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  1. #1
    Mechagnome Sagenod's Avatar
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    Where is Ner'zhul?

    If he was bound to the Helm of Domination which was broken, what happened to his spirit? My guess is the Maw.
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  2. #2
    Titan Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Arthas "killed" ner'zhul spirit, probably extinguished forever, not even the maw, just ceased to exist

  3. #3
    Banned Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    Arthas "killed" ner'zhul spirit, probably extinguished forever, not even the maw, just ceased to exist
    The odd part is that he is actually heard by the DK player during the Legion class campaign

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    Arthas "killed" ner'zhul spirit, probably extinguished forever, not even the maw, just ceased to exist
    There is atleast some form of spirit left in the shards of frostmourne, when Uther soul was broken in two then it can be the case for Ner'zhul aswell.
    Ofc blizzard sofar did not show any love to the Ner'zhul character tho so i wonder if they will show him in SL.
    So some part of Ner'zhul should now be in the Blades of the Fallen Prince, just cant remember what lore character had them at the end of Legion when we cleansed the sword of Sargaras but when this guy goes in the SL then the guy that made frostmourne can extract the souls from it.
    Last edited by tromage2; 2020-09-05 at 09:45 PM.

  5. #5
    First of all, Ner'zhul wasnt killed. Arthas reduced him to a veil/scream of sorrow in the helmet
    What we dont know, where he is after the helmet was broken. Could be that his spirit was released. Could also be that he is still bound to the pieces of the helmet (as its confirmed that they still hold some power)
    Bolvar mentions him at the start of SL when he talks about how he felt the Jailer, so Blizz hasnt fully forgotten about him
    But i wouldnt hold out any hope he appears, as Blizz seemingly started to hate the character like no other after WC3. I dont know a single character this important who got shafted, ignored and thrown away like Ner'zhul

    Edit: what we saw in the Blades of the Fallen Prince was an Echo of Ner'zhul. but it is worth noting that only Arthas echo dies, while Ner'zhuls specifically ports away
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  6. #6
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Ner'zhul is dead, his spirit and essence consumed by Arthas when the two merged and Arthas took control of the merger (as per Arthas: Rise of the Lich King). The only thing remaining of Ner'zhul is an echo within Frostmourne and the Helm of Domination, which is simply a memory of his existence and skill-set possessed by the Lich King. For all intents and purposes Ner'zhul is well and truly gone.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    Ner'zhul is dead, his spirit and essence consumed by Arthas when the two merged and Arthas took control of the merger (as per Arthas: Rise of the Lich King). The only thing remaining of Ner'zhul is an echo within Frostmourne and the Helm of Domination, which is simply a memory of his existence and skill-set possessed by the Lich King. For all intents and purposes Ner'zhul is well and truly gone.
    the Arthas book was retconned by chronicles. Arthas dominated him when they merged, but years later Ner'zhul resurfaced. they fought each other over control, and arthas won by snapping ner'zhuls sanity and turning his soul/mind. but he couldnt kill him.
    ner'zhul remained in the helmet, as a screaming, sorrowful voice, that "arthas found easy to ignore"
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  8. #8
    Probably released straight into the Maw in the Shadowlands cinematic.
    Blizzard is juggling so many characters at this point (some of them really poorly) so they probably forgot about him... for the moment.
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    the Arthas book was retconned by chronicles. Arthas dominated him when they merged, but years later Ner'zhul resurfaced. they fought each other over control, and arthas won by snapping ner'zhuls sanity and turning his soul/mind. but he couldnt kill him.
    ner'zhul remained in the helmet, as a screaming, sorrowful voice, that "arthas found easy to ignore"
    Chronicles is most likely going to be retconned in return, with their whole "according to the Titans" bullshit.

  10. #10
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    the Arthas book was retconned by chronicles. Arthas dominated him when they merged, but years later Ner'zhul resurfaced. they fought each other over control, and arthas won by snapping ner'zhuls sanity and turning his soul/mind. but he couldnt kill him.
    ner'zhul remained in the helmet, as a screaming, sorrowful voice, that "arthas found easy to ignore"
    That's actually pretty much the synopsis of Arthas, Rise of the Lich King in shorthand, though - not really a retcon of any sort. Arthas and Ner'zhul basically entered a sort of torpor while the two vied for control of their shared body. Arthas won the struggle in the end, and awoke years later to begin setting up the events of WotLK. Ner'zhul's echo that we encounter during the Blades of the Fallen Prince acquisition is all that's left of him, the voice that Arthas claimed to find easy to ignore. Arthas still had access to Ner'zhul's memories and skills, but Ner'zhul's sentience was essentially expunged from the equation.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    That's actually pretty much the synopsis of Arthas, Rise of the Lich King in shorthand, though - not really a retcon of any sort. Arthas and Ner'zhul basically entered a sort of torpor while the two vied for control of their shared body. Arthas won the struggle in the end, and awoke years later to begin setting up the events of WotLK. Ner'zhul's echo that we encounter during the Blades of the Fallen Prince acquisition is all that's left of him, the voice that Arthas claimed to find easy to ignore. Arthas still had access to Ner'zhul's memories and skills, but Ner'zhul's sentience was essentially expunged from the equation.
    now thats a hard reach
    why would ner'zhul fade into an echo, and why would he be in the blades? his soul is bound to the helmet, which is why arthas couldnt get rid of him, and why he kept hearing his screaming voice as LK while wearing the helm.
    and since he didnt die, so why would his crippled spirit turn into an echo of him?
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  12. #12
    Herald of the Titans Nathreim's Avatar
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    Souls can be destroyed Illidan destroyed souls to fuel his spell to destroy the Nathrezim homeworld. Its possible Arthas destroyed his soul completely when he took over. Or it could be somewhere in the Shadowlands who knows.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    The odd part is that he is actually heard by the DK player during the Legion class campaign
    That was an echo not the actual soul I believe.
    Last edited by Nathreim; 2020-09-06 at 02:58 AM.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Hextor View Post
    Probably released straight into the Maw in the Shadowlands cinematic.
    Blizzard is juggling so many characters at this point (some of them really poorly) so they probably forgot about him... for the moment.
    More like they want us to forget about him. If you ask me, the fact that Ner'zhul was trapped in the helm makes the idea that the helm itself some super uber artifact from the Shadowlands extremely ridiculous. No functioning Dreadlord would ever bestow such power to a fucking orc soul. The whole thing is absurd.

  14. #14
    Titan Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tromage2 View Post
    There is atleast some form of spirit left in the shards of frostmourne, when Uther soul was broken in two then it can be the case for Ner'zhul aswell.
    Ofc blizzard sofar did not show any love to the Ner'zhul character tho so i wonder if they will show him in SL.
    So some part of Ner'zhul should now be in the Blades of the Fallen Prince, just cant remember what lore character had them at the end of Legion when we cleansed the sword of Sargaras but when this guy goes in the SL then the guy that made frostmourne can extract the souls from it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    The odd part is that he is actually heard by the DK player during the Legion class campaign
    pretty sure they said those things are just echoes, arthas old memories, it was not rly ner'zhul or a fragment of nerzhul essence.

    They actually said ner'zhul is gone and they are done with.

    But, its blizzard we are talking about, i can totally see they retconing that.

  15. #15
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    now thats a hard reach
    why would ner'zhul fade into an echo, and why would he be in the blades? his soul is bound to the helmet, which is why arthas couldnt get rid of him, and why he kept hearing his screaming voice as LK while wearing the helm.
    and since he didnt die, so why would his crippled spirit turn into an echo of him?
    Ner'zhul was previously intertwined with all the elements of the Lich King's substance (Frostmourne, the Helm of Domination, and the Plate of the Damned) within the Frozen Throne that essentially was his immobile prison/body before Arthas shattered it. Therefore his essence is partly in the Helm, in Frostmourne, and presumably the Plate of the Damned (wherever it actually went). He's confirmed to be dead, though, as per both Chronicle and a Developer Q&A:
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    "Yeah, Ner'zhul is done. He served us well in that capacity, but really the Lich King idea... really has the ultimate expression, you know, as Arthas or whatever. Ner'zhul's done." (Source)
    So yes, he's conclusively dead, and only the echo of him remains in the Helm and in Frostmourne, the latter of which Death Knights encounter briefly in Legion.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

  16. #16
    Arthas consumed Ner'zhul in the book to become the only entity of the Lich King

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    So yes, he's conclusively dead, and only the echo of him remains in the Helm and in Frostmourne, the latter of which Death Knights encounter briefly in Legion.
    The fact that Bolvar was very different with the helm on (and subsequently returns to being more like his old self when the helm is shattered) makes this messy. A mere echo can have this much of an effect? How does that work?

  18. #18
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    The fact that Bolvar was very different with the helm on (and subsequently returns to being more like his old self when the helm is shattered) makes this messy. A mere echo can have this much of an effect? How does that work?
    That's probably not anything to do with Ner'zhul, but more the fact the Helm is connected to the Maw (and likely the Jailer). Also, being connected to the hive-mind of the Scourge probably doesn't do one's sanity many favors to begin with.
    "Here lies a toppled god.
    His fall was not a small one.
    We did but build his pedestal,
    A narrow and a tall one."

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    That's probably not anything to do with Ner'zhul, but more the fact the Helm is connected to the Maw (and likely the Jailer). Also, being connected to the hive-mind of the Scourge probably doesn't do one's sanity many favors to begin with.
    It's very hard to believe that Blizzard intended that so far back when they had Bolvar take on the Lich King's voice as he froze in the ICC end cinematic. Bolvar became a much darker person. It's obvious during the DK Legion campaign. Sanity really has nothing to do with it.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by tromage2 View Post
    There is atleast some form of spirit left in the shards of frostmourne, when Uther soul was broken in two then it can be the case for Ner'zhul aswell.
    Ofc blizzard sofar did not show any love to the Ner'zhul character tho so i wonder if they will show him in SL.
    So some part of Ner'zhul should now be in the Blades of the Fallen Prince, just cant remember what lore character had them at the end of Legion when we cleansed the sword of Sargaras but when this guy goes in the SL then the guy that made frostmourne can extract the souls from it.
    Even assuming that every soul slain by Frostmourne is split, why would Ner'zhul's be in it?

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