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  1. #21
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    I'm not reading too much into that honestly, because even in the short today, Uther looks like he instantly went to Bastion.

    And the way the Arbiter is described is as so-
    "When a soul is brought before the Arbiter, all of its contents—deeds, misdeeds, thoughts, accomplishments, and failures—are instantly laid bare, absorbed, and understood by her. The Arbiter then sends the soul off to one of the infinite realms of the Shadowlands, determined by the soul's character."

    So...it doesn't sound like a lengthy process at all, a quick judgement and then shuffled to where they belong. Perhaps the souls themselves are sometimes not even fully conscious when it happens.
    I don't think any souls truly remember their judgment before the Arbiter. In all the various realms and people you encounter in the Shadowlands, they all relate their experience as dying and then coming to in the realm they were assigned to.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    I don't think any souls truly remember their judgment before the Arbiter. In all the various realms and people you encounter in the Shadowlands, they all relate their experience as dying and then coming to in the realm they were assigned to.
    How would they remember something that happens in less than the blink of an eye to be honest, the arbiter judges the dead of the entire universe after all.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Question: How do you know Sylvanas was immediately sent to the Maw? For all we know, the short story simply skipped over her going to the Arbiter for judgement because the story wanted to focus on the moment when she went to the Maw.

    Plus if I'm not mistaken the short story literally opens with Sylvanas seeing a place full of joy, warmth, light, and an eternal sea (which could be the infinite stream of souls entering the Shadowlands). Do you know which place matches this decription?
    That describes the afterlife she went to in W3, until Arthas yanked her spirit back to Azeroth...
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    I like the theory that Yogg-saron tricked her into thinking she was damned and that's what led to her desire to remain, thanks to Sylvanas' suicide on a spike of saronite. From what I remember, death is supposed to be immune to the Void, but considering that the Light started to be able to interact with Death in Legion, who really knows anymore.

    Far cry considering that the Old Gods aren't in the story anymore, but that would work so much better.

    Where did this 'death is immune to the void' thing come from? Is that in a chronicles or something? While I could see someone strong willed enough to be Forsaken also being resistant to the void, or ENSLAVED undead like the Scourge not being vulnerable to the void because of the lich king holding them and not having free will to be corrupted, I have no idea where this idea that the undead/death are immune to void thing came from.

  5. #25
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    How would they remember something that happens in less than the blink of an eye to be honest, the arbiter judges the dead of the entire universe after all.
    Time is entirely plastic and subjective in the Shadowlands, apparently. The Arbiter could conceivably stretch a blink of an eye into a relative eternity to judge each soul that comes before her.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Feanoro View Post
    This thread reminds me of the frantic flailing before BfA launched trying to blame ANYONE or ANYTHING but the Lich Queen burning Teldrassil.
    Tbh I don't care if she's redeemed or not, more of pointing out that she was never processed and most likely brought to the Maw by the Valkyr who have been created by Maw powers who most likely work for the Jailer now and who also brought her back out of the Maw. Meaning it's not set in stone that she's destined for the Maw, like we previously were led to believe.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    To this I'd add; we all died in ICC and walked within Frostmourne which means we are marked by the Maw as well (that is, the players have).
    That doesn't really work anymore, vulpera aren't marked, neither are mechagnomes, Nightborne etc.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeBogina View Post
    Tbh I don't care if she's redeemed or not, more of pointing out that she was never processed and most likely brought to the Maw by the Valkyr who have been created by Maw powers who most likely work for the Jailer now and who also brought her back out of the Maw. Meaning it's not set in stone that she's destined for the Maw, like we previously were led to believe.
    How would they do that? The minions of the Maw cannot actually leave the Maw. That is why the Mawsworn started acting on Azeroth only after Sylvanas broke the veil.

    If you are referring to the Scourge Valkyrs, they were created by and served the Lich King.
    We each walk a line. Choose yours.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    How would they do that? The minions of the Maw cannot actually leave the Maw. That is why the Mawsworn started acting on Azeroth only after Sylvanas broke the veil.
    Helya is a minion of the maw and was quite active for millennia

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    I'd like to think Vulpera and MEchagnomes don't exist, thank you
    Still it leaves pretty much all the allied races out of the loop, they were not involved in the storming of ice crown.

  11. #31
    Herald of the Titans Nathreim's Avatar
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    Its even deeper than that. The Jailer created the Scourge and is responsible for everything Sylvanas suffered through and she doesn't even realize it yet. When she finds out she will turn on him.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Helya is a minion of the maw and was quite active for millennia
    But she isn't FROM the Maw. The reason the Jailer works with Helya, Mueh'zala and Kel'thuzad (and now Sylvanas) is because they exist outside the Maw but can do things for him.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Helya is a minion of the maw and was quite active for millennia
    Helya was turned by Odyn so she likely operates in a different way, even then she was still stuck in her realm and didn't have 100% control of it.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Nagawithlegs View Post
    But she isn't FROM the Maw. The reason the Jailer works with Helya, Mueh'zala and Kel'thuzad (and now Sylvanas) is because they exist outside the Maw but can do things for him.
    Wasn't really the point, the point was actually that not all minions of the Jailer were confined to the maw to begin with, hence Helya running rampant and being one of his minions.

  15. #35
    Stood in the Fire Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    And an interesting thing; Helya was turned by Odyn using knowledge given by Mueh'zala.
    Now it will be interesting to see if Helya is even aware about the whole Odyn/Mueh'zala deal. Also, what did he do with Odyn's eye?

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Florena View Post
    Where did this 'death is immune to the void' thing come from? Is that in a chronicles or something? While I could see someone strong willed enough to be Forsaken also being resistant to the void, or ENSLAVED undead like the Scourge not being vulnerable to the void because of the lich king holding them and not having free will to be corrupted, I have no idea where this idea that the undead/death are immune to void thing came from.
    It's not a direct thing, but an inference. Some quests in Icecrown imply that the Scourge is immune to the effects of saronite, which normal people would not be. It might be an extension of the Lich King's power rather than being undead inherently, but the wiki says the Ebon Blade are also immune, meaning it must be something else. I'd assume this carries over when not being impaled or seriously wounded by saronite. Should enough of it come into contact with an undead, that protection would vanish.

    Another interesting inference is that the undead racial passive is shadow resistance.
    Last edited by Goldielocks; 2020-08-27 at 09:24 PM.

  17. #37
    Banned Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DemonHunter18 View Post
    I knew this is gonna be created but not this soon xd

    this is how story will go.

    Sylvanas was thrown by xxx party to the Maw.

    she made a deal with Jailer.

    by the time we get to them we will learn how Sylvanas was unjustly thrown into the Maw by someone -insert name-.

    when we beat her ass, we are gonna get dumb sad emotional cinematic where they reveal how she was sent there even though she "doesn't" deserve it.

    she'll then switch sides because she was doing all this because of trickery and we will kill the Jailer while Sylvanas shouts Azeroth is free!!! and everyone forgives her except Tyrande (if she survives that is).

    called it first.
    You should have added spoiler tags to your post

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    How would they do that? The minions of the Maw cannot actually leave the Maw. That is why the Mawsworn started acting on Azeroth only after Sylvanas broke the veil.

    If you are referring to the Scourge Valkyrs, they were created by and served the Lich King.
    Yup referring to the Scourge Valkyr who were present at her death, who sacrificed themselves to bring her back to life and because they're based on Valkyr who are based on Kyrians, but are created with Scourge powers that belong to... Really powerful artifacts that have maw powers
    I don't remember if the Valkyr were there in the Maw with her, I think they were, but they made a pact and she was brought back to life.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    You should have added spoiler tags to your post
    LMAO yeah xd
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    except she was, she literally was experimenting on prisoners men, women, children, soldier, and civilian,
    to try and make a stronger and stronger plague.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    Your not gonna win trying to make this one realize the truth.
    Your have better luck curing Corona with lemon and lime juice

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeBogina View Post
    Yup referring to the Scourge Valkyr who were present at her death, who sacrificed themselves to bring her back to life and because they're based on Valkyr who are based on Kyrians, but are created with Scourge powers that belong to... Really powerful artifacts that have maw powers
    I don't remember if the Valkyr were there in the Maw with her, I think they were, but they made a pact and she was brought back to life.
    But those valkyrs were still created by the Lich King and served him. Even though the Lich King was an agent of the Maw and his powers derived from the Maw, his affiliations were his own.
    We each walk a line. Choose yours.

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