1. #1
    The Patient Rayzen17's Avatar
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    Exclamation Paladin - Covenant class abilities feedback

    I’ve made the following thread on the Blizzard EU - Shadowlands Beta General Discussion forum as feedback for the Covenant Class abilities (their specific conduits too) for Paladins: https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...eedback/175453

    I’ll list the feedback provided here for your consideration and for any discussions, but if you feel that you’re in agreement or have feedback to offer as well with the proposed changes then please head over there and leave your feedback so that Blizzard has a chance to notice it.
    I’m sure the next pass is going to include paladins as well, so let’s give them something to think about if we can.
    Even the smallest feedback has a chance to be noticed if it stays on top, so any “bumps” are only in favor of us.

    Looking over the Covenant Class abilities for paladins they seem generally underwhelming or disruptive to use and seemingly unbalanced.

    As such here are the considered changes for them:

    Kyrian - `https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/spell=304971/divine-toll`
    > Divine Toll Kyrian - 15% of base mana 30 yd range - Instant 1 min cooldown
    Requires Paladin
    Instantly cast Holy Shock, Avenger's Shield, or Judgment on up to 5 targets within 30 yds (based on your current specialization).

    TO

    > Divine Toll Kyrian - 15% of base mana 30 yd range - Instant 1 min cooldown
    Requires Paladin
    Instantly cast Holy Shock, Avenger's Shield, or Judgment on up to 5 targets within 30 yds (based on your current specialization).
    **The cooldown and cost are reduced by 12 seconds and 3% mana respectively for each target hit less than the maximum.**

    Explanation - The ability feels good to use in aoe, but is pretty abysmal in ST, as such the best way to balance it is with a reduced cd/mana cost for each target hit. The proportions are equal to what it would be if it hit all. This way the ability feels good to use at any number of targets.

    Necrolord - `https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/spell=328204/vanquishers-hammer`

    > Vanquisher's Hammer Necrolord - 1 Holy Power 30 yd range -Instant cast 30 sec cooldown
    Requires Paladin
    Throws a hammer at your target dealing (112% of Spell power) Shadow damage, and empowering your next
    Retribution
    Templar's Verdict to automatically trigger Divine Storm
    Holy
    Word of Glory to automatically trigger Light of Dawn
    Protection , Initial
    Word of Glory to automatically trigger Shield of the Righteous

    TO

    > Vanquisher's Hammer Necrolord - Generates 1 Holy Power 30 yd range -Instant cast 30 sec cooldown
    Requires Paladin
    Throws a hammer at your target dealing (112% of Spell power) Shadow damage, and empowering your next
    Retribution
    Templar's Verdict or Divine Storm to automatically trigger another Templar's Verdict or Divine Storm respectively
    Holy
    Word of Glory or Light of Dawn to automatically trigger another Word of Glory or Light of Dawn respectively
    Protection , Initial
    Word of Glory or Shield of the Righteous to automatically trigger another Word of Glory or Shield of the Righteous respectively

    Explanation - The way this currently acts as a spender disrupts the rotation and starves us more of Holy Power, making it a generator is going to increase the fluidity of the rotation and make the ability feel good to use. Also having to use 1 ST ability to trigger an aoe feels counterproductive when trying to aoe, as such it's a lot better to have a ST spell trigger another ST spell or an AOE spell trigger another AOE spell.

    Night Fae - `https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/spell=328278/blessing-of-the-seasons`

    > Blessing of the Seasons Night Fae - 5% of base mana 40 yd range - Instant 45 sec cooldown
    Requires Paladin
    Blessing of Spring
    Bless an ally for 30 sec, increasing their healing done by 10% and healing received by 20%.
    Blessing of Summer
    Bless an ally for 30 sec, causing their attacks to have a 40% chance to deal 30% additional damage as Holy.
    Bless an ally for 30 sec, causing their cooldowns to recover 50% faster.
    Blessing of Winter
    Bless an ally for 30 sec. Their attacks deal [5 / 100 * max(Attack power, Spell power) * (1 + Versatility)] Frost damage and reduce enemies' movement speed by 3% and attack speed by 2%, stacking 10 times.
    Blessing of the Seasons: Turns to the next season after use.

    TO

    > Blessing of the Seasons Night Fae - 5% of base mana - Instant cast 1 minute cooldown
    Requires Paladin
    Retribution
    Bless yourself with Blessing of Summer for 30 seconds causing your attacks to have a 50% chance to deal 30% additional damage as Holy.
    Holy
    Bless yourself with Blessing of Spring for 30 seconds increasing your healing done by 15% and healing received by 15%.
    Protection
    Bless yourself with Blessing of Winter for 30 seconds causing your attacks deal 5% of Attack Power as Frost damage and reduce enemies' movement speed by 3% and attack speed by 3%, stacking 10 times.

    Explanation - The current Blessing of Seasons feels bad to use, it's high maintenance and eventually(as a dps) you may be forced to provide the DPS buffs to other players, this is bad due to increasing the damage any other class does far beyond what they are designed to do and i don't think many paladins want to be buff bots for other classes like in classic. Also each blessing is tailored to be useful to their type of spec and actually feels like a gain, like a cooldown.

    Venthyr - `https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/spell=316958/ashen-hallow`

    >Ashen Hallow Venthyr - 20% of base mana 30 yd range 1.5 sec cast 4 min cooldown
    Requires Paladin
    Hallow the target area for 30 sec. Every 2 sec, an enemy in the area suffers (100% of Spell power) Shadow damage, and an ally in the area is healed for (125% of Spell power).
    Within the Hallow, you may use Hammer of Wrath on any target.

    TO

    > Ashen Hallow Venthyr - 5% of base mana 30 yd range Instant cast 1 min cooldown
    Requires Paladin
    Hallow the target enemy for 10 sec, creating a hallowed zone around it. Every 2 sec, the target takes 100% of Attack Power or Spell power damage, enemies in the area suffer 50% of that damage as Shadow damage and the lowest health ally in the area siphons the health lost by the enemies, if no allies are in the zone then the paladin receives the healing. If the targeted enemy dies, the effect jumps to a random enemy in the area resetting its duration.

    Explanation - The current Ashen Hollow feels bad and awkward to use due to its cast time, cooldown and the way it looks like an AOE but does ST damage, as such the changes made to it make it instant cast so that it's usable on the fly, lowered cooldown makes it more a part of the kit and it's an actual AOE now, followed with the targeting making it mobile where the enemy is as well as making it have a vampiric siphon-like effect for its healing portion.


    Currently the following conduits(max rank) exist and some modifications are necessary to make them complement the abilities better or for the paladin to better profit from them:

    Kyrian - `https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/spell=340218/ringing-clarity`
    > Ringing Clarity
    Kyrian Toll has a 60.0% chance to cast twice on any given target.

    TO

    > Ringing Clarity
    Kyrian Toll has a 60.0% chance to cast twice on any given target after 3 seconds.

    Explanation - This is so that the player can benefit from any holy power(or additional bonuses) gained and actually have a chance to use it as to not overcap on Holy Power.

    Necrolord - `https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/spell=340192/righteous-might`
    > Righteous Might
    Vanquisher's Hammer deals 250% more damage and heals you for the damage done.
    No change, this seems fine.

    Night Fae - `https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/spell=340185/the-long-summer`
    > The Long Summer
    Blessing of Summer lasts 60% longer.

    TO

    > Autumn is here
    When casting the Blessing of the Seasons also cast Blessing of Autumn
    Bless yourself with Blessing of Autumn for 30 seconds increasing haste by 10%

    Explanation - As such we have 3 of the seasons for each spec and the conduit can give the 4th, i didn't add 50% cooldown reduction as it's obvious that this effect is too powerful, but more than that, it can de-sync your trinket usage since that doesn't get reduced. Also haste is useful for all 3 specs.

    Venthyr - `https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/spell=340212/hallowed-discernment`
    > Hallowed Discernment
    Ashen Hallow strikes the lowest health ally and enemy within it for 25% of its effect.

    TO

    > Hallowed Discernment
    Ashen Hallow strikes the targeted enemy and the paladin which casted it receive an additional 25% of its effect.

    Explanation - This makes it a ST increase and always has a siphon effect for the caster.

    I think this would make the abilities more streamlined with the paladin kit and would make the rotation better, their utility more in-line with their theme for the paladin/covenant. Also they are more balanced between them and the different types of content as opposed to their current iterations.

    As normal, the numbers could be tuned, but the functionality/utility is the one that counts.

  2. #2
    Blessings of Seasons should be party-wide like it started. You shouldn't have to feel obligated not to benefit from your own covenant to support others. I also don't feel like I should have to stop targeting my target to cherry-pick who is getting a buff. That adds way too much micromanagement when you have other things to worry about. Seeing as Nightfae is the only option its the only thing I care to talk about seeing as we need the instant cast mobility and they removed the instant mobility from venthyr. End of discussion.

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