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  1. #881
    Herald of the Titans Lora's Avatar
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    man i've been so hyped to be night fae and now im fucking pissed at the queen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Uggorthaholy View Post
    Thanks but no thanks, Lora, for making me question everything in existence forever.

  2. #882
    Even Blizzard is basically telling people not to be angry at Winter Queen, because they showed a scene of Ardenweald literally crumbling and dying if these people are too afraid to sacrifice anyone, but as usual victim-blaming is the forte of this forum.
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

  3. #883
    i bloodly hope when we return into that grove - we find seed that almost died, but endure for so long. Survive, whatever happens - its good even for class fantasy and lore of bear wild gods. And when we could recover it, Ursoc awakes and tell: "What a good sleep i just have".

    Or, if we arenot going to come again - make his spirit fuse with that goatboi. Make him guardian druid with Ursoc skin. Like Vol'Jin and Rezan.
    Last edited by Dancaris; 2020-09-11 at 12:54 PM.

  4. #884
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Even Blizzard is basically telling people not to be angry at Winter Queen, because they showed a scene of Ardenweald literally crumbling and dying if these people are too afraid to sacrifice anyone, but as usual victim-blaming is the forte of this forum.
    The Winter Queen was asking for it.

  5. #885
    Quote Originally Posted by Ursoc18 View Post
    The Winter Queen was asking for it.
    Asking for what? The machine of death to break? A massive anima dought to hit Ardenweald?
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

  6. #886
    If there's one thing this forum excels at, it's victim-blaming.
    So I agree with your larger point, I'm not sure how the Winter Queen or the Wild Hunt are the victims here?

  7. #887
    Quote Originally Posted by Wyattbw09 View Post
    So I agree with your larger point, I'm not sure how the Winter Queen or the Wild Hunt are the victims here?
    Winter Queen didn't break the machine of death, how is she responsible for the anima drought? She's a victim of the Jailer like everyone else.
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

  8. #888
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Winter Queen didn't break the machine of death, how is she responsible for the anima drought? She's a victim of the Jailer like everyone else.
    You seem to be extremely pissed off that people dont follow your line of thought. What gives?

  9. #889
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Winter Queen didn't break the machine of death, how is she responsible for the anima drought? She's a victim of the Jailer like everyone else.
    She is not responsible for the anima drought, but that does not mean she is equally not responsible for the decisions she makes in response. She is the person with agency in this case. She choose to call the Wild Hunt, she choose to cull the groves. She very well might have felt like she had no other choice, but she is not the victim. Ursoc is the victim. If you blamed him for dying during a drought and causing himself to be culled, that would be blaming the victim. The Winter Queen is a victim in a lot of ways, but nothing in the Afterlives cinematic made her a victim.

  10. #890
    Quote Originally Posted by Wyattbw09 View Post
    She is not responsible for the anima drought, but that does not mean she is equally not responsible for the decisions she makes in response. She is the person with agency in this case. She choose to call the Wild Hunt, she choose to cull the groves. She very well might have felt like she had no other choice, but she is not the victim. Ursoc is the victim. If you blamed him for dying during a drought and causing himself to be culled, that would be blaming the victim. The Winter Queen is a victim in a lot of ways, but nothing in the Afterlives cinematic made her a victim.
    ??? You understand her actions are necessary to ensure Ardenweald's future, yes? We literally have direct confirmation from Blizzard in this video that Ardenweald risks to wither away and die if these hard decisions are not made.
    Last edited by Varodoc; 2020-09-11 at 02:35 PM.
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

  11. #891
    Stood in the Fire Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyattbw09 View Post
    She is not responsible for the anima drought, but that does not mean she is equally not responsible for the decisions she makes in response. She is the person with agency in this case. She choose to call the Wild Hunt, she choose to cull the groves. She very well might have felt like she had no other choice, but she is not the victim. Ursoc is the victim. If you blamed him for dying during a drought and causing himself to be culled, that would be blaming the victim. The Winter Queen is a victim in a lot of ways, but nothing in the Afterlives cinematic made her a victim.
    To add to this ... she could have send a message to Sire Denathrius back then, but she didn't - instead she culled groves with "lesser souls" or something .... that's .... just bad. All loa/wild gods are precious and should be saved. So na, sorry, I can't see anything good in that Winter Queen right now ....

    #RevengeForUrsoc

  12. #892
    I get this is sort of bunny trailing, however, having to make difficult decisions is simply not the same as being a victim.

    President Hoover had to make a difficult choice to drop two nuclear bombs on Japanese cities. No doubt he felt he had to or it would have cost countless American lives to invade Japan.

    Hoover is not the victim. Blaming Hoover for the results of dropping those bombs is not blaming the victim.

    The Winter Queen is not the victim. Blaming her because the groves got culled is not blaming the victim.

    Not arguing with you that it was right decision, just trying to point out that she is not the victim.

  13. #893
    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    You seem to be extremely pissed off that people dont follow your line of thought. What gives?
    The Stratholme of the wilds is in full swing and here I thought blizz established such things were bad XD

    Remember this moment the next time blizz says the end justifies the means is wrong.
    Last edited by Combatbulter; 2020-09-11 at 02:55 PM.

  14. #894
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    ??? You understand her actions are necessary to ensure Ardenweald's future, yes? We literally have direct confirmation from Blizzard in this video that Ardenweald risks to wither away and die if these hard decisions are not made.
    Exactly this, but the average MMO champ poster needs a new person to hate after Sylvanas, so she is it.. logic? Goes straight out of the window.

    And before the fanboys start "ehmagerd Sylvanas is hitler wtf how dare you say that".. yea Sylvanas is pure evil, and deserves everything she will get.

  15. #895
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    To add to this ... she could have send a message to Sire Denathrius back then, but she didn't - instead she culled groves with "lesser souls" or something .... that's .... just bad. All loa/wild gods are precious and should be saved. So na, sorry, I can't see anything good in that Winter Queen right now ....

    #RevengeForUrsoc
    And why would she do that? All other realms are faced with anima drought as well, Ardenweald just has the worst, but it's not like the other realms are thriving. Besides Denathrius is a servant of Jailer, the one who caused the drought in the first place.

    All life is to be cherished, which is why the Winter Queen was visibly devastated that she had to order this. You can thank Sylvanas Windrunner and her bald master for causing that crisis in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyattbw09 View Post
    I get this is sort of bunny trailing, however, having to make difficult decisions is simply not the same as being a victim.

    President Hoover had to make a difficult choice to drop two nuclear bombs on Japanese cities. No doubt he felt he had to or it would have cost countless American lives to invade Japan.

    Hoover is not the victim. Blaming Hoover for the results of dropping those bombs is not blaming the victim.

    The Winter Queen is not the victim. Blaming her because the groves got culled is not blaming the victim.

    Not arguing with you that it was right decision, just trying to point out that she is not the victim.
    But she is the victim, all these people are. They were literally just minding their business and living in peace in Ardenweald, until Jailer and Sylvanas broke the machine of death because they want everyone to suffer.

    Quote Originally Posted by 8bithamster View Post
    Exactly this, but the average MMO champ poster needs a new person to hate after Sylvanas, so she is it.. logic? Goes straight out of the window.

    And before the fanboys start "ehmagerd Sylvanas is hitler wtf how dare you say that".. yea Sylvanas is pure evil, and deserves everything she will get.
    I would say these people are actually Sylvanas fanboys, since they claim that Sylvanas' enemies are evil, while ignore the fact that Sylvanas helped cause this drought in the first place.
    Last edited by Varodoc; 2020-09-11 at 02:48 PM.
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

  16. #896
    Warchief Themerlin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Winter Queen didn't break the machine of death, how is she responsible for the anima drought? She's a victim of the Jailer like everyone else.
    I feel like those spirits that "winter" in Ardenweald, a spiritual luscious forest, were not aware that these caretakers and The Queen of Winter would be able to cannibalize them for sustenance. This does not seem like an afterlife at all...

    There is something creepy about it all.

    Almost like Ardenweald itself is a prison of sorts, where your captors/caretakers determine your fate according to her will. In times of plenty they feed the spirits with Anima, they are reborn, eventually die, and the cycle of the rebirth/anima machine continues. Now that the machine of the afterlife is broken, the underlying faults of each covenant is laid out in the open.

    Not as benevolent as we thought.
    “Life is and will ever remain an equation incapable of solution, but it contains certain known factors.”

  17. #897
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    To add to this ... she could have send a message to Sire Denathrius back then, but she didn't - instead she culled groves with "lesser souls" or something .... that's .... just bad. All loa/wild gods are precious and should be saved. So na, sorry, I can't see anything good in that Winter Queen right now ....

    #RevengeForUrsoc
    In the final Ardenweald quests you get the distinct impression that the Winter Queen petitioning Sire Denathrius for anima is an effective Godzilla-type threshold that even the sacrifice of the wildseeds was not, and quite possibly something with extensive ramifications we don't ourselves know.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

  18. #898
    Quote Originally Posted by Themerlin View Post
    I feel like those spirits that "winter" in Ardenweald, a spiritual luscious forest, were not aware that these caretakers and The Queen of Winter would be able to cannibalize them for sustenance. This does not seem like an afterlife at all...

    There is something creepy about it all.

    Almost like Ardenweald itself is a prison of sorts, where your captors/caretakers determine your fate according to her will. In times of plenty they feed the spirits with Anima, they are reborn, eventually die, and the cycle of the rebirth/anima machine continues. Now that the machine of the afterlife is broken, the underlying faults of each covenant is laid out in the open.

    Not as benevolent as we thought.
    That's literally the point. The Shadowlands are messed up and broken now, because the machine of death has been shattered. How can the afterlife be peaceful and serene when its underlying mechanism has been ruined?
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

  19. #899
    But she is the victim, all these people are.
    Yes, she absolutely is a victim, but not of any of the content of Afterlives.

  20. #900
    Quote Originally Posted by Wyattbw09 View Post
    Yes, she absolutely is a victim, but not of any of the content of Afterlives.
    The cinematic literally shows a vision of the horrible future that awaits Ardenweald and its people if they don't end this crisis, and the Winter Queen is clearly very sad that Ursoc has to be sacrificed, so the intentions of the writers in this cinematic are obvious.
    I will tell you what I told my own son when he picked up his first blade and played at being a soldier. Whatever your elders have told you... War is not glory. War is seeing people at their very worst and choosing to protect them anyway.

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