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  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Gestopft View Post
    Assuming reasonably BIS distribution and reasonably covenant balance among players, this is going to affect everyone roughly the same.
    I really don't think you can assume reasonable covenant balance among players though, since one of the covenants (Night Fae) comes with an incredibly useful non-combat ability that is going to push way more people into that covenant than the others.

    As it stands there's already a heirarchy of covenants based on their non-combat abilities which puts Night Fae clearly on top and Necrolords clearly on the bottom, since a lot of people will choose their covenant for QoL reasons.
    Last edited by ydraw; 2020-09-05 at 03:12 AM.

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by goldlock View Post
    That trinket was bis if its the one im thinking of for most classes...
    Bis is bis, not scuffed 30 ilvl lower than bis.

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    Bis is bis, not scuffed 30 ilvl lower than bis.
    I have no idea what it is your trying to say... I mean even now eternal palace trinkets are being used in the last tier.

  4. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by NotTrolling View Post
    This thread is worthless when they don't even tune numbers until extremely late in beta, potentially a few weeks before launch
    Some Covenant skills are inherently bad and not even number tuning will make them good.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again
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  5. #125
    I'm thinking Blizzard could have saved a lot of development money by just not doing any of this crap that players really don't want.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler
    WoW is like 99% bear ass collection simulator -- D-Rock

  6. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    I'm thinking Blizzard could have saved a lot of development money by just not doing any of this crap that players really don't want.
    I mean... that has been argued since the original artifact weapons. I saw a ton of excitement for having weapons that unlocked new looks as you played and that part of the system was loved. I don't know why they removed the singular part of the system people liked and kept the horrid grind everyone complained about. Sure they made it better (at the start you had to do your artifact research each week so late comers where screwed) I still never heard more then maybe one in a hundred people say they enjoy it.

    Busy work systems seem like the way of the future though if you want to avoid them play classic (without doing pvp) or tbc when it comes out.

  7. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    I'm thinking Blizzard could have saved a lot of development money by just not doing any of this crap that players really don't want.
    I think the whole thing would have been viewed as an overwhelmingly positive system if they had just let it be a cosmetic/storyline choice.

    Blizzards issue of late hasn't been about good ideas, it's the execution that has left us scratching our heads.

  8. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by Armourboy View Post
    I think the whole thing would have been viewed as an overwhelmingly positive system if they had just let it be a cosmetic/storyline choice.

    Blizzards issue of late hasn't been about good ideas, it's the execution that has left us scratching our heads.
    I mean there is still an easy solution for Covenants. Give every Covenant at 60 a questline that can be done by everyone. At the end of the questline you get the specific Covenant skill ability and then you can decide to join the Covenant and to unlock all the other stuff they have or to move on to the next Covenant. Like you do all 4 Covenant entry questlines and after that you make a choice. The way it is now is just not thought out.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again
    Vote #Jaina!
    #Proudmoore4AllianceLeader
    #ImwithHer2020

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    I mean there is still an easy solution for Covenants. Give every Covenant at 60 a questline that can be done by everyone. At the end of the questline you get the specific Covenant skill ability and then you can decide to join the Covenant and to unlock all the other stuff they have or to move on to the next Covenant. Like you do all 4 Covenant entry questlines and after that you make a choice. The way it is now is just not thought out.
    We should get access to all of them but they will be stubborn at the start. Probably lose subs over the first little bit. I'm sure the mount vote will probably equate to the new 6 month sub mount in the hopes they can keep people playing even after they realise how bad the system is. Playing the beta has me avoiding this launch. BFA taught me this current team doesn't know how to make a fun game.

  10. #130
    This is a "my favorites" thread, not a bis list :|

  11. #131
    Epic! Redroniksre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msmollymillions View Post
    We should get access to all of them but they will be stubborn at the start. Probably lose subs over the first little bit. I'm sure the mount vote will probably equate to the new 6 month sub mount in the hopes they can keep people playing even after they realise how bad the system is. Playing the beta has me avoiding this launch. BFA taught me this current team doesn't know how to make a fun game.
    The mount vote is for a free mount they are giving out in Q1 of 2021, just an fyi.

  12. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    I mean there is still an easy solution for Covenants. Give every Covenant at 60 a questline that can be done by everyone. At the end of the questline you get the specific Covenant skill ability and then you can decide to join the Covenant and to unlock all the other stuff they have or to move on to the next Covenant. Like you do all 4 Covenant entry questlines and after that you make a choice. The way it is now is just not thought out.
    Removinh power from choosing covenant will ruin them.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    I'm thinking Blizzard could have saved a lot of development money by just not doing any of this crap that players really don't want.
    Yeah you know most of stuff what players want would straight up ruin entire game. Players are not game designers. Give feedback yes but dont exoect that devs will alienate entire game just becouse clueless players think they know how to desing game.

  13. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    Yeah you know most of stuff what players want would straight up ruin entire game.
    And they stuff they don't want will not ruin the game? So, if you complain about something, I should take that as an indication it should be included or kept, because it will actually keep you subbed?

    The reality is the game has mostly ruined itself, with 90+% of the people who have played it having been driven away.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler
    WoW is like 99% bear ass collection simulator -- D-Rock

  14. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    And they stuff they don't want will not ruin the game? So, if you complain about something, I should take that as an indication it should be included or kept, because it will actually keep you subbed?

    The reality is the game has mostly ruined itself, with 90+% of the people who have played it having been driven away.
    Do you realize that many things what players percieve as bad for the game is exactly what makes game fun in the end?

    Do you remeber all the incoviniences in vannila? Lot of people didnt like it. What they do not realize is that becouse of those incoviences and friction they got into situations what those players end up enyojing and created memorable experiences for them. And by removing it you also remove those fun and memorable experiences. In case of covenants you remove player identity and make game more homogenized. So yes lot of people what think is bad for them is in fact good for overall health of the game.

  15. #135
    For Disc Priest seems to be Kyrian

    PS: not 100% sure, just what i see of people talking, i have no Beta access to test

  16. #136
    Spam Assassin! MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Motorman View Post
    I think its still too early to discuss BiS covenant however the fact that players are looking for "BiS" of a game mechanic already shows its badly implemented and will cause problems. If it so happens as "BiS per class" then where will the diversity and uniqueness of classes and choice go?
    People are always going to look for "BiS" even where it may not exist. Human nature mostly. I'm fairly sure that some raids will favor one over another and others will favor different ones. Many tears expected.
    “We live in a moment where everything immediately seems to default to outrage. There’s a kind of M.O. of either it’s exactly how I see it, or you’re my enemy.”

  17. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    Do you realize that many things what players percieve as bad for the game is exactly what makes game fun in the end?
    I realize entitled people like to imagine their personal preferences > the preferences of large numbers of other people. So of course you try to denigrate the desires of others.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler
    WoW is like 99% bear ass collection simulator -- D-Rock

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    Removinh power from choosing covenant will ruin them.
    If removing that one ability from Covenants ruins them then it wasn't a very good system to start with.

  19. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by Armourboy View Post
    If removing that one ability from Covenants ruins them then it wasn't a very good system to start with.
    That is a faulty logic there. If I buy a lawnmower then my fridge will start heating food instead.

  20. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    That is a faulty logic there. If I buy a lawnmower then my fridge will start heating food instead.
    No it's not. If you remove the Covenant ability there are still choices to be made. The whole system doesn't break down or stop working.

    They are nothing more than class halls from Legion, but this time you get to choose which one you want to participate in.

    Covenants would be fine even if the ability wasn't there at all.

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