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  1. #221
    Quote Originally Posted by spleen1015 View Post
    Only BC's beta will be shorter than SL, but only by a matter of days. Legion beta was 110 days, BfA 111, SL will be 104. BC was 95 days.

    *Based on the dates I found on the Google.
    I suggest to measure whole testing process, since Legion public testing start with Alpha and they don't transfer to Beta before at least leveling experience is complete. Only comparable Betas to SL are Legion and BfA. And whole testing for BfA lasted 188 days, for SL it will be 202 days.

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by Dracullus View Post
    Oh, I'm guilty of similar stuff ;D. That's fun with speculating things, you don't know it you will be right or wrong.
    There are ways of voicing your humble opinion and then there is starting with:

    "All of the people calling for release dates in October need to understand why that's borderline an impossibilty"

    Thinking yourself more intelligent than the rest is a sure way to get your ass whooped. I have no sympathy for that kind of posting.

    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    Is it not acceptable to be wrong about an opinion? Especially when unfortunately I feel that this is going to result in a game being released before it's ready.
    It's just the way you expressed yourself.
    Last edited by ReVnX; 2020-08-28 at 07:31 PM.

  3. #223
    Pandaren Monk taishar68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    The problem isn't that balance is the issue right now. In theory numbers can be balanced in a week.

    It's the fundamental play style of many classes. Some classes/specs don't follow a logical basis for their rotations or the way their abilities function, we're still seeing the introduction of new talents and the rework of abilities. Look at Boomkin for example and the changes last night - they received brand new talents, adjustments to the core base of what the class has or doesn't have. These aren't things that take a patch to 'balance'. These are things that need to be experienced in multiple scenarios, raids, dungeons, arena, battlegrounds, open world. Look at Shadow Priest, it got a mini 'rework' about a month ago and is still receiving notable changes, including a brand new Mastery that it got yesterday.

    That doesn't even cover many things about the post leveling content and a feeling it lacks significantly. I believe one of the things players will vocalize about the expansion after they've been max level for maybe 2-3 weeks is that they don't have anything to do.

    I'm passionate about the game, and really want the game to be fun and enjoyable but we're really really lining up for another Battle for Azeroth situation.
    I don't think your concerns would be addressed by a longer beta as much as a rework of what you don't think is working right; more to do at endgame and class restructuring are major projects that would push the game launch back who know how many months.

    I think that complaints and frustration over class design fall mainly in the realm of the forum goer, the hardcore player, etc. The player base at large doesn't really feel the impact of the things that frustrate the player pushing more challenging content, and that is where the money is at for Blizzard. And I don't mean to imply that I think Blizzard doesn't care about the concerns of the hardcore crowd, especially because the race for world first and the meta involved in doing high keys and arena drives a lot of chatter as well, but there is a line where you have to decide if something is good enough, i.e., perfect is the enemy of good.

    Now for content, there are perhaps easier fixes, and ones that would affect a broader swath of players, but I'm not sure what else they could add beyond alt leveling, pvp, Mythics, raids, pet battles, the secondary systems of the expac, Torghast...I mean, I get it, some people will overlook various pieces, and feel bored because they have nothing left, but as with many things, how big a percentage of the player base does that equate to?

    Lastly, while I am rarely cynical about Blizzard's marketing approach, I can see where they want to drive as many people to that initial buy as possible; 2 million people that buy the base edition of SL, that only stay subbed for two months and don't play again for a long time, or ever, still generated $140 million in revenue. Which, if I'm being honest, doesn't solve everything; if you take the games core for granted, eventually it will erode and you lose sustainability after that initial push, and we've seen that during the life cycle of Wow, as it approaches 16 years old, that the last few expansions have lost more old players than gained new ones. The fact that it is still relevant in the gaming world is impressive, but maintaining it is a challenge.
    "Can't you see this is the last act of a desperate man?"
    "We don't care if it's the last act of Henry the Fifth, we're leaving!"

  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Iem View Post
    Brace yourselves for all the "I told you so" people who didnt have a clue about the release themselves.
    I had a clue though, i even explained why it was obvious it would come out in october by carefully analyzing past expansion releases and identifying a pattern.

    So yeah, I told you so
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

  5. #225
    This thread is so much more fun now that it's people gloating about their random guess versus other people's random guesses.

  6. #226
    Titan Frozenbeef's Avatar
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    Was expecting mid- end November too. Surprised by October. Just two months to go :P

  7. #227
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    I had a clue though, i even explained why it was obvious it would come out in october by carefully analyzing past expansion releases and identifying a pattern.

    So yeah, I told you so
    I'm totally happy to admit I was confident it'd come out on 12/1. I was so sure, I tried to bet a guildy 5k gp it'd be 12/1 (or 11/30, with time zone shennanigans. I allowed that much wiggle room).

    Fortunately, they didn't take the bet.

  8. #228
    Banned tamarin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    I had a clue though, i even explained why it was obvious it would come out in october by carefully analyzing past expansion releases and identifying a pattern.

    So yeah, I told you so
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindsight_bias

    Everyone was reading tea leaves, some were bound to accidentally figure out the right date.

  9. #229
    I mean just use logic. You guys really thought we'd have 2 months of pre-patch? That literally NEVER happened before.
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

  10. #230
    [QUOTE=Malefic;52604013]As I mentioned in a previous post.

    I thought when Blizzard said we would have a longer beta and they would listen to feedback and make sure they go things right, they would do that. Alas it seems that isn't the case and my personal opinion is that we're lined up for the start of an expansion that many many players are going to have issues with.

    Just to note this will be I believe the shortest beta they've ever had, or at least very close. It's something like a 15 week beta or so which is about the same as BfA was.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I'm not too casual - quite the opposite. I'm actually a Top 30 world raider, GM and Raid Leader.

    My statement was made before the 2 week raid announcement (historically it's been 3 weeks), and I'll agree it's a bit of an extreme example. My point is outside of your planned group content (Such as Mythic+/Raiding/Arena and things with your guild/friends) there is minimal for you to do as a player.

    World Quests have been stripped down and the rewards to them are now no-where nears as desirable and as you're progressing through the raid I think players will find the amount of World Quests they do to be incredibly minimal.

    Torghast novelty wears off VERY quickly. It will be fun and people that play multiple characters will find it fun, but even as someone that has played Rogue-lites (Binding of Isaac, Risk of Rain, Slay the Spire etc to name some recent ones) Torghast runs feel too 'samey' compared to other Rogue-lites. Almost all classes have a core principal that most anima powers have been focused around, so you're almost always going to be working towards a single 'build concept'. For example as a Hunter you're tunnelled in to building around Traps & Pets as BM. As a result all runs end up inching towards that direction and by the end of the run you often feel exactly as strong or powerful as you did the previous 5 runs you did.

    I don't really think that players spend time with professions? Like they obviously spend time with them but I mean I don't think players log on and think "Ah I don't have much to do, I know I'll be a leatherworker for 2 hours?" Like professions are something you level to max in a window and then you don't have any reason to interact with them past that.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Sofo1 View Post

    Well, I was wrong? I said I would quote you if we didn't get a release date in October?

    Is it not acceptable to be wrong about an opinion? Especially when unfortunately I feel that this is going to result in a game being released before it's ready.
    of course it's acceptable to be wrong, but god damn were you smug when you argued about a non-october release!

  11. #231
    Stood in the Fire Recovery's Avatar
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    - - - Updated - - -

    [QUOTE=Sofo1;52605556]
    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    As I mentioned in a previous post.

    I thought when Blizzard said we would have a longer beta and they would listen to feedback and make sure they go things right, they would do that. Alas it seems that isn't the case and my personal opinion is that we're lined up for the start of an expansion that many many players are going to have issues with.

    Just to note this will be I believe the shortest beta they've ever had, or at least very close. It's something like a 15 week beta or so which is about the same as BfA was.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I'm not too casual - quite the opposite. I'm actually a Top 30 world raider, GM and Raid Leader.

    My statement was made before the 2 week raid announcement (historically it's been 3 weeks), and I'll agree it's a bit of an extreme example. My point is outside of your planned group content (Such as Mythic+/Raiding/Arena and things with your guild/friends) there is minimal for you to do as a player.

    World Quests have been stripped down and the rewards to them are now no-where nears as desirable and as you're progressing through the raid I think players will find the amount of World Quests they do to be incredibly minimal.

    Torghast novelty wears off VERY quickly. It will be fun and people that play multiple characters will find it fun, but even as someone that has played Rogue-lites (Binding of Isaac, Risk of Rain, Slay the Spire etc to name some recent ones) Torghast runs feel too 'samey' compared to other Rogue-lites. Almost all classes have a core principal that most anima powers have been focused around, so you're almost always going to be working towards a single 'build concept'. For example as a Hunter you're tunnelled in to building around Traps & Pets as BM. As a result all runs end up inching towards that direction and by the end of the run you often feel exactly as strong or powerful as you did the previous 5 runs you did.

    I don't really think that players spend time with professions? Like they obviously spend time with them but I mean I don't think players log on and think "Ah I don't have much to do, I know I'll be a leatherworker for 2 hours?" Like professions are something you level to max in a window and then you don't have any reason to interact with them past that.

    - - - Updated - - -



    of course it's acceptable to be wrong, but god damn were you smug when you argued about a non-october release!


    Very smug he was, indeed. His arguments against an october release reminded me of someone with the "better than everyone else" attitude.. walking through halls with their nose to the sky. lol

    And the worst part is... his arguments were all "game too broken to release then" "that would be a huge mistake" yadda yadda.. Meanwhile people are giving him patterns that blizzard have shown over the last 15 years and what is basically very educated guesses based on factual timelines of the past. Blizzard is a creature of habit.

  12. #232
    Fluffy Kitten Malefic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by facefist View Post
    Wall of text into being completely wrong lul. I even called you out on your dumb arguments concerning October release date being impossible. Well, maybe now you understand why.
    I wonder if my arguments are still dumb now.

    - - - Updated - - -

    [QUOTE=Sofo1;52603038]
    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post

    Where is that quote?
    I wonder if on a technicality I can claim I'm right now?

    I mean technically we got a release date in October, just the game isn't releasing in October now so I feel like I was right, no?

    - - - Updated - - -

    [QUOTE=Recovery;52628834]- - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Sofo1 View Post



    Very smug he was, indeed. His arguments against an october release reminded me of someone with the "better than everyone else" attitude.. walking through halls with their nose to the sky. lol

    And the worst part is... his arguments were all "game too broken to release then" "that would be a huge mistake" yadda yadda.. Meanwhile people are giving him patterns that blizzard have shown over the last 15 years and what is basically very educated guesses based on factual timelines of the past. Blizzard is a creature of habit.
    Almost looks like a lot of my arguments were actually right.

  13. #233
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    As this thread has been made superfluous by the recent announcement, it will now be closed.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

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