Mythic Raiding in SL = all other content not relevant?

[Orwell7]

So Alterac Valley should give the best rewards because there's 40 man required going by your logic. It doesn't matter how hard it is, Mythic raiding is easier because it's 20 man instead of 40, right? I mean, you disregarded any difficulty in PvP and M+ because they have smaller groups, so I'm just applying your logic here.

Will you sign my petiton to Blizzard to make Alterac Valley reward gear equal to last two bosses of mythic tier raid?

AV is PvP and PvP is another really great topic - separating PvE and PvP gear should happen again, and yes, Rated BGs should reward the best ilvl of all (like +6 compared to similar arena rating, just like the last 2 bosses).

On topic, I really like these changes!
If I don't have to spend a BIG portion of my gametime on mindless/boring grind I'm happy. And no wonder the "grind" word: it felt like meaningless work.

[kenn9530]

Not good at all. Mythic+ should give the same rewards as mythic raiding.

If not it might be the main cause of me saying buh bye to my WoW subscription and finding another MMO.


Just checked it out and the mythic+ chest will still drop loot that is = mythic raiding ilvl, so combined with the multiple slots you get, that is probably fine as it is.

Unless you raid you shouldnt be able to obtain the most pwerful gear, mythic plus should of never granted mythic raiding level of gear and the weekly chest shouldnt either, it should at most grant you heroic raiding gear of the tier and thats it. Gear is too easy to get these days and its essentially pointless since your showered with loot.

[Accendor]

It's like Blizzard learns nothing, ever. It's actually kind of impressive. So for me as a Mythic raider what this means is that I'll login for my weekly raid, logout, and not touch WoW until the following week. How amazingly boring. I was already not very excited for SL and this just puts the interest meter somewhere around 0. They went from a fuckton of optional content that had the potential to be rewarding in Legion to "lol raid log, nothing else is worth it." in SL. Absolutely massive step backwards.

They created an alternative to raiding in M+ and it was actually quite good and now they're crippling it.

This is exactly my issue.

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Are you guys mental? M+ at 15 still literally rewards mythic raid loot from the weekly cache. With the final 2 bosses from mythic rewarding higher ilvl like it is now
The only change they made is that spamming M+s at 15 wont basically make heroic raiding irrelevant.... and only BY 3 ILVLs.
This is an amazing change. If anything they kept M+ just as relevant, spamming it no longer replaces heroic raiding for gearing but instead opens more choices for you for weekly chest and still rewards relevant gear (only 3 ilvls lower than heroic boohoo), you still get mythic raid ilvl from your weekly if you do M+15 and Mythic raiders get to enjoy TWO WHOLE BOSSES (OH MY GOD THE TRAGEDY) of higher ilvl.
People at this point of the expac dont spam it and its still popular af

You did not get my point. If you only raid normal or heroic its fine. The problem starts when you do mythic raids.

[Orwell7]

I mean cosmetic rewards are not really motivating either. Mage tower was fine, but if no character progression of tied to it, it feels pointless.

Then you're not "playing" this game for gameplay, you play it because it triggered fake dopamine releases in your brain.
Don't go near casinos, please, it seems like you could easily hook on these artificial addicting things :-\

[Accendor]

The weekly Mythic+ cache still gives Mythic Raid iLvl loot, and thanks to the choice system, getting a (near) full loadout of really good item level pieces shouldn't be an issue at all.

Yes, but that's one m+ per week. Yeah, you can do more, but that is very inefficient and in the end you still only get one item. Its hardcore timegating, which is a big problem, if there is nothing else to do.

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Then you're not "playing" this game for gameplay, you play it because it triggered fake dopamine releases in your brain.
Don't go near casinos, please, it seems like you could easily hook on these artificial addicting things :-\

Mate, that's how almost all games work. Stop with that bs argument please

[Deferionus]

BC and Wrath were very raid or die, which is what I referring to

BC and Wrath you had PvP sets with ilvls on par with raiding gear from the top tier. I would very much like that back.

[Rafalga]

A 15 Mythic is easier than heroic raiding. Why would it give you better loot?

You can't be serious

[Accendor]

Everyone is freaking out about the change and the difference in gear from a 210 to 213 is 1 primary 2 stam and 1 secondary. If your top performance is nerfed by a combined 4 stats you got problems.

I get your point, but what you miss is that 3ilv make the difference between "well, I have some spare time and could do this dungeon to maybe get a small upgrade" and "this dungeon if literally not worth going to"

[Accendor]

You can always play alts. That is the idea. You can do more mythic+ to add chest options. You can PvP to add chest option.

I honestly like it better this way. I don't want to have to log in everyday to stay competitive for the raid.

Yeah, i really strongly prefer to play one character, max 2 if needed for the raid, but that's it.

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What why? Do Mythic+ nothing else.
Do PvP.
Do raiding.
Do old content...

heavens...
A 15 Mythic is easier than heroic raiding. Why would it give you better loot?

If you are only interested in gear... still do mythic+. You won't be decked out in heroic gear in weak one.

There is exactly as much to do as before.
If you only EVER go for the highets reward you have been only able to do mythic raiding and the weekly mythic+ in BfA too... so... no change there

Well, before we had the AP systems. They are gone now, so ofc there is much less to do in terms of character progression. Saying it's the same is just not true.

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HOW IS IT DIFFERENT FROM NOW??????
Like now if you spam it you get HEROIC ilvl gear. In SL you ll get ONLY 3 ilvls bellow.
in BOTH SL and BfA you only get mythic raid gear lvl from the weekly chest.
How did they ruin your precious structure? You ll be getting mythic gear from +15 just like before and you ll have even more choices now if you do more M+s

The difference is that when you raid mythic, you are already heroic equipped and therefore there is no reason to do m+ at all (except the weekly, which is not only timegated but also a lootbox)

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Okay, let's try.

WoD - Had M+? No.
BFA - Will have M+? Yes.

Here, done. They're different expansions.

Well, it had CMs...

[tmamass]

This is a good thing

There is a plethora of optional content for you at max level - but seemingly not anywhere near as much content required of you versus BFA

WHAT? having to run 10(!) mythic+ dungeons per week is not much required???

[razorpax]

the m+ gear will be heroic ilvl for +15 and the vault from a +15 will offer mythic level loot

torghast is meant to give leggo stuff
renown was never meant for gear

overall nothing has changed

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WHAT? having to run 10(!) mythic+ dungeons per week is not much required???

or you could run 3

[tmamass]

BC and Wrath were very raid or die, which is what I referring to

BC and Wrath wasnt raiding or die - only WOD was and that was the worst xpac till today.

[Astator]

Since I'm mostly PvP player, I'd love it if it was just this to do every week.

What I would like to do when I log in to WoW? Play arena with my teammates, go do some battlegrounds, duel with friends, do some occasional world PvP. M+ and raids when I'm in the mood. In BFA I had to do A LOT of things, a lot of things that I didn't want to do. There were so many things to do to stay competitive that I didn't had time to do the things that I would like to do. There are actually so many things I'd like to do in this game that I don't have time to do, because I have to do my WoW chores.

I'd like to have more time for transmog runs, for playing my alts, I'd like to try pet battles more than once a year. Hell, maybe I'd even have time to actually raid again because I would do arenas instead of all those dailies and than I would have time to join my guild in raids more often.

Looking forward to less chores and more fun in a video game.

This is pretty accurate.

[tmamass]

The weekly Mythic+ cache still gives Mythic Raid iLvl loot, and thanks to the choice system, getting a (near) full loadout of really good item level pieces shouldn't be an issue at all.

except if you dont wanna do 10 mythic+ per week and get the same loot 2 or more weeks in a row....

[Toybox]

except if you dont wanna do 10 mythic+ per week and get the same loot 2 or more weeks in a row....

If you don't want to do M+ then what does the item level of M+ cache loot matter anyway?

[Guidance]

it's probably the result of half the community wanting to be like WoD (where you only log in to raid or do arena)
and the other half wanting to continue with the item grid, but not the AP

and blizzard was unable to decide

[Redroniksre]

I am a bit conflicted on the change, because it partially suits what i wanted it to look like at the end. In my opinion, large group, small group and solo should all have the same end point (mythic ilvl) but should take longer to reach the less "difficult" the content. Mythic raiding should be the fastest way to get to the end, followed by M+, then solo. Seems like this change aims to slow down how long it takes to finish with M+, though SL still lacks any solo progression meaning i foresee a lot of people quitting a month or two in when they can no longer progress.

[Feral Druid ist Op]

honest question, please let's discuss this without hate.

from what i have heard and seen on the beta only renown (~1h/week) and Torghast (also ~1h per week) offer Character progression.

In addition to that we just learned that m+ gear will be before heroic raid gear.

this means that if you raid mythic, your are done with all your weekly stuff in 2-3h (depending if you choose to do 1 m+ for the cache).

ofc you could also do more m+ for more item selection, but this is very, very inefficient. still posdible tho.

i understand many people like this, because they are free to do other things ingame now. my personal problem here is, that I am actually only really interested in things that offer Character progression and those are now heavily timegated.

do i miss something? is there really nothing to do at max level besides the things I listed? would be a shame if this becomes a raidlogging expansion.

do we ignore the 12 keys you have to spam for the valut which is still mythic ilvl? and that dungeon loot can still be better cuz of stats/trinkets that the raid dont offer?

[Krimzin]

So Alterac Valley should give the best rewards because there's 40 man required going by your logic. It doesn't matter how hard it is, Mythic raiding is easier because it's 20 man instead of 40, right? I mean, you disregarded any difficulty in PvP and M+ because they have smaller groups, so I'm just applying your logic here.

Will you sign my petiton to Blizzard to make Alterac Valley reward gear equal to last two bosses of mythic tier raid?

No skill required for Alterac.

Half the raid can AFK and still win.
Mythic Raids even 1 person makes a mistake and it can wipe the raid.
So ya.. just a bit different.

[Lavey]

It's like Blizzard learns nothing, ever. It's actually kind of impressive. So for me as a Mythic raider what this means is that I'll login for my weekly raid, logout, and not touch WoW until the following week. How amazingly boring. I was already not very excited for SL and this just puts the interest meter somewhere around 0. They went from a fuckton of optional content that had the potential to be rewarding in Legion to "lol raid log, nothing else is worth it." in SL. Absolutely massive step backwards.

They created an alternative to raiding in M+ and it was actually quite good and now they're crippling it.

That right there as someone who lives a heavily structured and scheduled life (140/168hrs account a week with, sleep, work, gym, casual dating), loves the idea of appointment gaming returning to WoW. I can get on, do my thing, say hi to my friends, and get back to normal life.