Covenant balance when factoring in stat modifiers?

[Krazzorx]

Dps shaman question

This is not about “the covenant system is awful” or “which covenant should I pick?”, this is about I’m curious how big of an impact talent effects and other class mechanics affect the balance of the covenants.

And yes I know more tuning is coming. Also, ignoring primordial wave since that’s a different kind of ability than the other 3

I know that right now everyone is saying Vesper is the best for dps for a myriad of reasons. What I’m curious about though is, how does balance change when you start adding modifiers onto Fae Transfusion and Chain Harvest?

For Fae Transfusion, what does it look like when enhance’s mastery is added on and if master of the elements works on it for Ele shaman? What’s the impact of using MotE as both taking the talent vs other options and using the proc on Fae transfusion vs any other use?

For chain harvest, for enh, if it gets the msw power boost but does not get the hooks added in, what does its power level become? For ele, what does echoing shock do for it if it works? Double chain harvest sounds really powerful though you are giving up a useage of echoing shock for it and can’t take elemental blast. So how much would echoing shock affect it’s power level?

I just see people constantly saying best will vesper no matter what but idk if that’s taking into consideration that nothing can affect its power while other, currently possibly not working interactions do effect Fae Transfusion and Chain Harvest for both specs

[Manu9]

Chain Harvest with MSW stacks damage boost and the conduit MSW damage boost would be a truck, now does that make it better? I have no idea, but it's hitting for 4-5 per target now in a dungeon, imagine 100%-120% more on that, that's half of my health. Oof. I hope that actually makes it viable.

[kosajk]

you can look for movie about convenants on enh shaman at youtube with numbers breakouts


all in all MSW is not increasing conduit DMG of it and only one is affected by mastery which make it a bit better in aoe situations although its chaneled so a bit of tradeoff anyway, and increse from totem is not that high imo
will see if it wont be changed i dont think they want masteries to affect it in the end

[Aurosh]

Well Chain Harvest is too weak without MSW damage scaling.

Just look at ST:

Kirian in a 4 min fight is 4 casts for 3 ticks of about 100% weapon dmg: 4 × 3 × 100 = 1200 , doubled by soulbind = 2400.

Chain Harvest is 3 casts of 350 = 1050. Now add 17% crit of the soulbind, lets say 1250.

And this isnt the whole story. You also consume 15 MSW stacks - which is 3 LBs about 95 × 2.5 with MSW soulbind × 1.4 (mastery scaling) = 997 lost damage.

So Vesper is 2400 damage gained + 1000 additional LB damage = 3400.

Chain Harvest is 1250.

So 3400 > 1250. So even with 100% or 150% increased damage, Chain Harvest wouldnt be best at ST. Sims are going to show you that Kirian will be much more dps gain.

If CH would be baseline instant cast without MSW Scaling, it would be 2400 > 1250.

Chain Harvest is the burstier tool though. So CHarv simming lower is fine if the difference is smaller. With MSW scaling to about 100%, Vesper would be better in ST, but CHarv would be burstier and better in cleave.

Pwave has the problem that it consumes msw charges and that we lack tools to spread/apply FS to many targets - and it also consumes MSW Charges. So simply buffing its damage by msw charges isnt going to be enough, but it would help. Imo Pwave should be baseline instant for enhance or hardcast without consuming MSW.