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  1. #1
    Pandaren Monk taishar68's Avatar
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    Relics of the Past

    So, I was wondering how other people see the Relic system. I can't see any broad application that makes it a "wow" feature, but maybe I am missing something. As an example, despite the item and level squish, there isn't much difference in a item that is level 95 (the bracers my mage is currently wearing) and level 100, which I can craft from various expansions with the new system.

    My mage is around 455 on live, which works out to 109 in the ptr, so that tells me that many players who raid and run M+ a lot will see no benefit from this system; I have a hunter in the 380 range who becomes 71 in the PTR, so it should help him a lot...unless of course it's easier just to do pre-patch catch-up for a day or two, as in previous years.

    As for the system once we're in SL...it looks like a way to create good catch-up gear for alts or to sell on the AH, but it seems like a high crafting price for that increase, and we will always have the gear drops to weigh against it, but with less gear dropping in SL, maybe it will have a lot more value. Currently with an SL Relic V you can upgrade an item to level 180, from a base of 165, which is slightly lower than M0 gear (183). How quickly we can gather mats will determine if it's worth it to create said upgrades, I guess.

    So as I said at the start, am I missing something that makes it more worthwhile? I'm not trying to be negative about it, profs look way better than they did in BFA/Legion, but this part leaves me a bit puzzled. Thanks for reading.
    "Can't you see this is the last act of a desperate man?"
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  2. #2
    If you can craft stat-perfect items & find yourself missing a few items from M+0s when the raid opens, it could be a good way to fill in the blanks like we did with Obliterum gear back in Legion. Sure the Item Level wasn't great, but you could grab stat-perfect gear of a just-below normal raid quality (I think?) for a decent price & go into the raid quite a bit stronger if you'd not bought anything.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    Currently with an SL Relic V you can upgrade an item to level 180, from a base of 165, which is slightly lower than M0 gear (183). How quickly we can gather mats will determine if it's worth it to create said upgrades, I guess.

    So as I said at the start, am I missing something that makes it more worthwhile? I'm not trying to be negative about it, profs look way better than they did in BFA/Legion, but this part leaves me a bit puzzled. Thanks for reading.
    Your info is slightly wrong.

    It's Crafter's Marks (not Relic of the Past) that increases Shadowlands items. Crafter's Mark III sets them to ilvl 180, Crafter's Mark IV increases gear to ilvl 200. Not only can you set ilvl but also specify secondary stats.

    To learn Crafter's Mark III you need revered, IV needs exalted rep from different factions. I have no idea how much grinding you gotta do for the reputation, but once you have it the mats for making ilvl 200 gear aren't really expensive so it seems noone needs to go M0 once Shadowlands is a couple weeks old.

  4. #4
    Pandaren Monk taishar68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twdft View Post
    Your info is slightly wrong.

    It's Crafter's Marks (not Relic of the Past) that increases Shadowlands items. Crafter's Mark III sets them to ilvl 180, Crafter's Mark IV increases gear to ilvl 200. Not only can you set ilvl but also specify secondary stats.

    To learn Crafter's Mark III you need revered, IV needs exalted rep from different factions. I have no idea how much grinding you gotta do for the reputation, but once you have it the mats for making ilvl 200 gear aren't really expensive so it seems noone needs to go M0 once Shadowlands is a couple weeks old.
    Yeah, I forgot to edit the post with the crafter's mark info. The gear levels are a bit wonky; from what I saw on the PTR, crafted blues are 165, heroics are 170, M0 is 180, LFR is 183....could they make heroic dungeons any less relevant? Even without a level upgrade I'd rather have the 165 if I can set the stats to my liking.

    Some of the costs seem off on crafting materials, on a side note; the tailoring thread sells for 1g each, so you'd need 100g to make a CM V from tailoring, but the same mark will cost JC's 600g!
    "Can't you see this is the last act of a desperate man?"
    "We don't care if it's the last act of Henry the Fifth, we're leaving!"

  5. #5
    Crafter's Mark are BoP.

    Different people like different things, maybe some just spec tank and chain run heroics while others grind exalted and craft gear.

    But eventually it will be much cheaper/faster to buy the crafted gear from AH when more people get exalted.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Twdft View Post
    Crafter's Mark are BoP.

    Different people like different things, maybe some just spec tank and chain run heroics while others grind exalted and craft gear.

    But eventually it will be much cheaper/faster to buy the crafted gear from AH when more people get exalted.
    So Basically making professions a little more relevant again, and bring back some rpg elements to the game.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by TigTone View Post
    So Basically making professions a little more relevant again, and bring back some rpg elements to the game.
    Yeah, I think this system is cool. Slight problem with Crafter's Marks being BoP is you'll have to grind at least two chars to exalted to be able to craft all armor classes for your Alts if you want to be selfsufficient. But in the end AH will be cheaper anyway, because while exalted takes a while once several people have it the gear itself is relatively cheap to make.

  8. #8
    Pandaren Monk taishar68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twdft View Post
    Crafter's Mark are BoP.

    Different people like different things, maybe some just spec tank and chain run heroics while others grind exalted and craft gear.

    But eventually it will be much cheaper/faster to buy the crafted gear from AH when more people get exalted.
    I just meant that the mats you buy form the vendor cost more for a JC than they do for, say, a tailor. It seems weird that it should cost 6X more gold for a JC to make than a tailor.
    "Can't you see this is the last act of a desperate man?"
    "We don't care if it's the last act of Henry the Fifth, we're leaving!"

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Twdft View Post
    Your info is slightly wrong.

    It's Crafter's Marks (not Relic of the Past) that increases Shadowlands items. Crafter's Mark III sets them to ilvl 180, Crafter's Mark IV increases gear to ilvl 200. Not only can you set ilvl but also specify secondary stats.

    To learn Crafter's Mark III you need revered, IV needs exalted rep from different factions. I have no idea how much grinding you gotta do for the reputation, but once you have it the mats for making ilvl 200 gear aren't really expensive so it seems noone needs to go M0 once Shadowlands is a couple weeks old.
    i have a feeling that by the time you can get the rep to buy the pattern you will already have better gear. depends where rep comes from. most zones have 4 wq max. i have a feeling rep is going to take a while.

  10. #10
    Pandaren Monk taishar68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcc626 View Post
    i have a feeling that by the time you can get the rep to buy the pattern you will already have better gear. depends where rep comes from. most zones have 4 wq max. i have a feeling rep is going to take a while.
    And that’s been the frustrating part of professions for far too long; by the time you can scrape together the mats to make the really good stuff your profession can make, you don’t need it anymore. Let’s not even dwell on the bowl of fail the last 2 expacs have had: “We see you like making mediocre bracers of meh, so go pay Faction Joe 1700 gold, after you grind their rep of course, and you can make those same meh bracers for one mat less each.” Fucking horrible.
    Last edited by taishar68; 2020-09-03 at 01:26 AM.
    "Can't you see this is the last act of a desperate man?"
    "We don't care if it's the last act of Henry the Fifth, we're leaving!"

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    And that’s been the frustrating part of professions for far too long; by the time you can scrape together the mats to make the really good stuff your profession can make, you don’t need it anymore.
    That's probably a deliberate design decision, players who do group content right away are not the intended audience for profession items anymore. I think it's intended for solo players to have a long term goal in their gear progression.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    If you are super casual, I'd say not really. ilvl 200 gear is better than anything you can get from world quests or lfr.
    Can you still craft the lvl IV tokens in beta? On the PTR they vanished from the recipe list. It says II needs revered now.
    /tar Tinker-zealot /point /lol
    WoW:Shadowlands - Danuser's Divina Commedia?

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    Can you still craft the lvl IV tokens in beta? On the PTR they vanished from the recipe list. It says II needs revered now.
    That is correct for beta too lmao.

    Highest currently is Crafter's Mark II for ilvl 168 / req lvl 60

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Twdft View Post
    That is correct for beta too lmao.

    Highest currently is Crafter's Mark II for ilvl 168 / req lvl 60
    I guess that is the final nail for me when it comes to learning an armor profession with my main; alchemy +herbalism/enchanting it is..
    /tar Tinker-zealot /point /lol
    WoW:Shadowlands - Danuser's Divina Commedia?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    I guess that is the final nail for me when it comes to learning an armor profession with my main; alchemy +herbalism/enchanting it is..
    Professions are not nearly done, tailors don't even have a new bag pattern yet. But yeah, I'll probably drop Leatherworking on main for Alchemy too.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Twdft View Post
    Professions are not nearly done, tailors don't even have a new bag pattern yet. But yeah, I'll probably drop Leatherworking on main for Alchemy too.
    Tbh I figured Tailoring just won't get one. They can't go up to 34 slots because of the dalaran scam bag and the market has already been drowned in BfA 32 slot ones with 30 being extremeley cheap.

    The other things around professions also seem rather complete. They ticked the usual boxes for gimmiks and base procucts. I wouldn't be surprised if this is what we will launch with.
    /tar Tinker-zealot /point /lol
    WoW:Shadowlands - Danuser's Divina Commedia?

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    Tbh I figured Tailoring just won't get one. They can't go up to 34 slots because of the dalaran scam bag and the market has already been drowned in BfA 32 slot ones with 30 being extremeley cheap.
    Would be the first time without any new bags. Current oversupply of 32 slots will be sucked out of the market very quick when many players level new alts in prepatch.

    Shadowlands should get a cheap 30 slot and an expensive 32 slot bag. Otherwise you would have to run BfA dungeons to make the biggest bags available. Older "biggest" bags always just had materials on a daily cooldown.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    If you are super casual, I'd say not really. ilvl 200 gear is better than anything you can get from world quests or lfr.
    yeah, i guess. m0 is what 183? so yeah, for them its fine. for people who do a bit more content it will probably be too late.

  19. #19

  20. #20
    THIS IS REALLY NEAT I WAS PLAYING WITH THIS ON THE PTR TOO.. IM DEF TAKING TAILORING AND ENCHATING CAUSE IM GOING TO BE A UNDEAD DESTRO WARLOCK.. ..BUT i WILL MAKE AND ALT FOR HERB/ AND ALCH. I FEEL ALCH AND HERB ARE UNIVERSAL

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