons, arena, battlegrounds, open world. Look at Shadow Priest, it got a mini 'rework' about a month ago and is still receiving notable changes, including a brand new Mastery that it got yesterday.

    That doesn't even cover many things about the post leveling content and a feeling it lacks significantly. I believe one of the things players will vocalize about the expansion after they've been max level for maybe 2-3 weeks is that they don't have anything to do.

    I'm passionate about the game, and really want the game to be fun and enjoyable but we're really really lining up for another Battle for Azeroth situation.
    Last edited by Malefic; 2020-08-27 at 07:35 PM.

  5. #205
    To be honest, I was incredibly surprised by the Oct 27th release. And also concerned.

    According to recent Blizz Posts, they're still working on a few classes in terms of changes, specifically Priests, Shaman and Monk. They're still messing around with conduits, too. There's also music that still needs to be added to the zones (though whether or not they're still producing said music, are in the editing stage, or simply have not bothered to put them in yet is up for speculation).

    I mean, sure, I'm hyped for a release literally only two months from now seeing as I've been bored with barely any other games to keep me occupied, but it still feels a bit too soon.

    You have announced it TOO SOON, EXECUBLIZZ

  6. #206
    Ha ha ha ha. Wrong. 26th of October is the release date.

  7. #207
    I am Murloc! dacoolist's Avatar
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    I think a lot of people WANTED Nov, but I mean uhhhhh Who's going to complain about Oct 26/27th RIGHT ;D #MMOC #THEFORUMS #REDDITWOWFORUMS

    You remember when people were happy that stuff was releasing early..

    "BUT DAC U AINT SHIT U SUC AND THE GAMES NOT FINISHED"

    Tell me when Blizz released ANY expansion when it was finished.. don't worry I'll wait

  8. #208
    just comin back to gloat that it was end of oct like i knew it would
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyou
    [Shadowmourne, I went to Icecrown and was hoping for Frostmourne but all I got was this lame axe]

  9. #209
    Are people really coming back to this thread just to dunk in the OP? Seriously, whomever guessed October was still just guessing.

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by Telomir View Post
    Per beta screenshot:

    Original Tweet: https://twitter.com/riggnaros/status...63480383586308

    109 days from today is Nov 30, which would put pre-patch (9.0.1) on Sept 22,2020.

    Thoughts?

  11. #211
    It was pretty obvious the game would come out in october, I mean you just needed to look at the last, like, 4 expansion releases.
    We each walk a line. Choose yours.

  12. #212
    New brawl wouldn't be the release date, it would be the new season start.

    They always delay that like 3 weeks after a new expansion launches.

    In this case it might be 4, since holidays, but it's not unlikely the 30th Nov is the new season start.

    It also sort of makes business sense, since it forces people who just came back to check out the new expansion to subscribe for another month to check out the new SL endgame stuff.
    Last edited by Mojo03; 2020-08-27 at 10:46 PM.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Mojo03 View Post
    New brawl wouldn't be the release date, it would be the new season start.

    They always delay that like 3 weeks after a new expansion launches.

    In this case it might be 4, since holidays, but it's not unlikely the 30th Nov is the new season start.

    It also sort of makes business sense, since it forces people who just came back to check out the new expansion to subscribe for another month to check out the new SL endgame stuff.
    Nahh, they already begin season 1 from Nov 10. They confirmed that with the raid schedule statement for SL.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    Okay, let's put some data on this. All of the people calling for release dates in October need to understand why that's borderline an impossibilty:

    WotLK release date was announced 59 days before it's release.

    Cataclysm release date was announced 64 days before it's release.

    MoP release date was announced 62 days before it's release.

    WoD release date was announced 91 days before it's release.

    Legion release date was announced 134 days before it's release.

    BfA release date was announced 131 days before it's release.

    Any release in October would be a 77 day or less timeline between announcement and release date.

    This gives us an average release date announcement to release date time of 90 days. If Shadowlands release date was announced today, 14th August (Where I am) it would be launched on November 12th on the basis of averages, rounding down to November 10th or November 17th because of an 'always Tuesday' release. However, personally, I think the trend of the last 2-3 expansions is what matters since it's when Ion has been at the reigns and there has been a clear distinction between the game "before Legion" and "after WoD". However WoD release date timeline was also longer, so we'll include that in this estimation. That gives us an average of 118-119 days which gives us a release date of December 10th, rounding down to December 8th or December 15th. Not including WoD in that estimation would just make the period of time longer and would inch us towards a 2021 release date.


    There is plenty of things for Blizzard to discuss at Gamescom, including Diablo Immortal, their quarterly Diablo 4 update as well as the possibility of them giving us an official release date for Shadowlands. Personally, I think Gamescom is the latest point upon which a release date is announced - I'm expecting a release date to happen in the next week personally.

    I won't discuss PTR testing and a lot of the things players have covered in regards to testing the leveling process because that's simply not what the PTR is there for. Sure some data may come back from that that's useful to Blizzard but the PTR is being put up exclusively to test the content players will be participating in in the period of time during the pre patch. All of the leveling testing has been/is being done on beta.

    At this point I am certain that the expansion will launch on either November 24th, December 1st or December 8th. Whenever it does launch, I'm also incredibly confident we're not raiding Castle Nathria this year. The above dates work with Blizzards timeline, specifically December 1st or December 8th, November 24th has a potential thanksgiving conflict, however the 2 December dates do not conflict - because the raid would be released after holidays.

    Blizzard last year were more conscious about releasing content that would cover the holiday period, intentionally not releasing 8.3 until after December, as well as the raid. I find it unlikely they'll release Castle Nathria in the period of time of 3~ weeks before Christmas. To be at that timeline we'd be looking at an early November launch which I just don't see as being feasible.

    Blizzard employees are still working from home, and there have no doubt been Covid-19 related delays. Their most recent comment on the release date stated;

    "You have our commitment we will be releasing Shadowlands this fall, even if we end up shipping it from our homes".

    This period of time is September 22nd-December 21st. Also that comment is quite clearly PR speak for "We're running this close guys, even if we can't get in to the office we'll make it work in that time frame". If you're comfortably releasing content within that time frame you don't release a statement that basically admits you have struggles and are going to be working against the clock.

    Finally, Shadowlands still has a plethora of stuff that's simply isn't even implemented on beta. Conduits in their Essence based form simply do not exist yet. The raid has 0 loot (Which is trivial, that can and will likely be all updated in 1 big swoop 1 week). Half of the things like trinkets don't have anything on them. Plenty of stuff in Soulbinds is still NYI. Classes are still receiving notable mini-reworks, most recently Elemental Shaman and Marksmanship Hunter. Content at Level 60 outside of Torghast and group based content feels completely baron.

    I simply do not buy a world where this expansion is released any earlier than the latter half of November, and if I could bet money I would bet on December 8th, with the Tuesday prior to that as my back up, and the one prior to that as my other backup.
    All of this text just to be dead wrong

  15. #215
    [QUOTE=Malefic;52568566]
    Quote Originally Posted by dcc626 View Post

    I'll make sure to quote you when we get a release date that isn't October . I never disputed whether a release date would be given at Gamescom, I disputed this idea people have that the game is randomly going to be dropped in 6-10 weeks and would have the shortest release date announcement to release date in THE GAMES ENTIRE HISTORY.

    This is the same community that were adamant Blizzard were going to open Blizzcon with "8.3 will drop next week" when I told them we weren't raiding Ny'alotha in 2019 too.
    Where is that quote?

  16. #216
    Stood in the Fire Recovery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    The problem isn't that balance is the issue right now. In theory numbers can be balanced in a week.

    It's the fundamental play style of many classes. Some classes/specs don't follow a logical basis for their rotations or the way their abilities function, we're still seeing the introduction of new talents and the rework of abilities. Look at Boomkin for example and the changes last night - they received brand new talents, adjustments to the core base of what the class has or doesn't have. These aren't things that take a patch to 'balance'. These are things that need to be experienced in multiple scenarios, raids, dungeons, arena, battlegrounds, open world. Look at Shadow Priest, it got a mini 'rework' about a month ago and is still receiving notable changes, including a brand new Mastery that it got yesterday.

    That doesn't even cover many things about the post leveling content and a feeling it lacks significantly. I believe one of the things players will vocalize about the expansion after they've been max level for maybe 2-3 weeks is that they don't have anything to do.

    I'm passionate about the game, and really want the game to be fun and enjoyable but we're really really lining up for another Battle for Azeroth situation.
    If you dont have anything to do 2-3 weeks after being max level, then you should probably play another game because its likely that youre TOO casual.

    2-3 weeks after leveling there will be M+, normal heroic and mythic raid, PVP, Torghast, all of the things for the covenants, professions, TIME FOR ALTS (Finally), etc.

    Like, what do you even mean?

  17. #217
    Fluffy Kitten Malefic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReVnX View Post
    All of this text just to be dead wrong
    As I mentioned in a previous post.

    I thought when Blizzard said we would have a longer beta and they would listen to feedback and make sure they go things right, they would do that. Alas it seems that isn't the case and my personal opinion is that we're lined up for the start of an expansion that many many players are going to have issues with.

    Just to note this will be I believe the shortest beta they've ever had, or at least very close. It's something like a 15 week beta or so which is about the same as BfA was.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Recovery View Post
    If you dont have anything to do 2-3 weeks after being max level, then you should probably play another game because its likely that youre TOO casual.

    2-3 weeks after leveling there will be M+, normal heroic and mythic raid, PVP, Torghast, all of the things for the covenants, professions, TIME FOR ALTS (Finally), etc.

    Like, what do you even mean?
    I'm not too casual - quite the opposite. I'm actually a Top 30 world raider, GM and Raid Leader.

    My statement was made before the 2 week raid announcement (historically it's been 3 weeks), and I'll agree it's a bit of an extreme example. My point is outside of your planned group content (Such as Mythic+/Raiding/Arena and things with your guild/friends) there is minimal for you to do as a player.

    World Quests have been stripped down and the rewards to them are now no-where nears as desirable and as you're progressing through the raid I think players will find the amount of World Quests they do to be incredibly minimal.

    Torghast novelty wears off VERY quickly. It will be fun and people that play multiple characters will find it fun, but even as someone that has played Rogue-lites (Binding of Isaac, Risk of Rain, Slay the Spire etc to name some recent ones) Torghast runs feel too 'samey' compared to other Rogue-lites. Almost all classes have a core principal that most anima powers have been focused around, so you're almost always going to be working towards a single 'build concept'. For example as a Hunter you're tunnelled in to building around Traps & Pets as BM. As a result all runs end up inching towards that direction and by the end of the run you often feel exactly as strong or powerful as you did the previous 5 runs you did.

    I don't really think that players spend time with professions? Like they obviously spend time with them but I mean I don't think players log on and think "Ah I don't have much to do, I know I'll be a leatherworker for 2 hours?" Like professions are something you level to max in a window and then you don't have any reason to interact with them past that.

    - - - Updated - - -

    [QUOTE=Sofo1;52603038]
    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post

    Where is that quote?
    Well, I was wrong? I said I would quote you if we didn't get a release date in October?

    Is it not acceptable to be wrong about an opinion? Especially when unfortunately I feel that this is going to result in a game being released before it's ready.

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by ReVnX View Post
    All of this text just to be dead wrong
    Oh, I'm guilty of similar stuff ;D. That's fun with speculating things, you don't know it you will be right or wrong.

  19. #219
    It's funny how wrong you guys were.

  20. #220
    Only BC's beta will be shorter than SL, but only by a matter of days. Legion beta was 110 days, BfA 111, SL will be 104. BC was 95 days.

    *Based on the dates I found on the Google.
    #TeamTinkers

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