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  1. #61
    Mechagnome BasedRix's Avatar
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    Venthyr. It seems strong enough with both the class ability and the teleport that I can get away with playing it and doing well enough in the content I do. I can't bring myself to play Night Fae on my DK. It's as far away from the Death Knight aesthetic as you can get just about. I'm BANKING on Blizzard doing another tuning pass and bringing the other Covenants up to par, maybe evening tuning down the Night Fae ability since it does seem like the purely optimal choice in all PvE scenarios. In an ideal world, I'd be able to play Necrolords and feel good about it, but it seems to be the WORST choice for PvE, despite it being the most fitting thematically.
    I'm just here to complain, if I'm being honest

  2. #62
    Herald of the Titans msdos's Avatar
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    If they do actually tune the Cov abilities properly, the Kyrian dot could be a sleeper pick. People are just so deep in doubt, but at the same time insecure because stuff might get tuned.

  3. #63
    Mechagnome BasedRix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msdos View Post
    If they do actually tune the Cov abilities properly, the Kyrian dot could be a sleeper pick. People are just so deep in doubt, but at the same time insecure because stuff might get tuned.
    I don't think most DKs are thrilled at the idea of being shoehorned into Night Fae and would love for a balancing pass to change that to literally anything else lol
    I'm just here to complain, if I'm being honest

  4. #64
    Elemental Lord Kithelle's Avatar
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    I love Unholy the most and I PvP so gonna go Necrolord for Abomination's Limb
    #WithoutRespectWeReject

  5. #65
    Herald of the Titans msdos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rixark View Post
    I don't think most DKs are thrilled at the idea of being shoehorned into Night Fae and would love for a balancing pass to change that to literally anything else lol
    Tbh, I don't like Death's Due being a thing. I don't really care for Death and Decay or Defile lol. More often than not when I would use those, the moment I put them down, everything just moves out. There's no way I'm banking on an ability like that.

    For a new DK player, I don't think I would recommend Night Fae. They'd be better off with the Phial and the dot, ESPECIALLY in pug raids. I have a feeling the double dot is gonna out DPS Night Fae in raids. Any encounters with too much movement to make DD pitiful will see the Kyrian dot come out ahead easily, assuming Fae conduits aren't completely busted.

  6. #66
    Nightfae is so busted it's not even a contest

    The only caveat is for pvp, which you'll go necrolords. But for everything else, choosing anything but Nightfae is plain dumb. And I HATE having to go Nightfae

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Th3Scourge View Post
    Nightfae is so busted it's not even a contest

    The only caveat is for pvp, which you'll go necrolords. But for everything else, choosing anything but Nightfae is plain dumb. And I HATE having to go Nightfae

    Nightfae is only "no contest" for tanking. Small tweaks to other covenants will make them competitive, except aboms limb which is kind of an odd duck.



    Todays build will be very telling I think.

  8. #68
    Warchief Ronnosh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monteverdi View Post
    This is actually a difficult choice. There are a lot of interesting bits to each covenant, and here are my considerations (taking into account my personal circumstances and preferences, do understand everyone is different). I'm a Dark Iron Blood DK with Engineering/Enchanting as professions, for reference.

    Kyrian
    • Generic Ability (Summon Steward) - An extra healthstone that clears a number of relevant debuffs is nothing to sneeze at. However, the ability to clear those debuffs overlaps quite a bit with my racial active, and the convenience of having a vendor on-demand is something I've always had via Jeeves.
    • Class Ability (Shackle the Unworthy) - So, this isn't the worst thing in the world. A single-target DoT isn't great, but 5% damage reduction is nice, and with the right conduit (Proliferation) it spreads to AoE which could be ok.
    • Notable Soulbinds - Pelagos gives a potential 5% versatility increase (Let Go of the Past) if you play like a WW monk, which is an interesting playstyle anyway. Additionally, he gives Road of Trials, which helps with mobility issues especially in something like mythic+. Kleia makes Phial of Serenity more interesting by introducing multiple debuff immunities for 15s after using it (Ascendant Phial). Forgelite Prime Mikanikos starts with an interesting choice with the phial, giving it an auto-use when you go below 35% HP (Forgelite Filer) or adding a knockback to Phial (Charged Additive). Finally, Sparkling Driftglobe Core is a neat effect, stunning everyone near you when you go below 35%.
    • Other considerations - Overall, Kyrians have some neat tools that are either redundant or lacklustre for my purposes. Of the four covenant choices, Kyrians are the only covenant I don't have any hesitation in passing over.

    Necrolords
    • Generic Ability (Fleshcraft) - At first glance, this isn't so usable in PVE. As a tank, during the channel I'm left vulnerable. That said, with the right soulbind (Emeni's Ambulatory Flesh) it becomes more interesting, being an ability I cast while on the move between pulls. Not great for raids, but could be useful in M+.
    • Class Ability (Abomination Limb) - Massive AoE with AoE grip is a flavor win and a pretty useful ability on the whole. However, there's certainly some nuance here, and this isn't an ability I'll want to activate universally, as there are certainly situations where this will not be what you want to activate at the time.
    • Notable Soulbinds - Plague Deviser Merileth is an odd duck. His passives seem to be hard to evaluate, and I'm not keen on trying him out as a primary spec soulbind. For mythic+, Emeni makes Fleshcraft much more interesting by giving it an option to be used on the move, however the rest of her tree lacks pizzaz. Finally, Bonesmith Heirmir does have an interesting option in Forgeborne Reveries, though having the most interesting soulbind ability be tied to me dying is less than ideal.
    • Other considerations - Maldraxxus seemed an obvious pick for a DK at first glance, but getting into the mechanics they do seem less interesting from a blood standpoint. That said, both the generic and class-specific ability seem to have interesting use, and I do love the aesthetics for a DK.

    Night Fae
    • Generic Ability (Soulshape) - Mobility being a major issues, this ability is phenomenal. Ghost Wolf and Blink combined, and the soulshape form doesn't require you being out of combat nor does it negatively impact your combat effectiveness or survivability while active.
    • Class Ability (Death's Due) - Homerun. As a Blood DK, I'm standing in Death and Decay all of the time anyway, now I'm getting more benefit from it by both reducing the damage dealt to me, and increasing my strength (which is not just a DPS increase, but a sizable defensive increase as well).
    • Notable Soulbinds - Night Fae has the best soulbinds, bar none. Niya makes you more mobile via Stay on the Move and Swift Patrol, gives you haste (more haste = more RP = more Death Strikes) via Niya's Tools: Herbs, and turns Soulshape into a small defensive CD via Grove Invigoration. Korayn turns Soulshape into a charge via Wild Hunt's Charge, and has multiple choices for tanks via Hold the Line and Face your Foes. Dreamweaver - who I submit is the strongest soulbind in the game and damned near mandatory for progression-minded healers - is a fantastic choice, giving you easy haste via Field of Blossoms, stronger absorb shields via Empowered Chrysalis (this ability is very similar to Scarab Brooch, which was such a strong trinket from AQ40 that it was still used during WotLK progression raiding until Blizz had to nerf it), and a free death avoidance ability via Podtender.
    • Other considerations - the Night Fae aesthetic isn't what one thinks of with Death Knights. Not at first, at least. On the one hand, this is nice, because we have plenty of stereotypical DK appearances without needing Maldraxxus. On the other hand, unless Covenant transmogs are account bound, this means I'll probably forego using their transmogs at all.

    Venthyr
    • Generic Ability (Door of Shadows) - Door of Shadows is pretty slick. Again, the weakness is movement, so this helps with that a bit. It's a 1.5s cast which makes it personally less interesting for me, and I think all told I like the Night Fae's Soulshape better.
    • Class Ability (Swarming Mist) - on-demand dodge on a 1min cooldown with RP generation is nothing but good for a blood DK.
    • Notable Soulbinds - Nadjia the Mistblade offers Exacting Preparation, making food, flask, and weapons enchants (explicitly includes runeforge) effects 15% stronger, which is phenomenal. Theotar the Mad Duke seems mostly underwhelming for a main soulbind. General Draven has some neat effects, helping your repair bills via Unbreakable Body, Hold Your Ground is a solid buff with high uptime, Service in Stone is a pretty solid defensive trait, but Move as One is most interesting to me, letting me share in any movement speed buff my party gets.
    • Other considerations - I hate the Venthyr aesthetic. Personal preference and all that.


    Conclusion: All signs point to Night Fae. Ultimately, while it seems the decision should be easy, I'm still torn between Maldraxxus and Night Fae, but at the moment I think Night Fae is winning out just due to the sheer mechanical impact of their soulbinds and abilities.
    I really appreciate the way you broke this all down. I too was initially leaning Maldraxxus for my DK as, initially, it just felt like it'd be a no brainer fit. As a Frost DK however, it feels like a toss-up for me between Night Fae and Revendreth. Like you, I'm also tilting towards Night Fae and the fact that my DK happens to be a night elf makes it easier to accept the wintry nature aesthetics.
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  9. #69
    whichever allows me to get invited to mythic+ groups :^)

  10. #70
    I'm going Nightfae for both power and the aesthetics. It's a win win.
    change can't wait.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Toby451 View Post
    Nightfae is only "no contest" for tanking. Small tweaks to other covenants will make them competitive, except aboms limb which is kind of an odd duck.



    Todays build will be very telling I think.
    As it stands? Hell no. Nightfae is miles ahead for unholy, frost *MIGHT* consider Venthyr if playing breath build but Nightfae is way more versatile AND the movement fixes the biggest issue with the class. Blood should have no issue maintaining 100% uptime with deaths due as well.

  12. #72
    Considering how OP Nightfae is for DKs, won't it probably be nerfed before launch? Or have other covenants buffed? I mean the 2nd best option is Venthyr and even that seems to be way behind Nightfae.

    I'm sure they'll tune these further. Every covenant can be made viable if tuned properly, sure there will still be a best pick but at least players can pick what they like without gimping themselves too much.

  13. #73
    nightfae is just too good, that burst in strenght power...man..you cant just ignore it

    but im sure it will be nerfed, its blizzard way to balance thing..nerf something and screw players :P

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Th3Scourge View Post
    As it stands? Hell no. Nightfae is miles ahead for unholy, frost *MIGHT* consider Venthyr if playing breath build but Nightfae is way more versatile AND the movement fixes the biggest issue with the class. Blood should have no issue maintaining 100% uptime with deaths due as well.
    movement and STR boost, even if frost dont have multi hit with it, the str boost is just too good

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by kaintk View Post
    nightfae is just too good, that burst in strenght power...man..you cant just ignore it

    but im sure it will be nerfed, its blizzard way to balance thing..nerf something and screw players :P

    - - - Updated - - -



    movement and STR boost, even if frost dont have multi hit with it, the str boost is just too good
    Oh no, I agree, I'd run Nightfae any day of the week, but at least an argument can be made for venthyr with breath, but even then, you likely just won't benefit from the extra uptime from the RP generation due to movement etc.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Nayami View Post
    Considering how OP Nightfae is for DKs, won't it probably be nerfed before launch? Or have other covenants buffed? I mean the 2nd best option is Venthyr and even that seems to be way behind Nightfae.

    I'm sure they'll tune these further. Every covenant can be made viable if tuned properly, sure there will still be a best pick but at least players can pick what they like without gimping themselves too much.
    I sure hope so. No changes in the beta build today

  16. #76
    venthyr .

    Good compromise between performance and personal flavor .

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