Mythic Raiding in SL = all other content not relevant?

[Zyky]

How is this ruining M+ runs?

Yes 3 ilvl means more in SL than in BFA but it's a really small difference non the less so that's not really something to worry about. You will still prefer items with better secondary stats.

You still get your mythic ilvl item at the end of the week.

And please remember you cannot farm raids like you can M+.

Not to mention they're just now starting to put finishing touches on gear. Who's to say that M+ gear isn't going to get some sort of bonus when running M+, like how they just this week made it so vers is more powerful in PvP content.

[LDancer]

Why does this thread sound like another entitled M+ runner trying to reignite the debate?

I raid and clear in a week, and if the RNG gods like me I might see 1 or 2 drops based on my history of shitty luck. But they expect to be able to run continuously and get to mythic level in gear in a night?

I welcome this change as it’s gonna free up a lot of my time outside of raid nights.

I hope blizz put in some scaling on M+ gear that it scales up based on the M+ level the item was gained at, when doing M+ content, but when in other content, like world or raid, it all normalises out to be the same as everyone else. They get their perk in their chosen content, but don’t end up with stupid levels of power

[Siraeyou]

So the end of dungeon rewards are nerfed, true, but the weekly cache rewards for clearing said content are still on par with Mythic raiding unless I am remembering it different, and those are guaranteed loot drops backloaded to the weekly cache. So overall you should still get access to the same ilvl gear as the mythic raiders just theoretically at a slower pace.

[Sevarin]

Holy bullshit math, Batman.

1.) People can still trade gear
2.) The design intention of M+ is shifting from gearing to giving you options in your Weekly box

holy bullshit taking that math seriously, batman. good lord, some people.

[razorpax]

Nothing of value was lost

[Baconeggcheese]

So the end of dungeon rewards are nerfed, true, but the weekly cache rewards for clearing said content are still on par with Mythic raiding unless I am remembering it different, and those are guaranteed loot drops backloaded to the weekly cache. So overall you should still get access to the same ilvl gear as the mythic raiders just theoretically at a slower pace.

Its actually faster, because instead of it being 1 random piece now its 1 random piece out of a pool of up to 9 choices that also won't have duplicates.

Even if you're only getting the 3 choices cause you're a M+ purist you'll still be able to gear out quicker because you'll get options and you can choose to fill this slot instead of getting your 5th cloak in a row.

There's a large section of the player base that gears pretty much exclusively from the weekly chest because its so easy to cap out gear outside of it. These changes will mildly slow them down before the chest, but the chest will make them mythic geared faster. Which frankly is a problem.

[razorpax]

You still need like 14 weeks worth of chests assuming you never get items for a slot you already have, which you will ... so with 1 choice a week, it's very likely you wont fill all the slots during a patch

3.5 months to get a full set of mythic ilvl gear???

And if watcher wasn’t talking out his ass that means you can also farm specific dungeons to get certain drops in the vault

If you are upset over this then I guess I am just too dumb because it makes no sense to me

Being able to gear up in a few months is great I’d think since ppl here bitch about “gears not exciting so I’ll hit BiS in a week and stop playing”

[Accendor]

Dear wow M+ players,

It seems that Blizzard is going to ruin our M+ runs. Please read the following:
- Max iLvl you can get from M+15 is 210 - compared to 213/220 iLvl you can get from Heroic Raid and 226/233 from Mythic Raid.
- The M+ final dungeon loot chest will consist in only 1 item drop.

Take into consideration that 3 ilvl difference will be more significant than 3 ilvl difference in BFA.

I think this is going to turnaround many players which simply do not have enough time to stick for long raids.

All the credit for the details mentioned above go for Quazii (youtube - FORCED to Raid in Shadowlands?! ★ Mythic+ iLvL Gear NERFED).

What do you think?

Yes, it means there is no reason to run m+ anymore besides 1x week for the weekly chest if you raid heroic. Since you already get the selection upgrade from the raid chest the value of running more than 1m+ is virtually non-existant.

[arr0gance]

holy bullshit taking that math seriously, batman. good lord, some people.

hehex xD

--- snip ---

[Whiskeyjac]

3.5 months to get a full set of mythic ilvl gear???

And if watcher wasn’t talking out his ass that means you can also farm specific dungeons to get certain drops in the vault

If you are upset over this then I guess I am just too dumb because it makes no sense to me

Being able to gear up in a few months is great I’d think since ppl here bitch about “gears not exciting so I’ll hit BiS in a week and stop playing”

Isn't that the same as now then?

Mythic+ never gave mythic raid gear.

[razorpax]

Isn't that the same as now then?

Mythic+ never gave mythic raid gear.

Nope it’s better

You get choice
You get mythic gear once a week
You get fewer raiders spamming m+
You get a targeted weekly chest...kinda

[Zephire]

People like you are minority. Despite people like doing mythic raid if you remove gear desire to that content would drop dramaticaly. Its whole packcage what makes people do mythic raiding and more you take away from that packcage more people will quit.

Yeah, I figured as much :/ Maybe m+ rewards could scale with how far in mythic raid you've managed? Would increase boosting potential but would be like a soft attunement for good loot in m+, and I mean that you'd get that loot from pretty high m+ level. Then people would have to raid to get loot from m+. And they would complain.... There just isn't a good middleway I guess.

[Mystikal]

If you're only doing a single +15 because it's the start of the season, then your single Cache item is almost guaranteed to be an upgrade along with the end of Dungeon loot... however, while a "M+ only" player might only clear a single +15, they will no doubt be running enough dungeons for more Vault options, just not at a +15 level.

Right, but that in itself is actually a problem - no-one is going to take the lower ilvl option, because that's just dumb. So, unless you're running at least 15 or so M+ each reset, then there's no added value to running more than 1 per week, given the vastly reduced drop rates.

[Gorsameth]

Right, but that in itself is actually a problem - no-one is going to take the lower ilvl option, because that's just dumb. So, unless you're running at least 15 or so M+ each reset, then there's no added value to running more than 1 per week, given the vastly reduced drop rates.

a lower ilvl option that is an upgrade is better then a higher ilvl that you already have.

[Mystikal]

With that alone, you will be full ilvl 226 in the first 90 days. So tell me again how that is TOO SLOW.

Even if all you are doing are Mythics, no PvP and no raiding you will still have 3 items to choose from each week. I think adding 3 more possible loot chances in the weekly chest will make a lot of folks who may not be raiders, into raiders.

We shall see.

Please explain your maths, because the last time I checked, most classes have 16 slots to fill. 16 weeks = 4 months = 120 days, not 90. And that is only once you're in a position to actually clear +15 keys, so you need to add, conservatively, another 4-8 weeks to that, for a total of ~6 months. Given that most patches don't last that long, a player who cannot raid can never realistically be 'done' with the game, whereas raiders can be. That feels very, very punishing.

- - - Updated - - -

a lower ilvl option that is an upgrade is better then a higher ilvl that you already have.

Well, hold on a second here. I was told repeatedly in another thread that duplicates won't happen, and that Blizzard said that themselves. So your highest option should always be for an 'unfinished' slot. Someone, somewhere, is lying.

Even if you take the lower ilvl, that slot is not 'completed'.

[Nite92]

honest question, please let's discuss this without hate.

from what i have heard and seen on the beta only renown (~1h/week) and Torghast (also ~1h per week) offer Character progression.

In addition to that we just learned that m+ gear will be before heroic raid gear.

this means that if you raid mythic, your are done with all your weekly stuff in 2-3h (depending if you choose to do 1 m+ for the cache).

ofc you could also do more m+ for more item selection, but this is very, very inefficient. still posdible tho.

i understand many people like this, because they are free to do other things ingame now. my personal problem here is, that I am actually only really interested in things that offer Character progression and those are now heavily timegated.

do i miss something? is there really nothing to do at max level besides the things I listed? would be a shame if this becomes a raidlogging expansion.

I am not sure what you mean exactly. I guess that 6-12hrs are the "usual" amount of raiding hours per week for mythic raiding. If you have to do 2-3 hrs of open world grinds (torghast + renown + daily emisarries) and 3-4 hrs to achieve the maximum m+ reward you are already playing up to almost 20hrs, just for power progression. Is it that bad that there are things besides power progression on your main character to do? Additionally +15s wont be on farm that easily even for mythic raiders.

[Stardrift]

Suck it up. BFA was M+ or die. For the entire expansion, BIS for just about every class and spec was the same old trash from M+.

I don't understand the fun in running the same dungeons over the length of en entire expansion for the same old gear that does all the same old shit. I can't even be bothered to farm M+ beyond doing a +15 once a week. I just don't get it.

The community following Mythic dungeons is just abysmal. Some of the worst players I've ever seen. I guess that's the only plus side to M+. Keeps the bads away from everything else, as they're too busy farming Mythic dungeons for free easy loot from LFR difficulty dungeons.

It's about time you guys get the appropriate item level for your skill level.

[Gorsameth]

Please explain your maths, because the last time I checked, most classes have 16 slots to fill. 16 weeks = 4 months = 120 days, not 90. And that is only once you're in a position to actually clear +15 keys, so you need to add, conservatively, another 4-8 weeks to that, for a total of ~6 months. Given that most patches don't last that long, a player who cannot raid can never realistically be 'done' with the game, whereas raiders can be. That feels very, very punishing.

- - - Updated - - -



Well, hold on a second here. I was told repeatedly in another thread that duplicates won't happen, and that Blizzard said that themselves. So your highest option should always be for an 'unfinished' slot. Someone, somewhere, is lying.

Even if you take the lower ilvl, that slot is not 'completed'.

what?
You don't get 2x the same item as a choice in the same weekly chest but I don't think anyone has ever said that if you have 226 ilvl boots from dungon boss X you can never see boots from boss Y.

[Nite92]

Yeah, I figured as much :/ Maybe m+ rewards could scale with how far in mythic raid you've managed? Would increase boosting potential but would be like a soft attunement for good loot in m+, and I mean that you'd get that loot from pretty high m+ level. Then people would have to raid to get loot from m+. And they would complain.... There just isn't a good middleway I guess.

You do understand that m+ gearing is better in SL than it was in BFA? Having higher ilvl from a spamable source than hc raid loot is stupid, because it invalidates the hc ra id. And afaik the vault still offers mythic ivl quality loot only that you get 3 options now instead of 1. The only issue here is, that you cannot any longer farm hc equivalent ilvl for each slot so that you can trade all hc loot that drops.

[Aggrophobic]

Why does this thread sound like another entitled M+ runner trying to reignite the debate?

I raid and clear in a week, and if the RNG gods like me I might see 1 or 2 drops based on my history of shitty luck. But they expect to be able to run continuously and get to mythic level in gear in a night?

I welcome this change as it’s gonna free up a lot of my time outside of raid nights.

I hope blizz put in some scaling on M+ gear that it scales up based on the M+ level the item was gained at, when doing M+ content, but when in other content, like world or raid, it all normalises out to be the same as everyone else. They get their perk in their chosen content, but don’t end up with stupid levels of power

It's good for you if you only want to raid but it's bad for litteraly everyone else.
M+ was a popular part of WoW, much more so than any raid outside of LFR. It's rather stupid to kill off that part of the game for no real reason.

It's pretty clear at this point that all competent devs have left Blizzard and the ones that are left do not even play their own games.