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  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    Hahaha, oh wait your serious? Let me laugh even more.

    Please show me any prove how picking a different convenant increases your dps by 50%.
    Like i said,its not just the covenant pick,its the soulbind and conduits also,the best vs the worst combinations of over 50%,how is this so crazy to imagine?legion was the same power differences with legenderies

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    Hahaha, oh wait your serious? Let me laugh even more.

    Please show me any prove how picking a different convenant increases your dps by 50%.
    I do high rated arena as ele shaman. Let's say i pick kyrian, i get a totem that gets killed with 1 spell so the value i get from it is virtually ZERO in arena.
    Now i pick necrolord and i can primordial + echo shock lavaburst every1 that has flame shock+ascendance lava burst and it does massive damage. That isn't a 50% increase , it's going from zero value to 2 shotting an entire team.

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by mysticx View Post
    Oh, it's a balancing omnishambles, no argument there, but making covenants freely swappable blows the whole storyline surrounding them out of the water, and also opens the way for threads like "OMG! I have to grind up all four covenants! Grind city WTF Blizz?" (Once it becomes swappable, people will want *all* the options), making covenants swappable doesn't fix things, it just opens up the floodgates for the next pile of covenant-related complaints.

    Covenants are from a lore standpoint cool and interesting (They add some variety to playing alts), but technically they're a nightmare, the skills and conduits are too different to balance well, and i'm genuinely curious what Blizz plan to do about this mess next.
    What part of the storyline does it blow out of the water? I mean we're helping all of them while leveling and doing world quests/whatever the new emissary equivalent thing is called. We'll be helping all of them throughout the expansion as we work together against the jailer, there's not some kind of covenant war going on. I haven't seen anything even showing hostility between them. What is the story and RP part of choosing one?

  4. #124
    Elemental Lord Kithelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggrophobic View Post
    2 weeks is not fast.
    If I want to PvP I don't want to wait 2 bloody weeks.

    What are you on about? It's a stupid system however you "white-knight" it.
    Ironic players complaining there is no RPG left in the game....well here is why! The players complain about actual RPG systems being in game.
    #WithoutRespectWeReject

  5. #125
    Immortal Nnyco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    Like i said,its not just the covenant pick,its the soulbind and conduits also,the best vs the worst combinations of over 50%,how is this so crazy to imagine?legion was the same power differences with legenderies
    Source: trust me bro
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Crabs have been removed from the game... because if I see another one I’m just going to totally lose it. *sobbing* I’m sorry, I just can’t right now... I just... OK just give me a minute, I’ll be OK..

  6. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by Justank View Post
    What part of the storyline does it blow out of the water? I mean we're helping all of them while leveling and doing world quests/whatever the new emissary equivalent thing is called. We'll be helping all of them throughout the expansion as we work together against the jailer, there's not some kind of covenant war going on. I haven't seen anything even showing hostility between them. What is the story and RP part of choosing one?
    The covenant storylines, hopping from one to the other as gameplay requirements demands would play merry hell with story flow in them (Imagine hopping around between class campaigns during Legion), but i suppose that’s only a concern for people interested in story detail.

  7. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Artale View Post
    The 'easy choice' statement was about if you only pvp it's an easy choice: you pick the best covenant for pvp without caring about what's best for Raids/M+.
    For many classes, there is no best Covenant for PvP, thats the point. You might want 2-3 of the abilities to alternate between depending on your comp and what you are fighting. The impact of these Abilities + Conduits can easily decide a game before its begun. The system is absolute rubbish for PvP.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kithelle View Post
    Ironic players complaining there is no RPG left in the game....well here is why! The players complain about actual RPG systems being in game.
    RPG Systems are awesome as long as they are not in conflict with the MMO portion of the game. Power tied to semi permanent choices is very much at odds with the MMO aspect of the game. This is not a single player game is what im saying.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by LolFrank View Post
    I really love how people are so deadset on this mindset of "I have to be this for that or that for this." It's comical and I know our Blizzard overlords are laughing at us being overdramatic. Instead of just accepting the pro/con of being one covenant and saying "I'm an X covenant class", we've let our YouTube influencers influence us. Now we feel entitled to be ANY covenant when YOU KNOW 90% of the mmo-c community are gray parsers hahaha.
    If you are truly serious about this post, then I am confident you haven't been able to comprehend the implications and consequences of this system. Doesn't take much to see the glaring problems for yourself. Youtubers and "Influencers" are just there to make the issues heard. I doubt anything will be enough to convince you though.

  8. #128
    Legendary! TEHPALLYTANK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zypherz View Post
    Do people really want covenant switching to be instant? You really want to feel the need to HS out of a raid and change covenant after every boss to be optimal?

    I think this is fine, better than I'd hoped. Weekly is enough.
    Some people want it to be instant with no cooldown, I doubt that more than 1-4% of the playerbase wants that much freedom; I think plenty would be satisfied if it were instant to switch with a 45-120 minute cooldown between switching. It would prevent swapping for every boss, but it would still let players raid, do M+, and do rated PvP on the same character on the same day without being severely impaired in one type of content. I can't see Covenants being balanced enough to bring a sub-optimal Covenant into the top PvE content or high-end PvP.

    There are plenty of ranges of time between 2 weeks and instant with no cooldown, I don't think pretending it has to be one or the other is a very reasonable position to take.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbamboozal View Post
    Intelligence is like four wheel drive, it's not going to make you unstoppable, it just sort of tends to get you stuck in more remote places.
    Quote Originally Posted by MerinPally View Post
    If you want to be disgusted, next time you kiss someone remember you've got your mouth on the end of a tube which has shit at the other end, held back by a couple of valves.

  9. #129
    Field Marshal Artale's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TEHPALLYTANK View Post
    Some people want it to be instant with no cooldown, I doubt that more than 1-4% of the playerbase wants that much freedom; I think plenty would be satisfied if it were instant to switch with a 45-120 minute cooldown between switching. It would prevent swapping for every boss, but it would still let players raid, do M+, and do rated PvP on the same character on the same day without being severely impaired in one type of content. I can't see Covenants being balanced enough to bring a sub-optimal Covenant into the top PvE content or high-end PvP.

    There are plenty of ranges of time between 2 weeks and instant with no cooldown, I don't think pretending it has to be one or the other is a very reasonable position to take.
    Make it a daily cooldown then. Resets when dailies do (obviously). Locks you into one (or at most 2 if you really want to be like that) covenant for dailies and still allows you to grind up a different covenant once you're done with one and swap back to your main covenant for raid night, pvp or whatever.

  10. #130
    Legendary! TEHPALLYTANK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artale View Post
    Make it a daily cooldown then. Resets when dailies do (obviously). Locks you into one (or at most 2 if you really want to be like that) covenant for dailies and still allows you to grind up a different covenant once you're done with one and swap back to your main covenant for raid night, pvp or whatever.
    I considered that, but that time frame feels a bit too long, and it doesn't allow you to later change your mind during the day. Hence why I suggested a smaller time-frame, long enough to prevent it from being an issue for raiding but short enough to allow you to change your mind more than once. It would be like having 4 meal options per day, but you're only allowed to eat two types. So you pick A for breakfast, then switch to C for lunch and have to stick with C for dinner. After lunch you find yourself wanting A again, or maybe option B or D, but you're stuck with C because you can't change it again.

    It would work out fine for some people, and it would definitely be an improvement over the current iteration, but still has the potential to create a wide variety of scenarios that can drain the fun out of the game. Alternatively a daily allowance system combined with a cooldown between swaps (say 3 or 4 Covenant changes per day, with a 60-90 minute cooldown on each swap) seems like a viable compromise as well.

    Sadly I don't have any hope for Blizzard even attempting to compromise with "their vision" until at least 8 months into the expansion.
    Last edited by TEHPALLYTANK; 2020-09-18 at 08:05 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbamboozal View Post
    Intelligence is like four wheel drive, it's not going to make you unstoppable, it just sort of tends to get you stuck in more remote places.
    Quote Originally Posted by MerinPally View Post
    If you want to be disgusted, next time you kiss someone remember you've got your mouth on the end of a tube which has shit at the other end, held back by a couple of valves.

  11. #131
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    Source: trust me bro
    you are free to test it for yourself,its not some crazy secret...and again,it happened in legion it happened in bfa,people being 50%+ stronger than others,in legion it was based in rng,in SL its based on your pick...but with a 2 week cd

  12. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    its aactualy over 50% damage increase based on what you pick
    No covenant is 50%. And if a covenant is so strong, why would you ever switch?

    And the way it looks you can play two covenants each week. Just play tuesday to sunday cov A, turn in your cov switch to B, play 2 days cov B while doing the cov change quest to A, wait for id reset, play a few days cov B and then switch to cov A for the rest of the id...
    Last edited by Aurosh; 2020-09-18 at 08:25 PM.

  13. #133
    It's good if you want to FOTM it and swap based around nerfs/buffs. It still sucks for those who want to swap between pulls or types of content, but Blizz has said from the beginning they don't want people doing that anyway.

  14. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by Amsden View Post
    It's good if you want to FOTM it and swap based around nerfs/buffs. It still sucks for those who want to swap between pulls or types of content, but Blizz has said from the beginning they don't want people doing that anyway.
    No, people are having fun in the wrong way again. Gotta nerf that.
    No fun allowed!

  15. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggrophobic View Post
    No, people are having fun in the wrong way again. Gotta nerf that.
    No fun allowed!
    Can't have fun the wrong way if that was never an option in the first place. Nothing to nerf.

    Btw thanks for the salt I was running out.

  16. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by Amsden View Post
    Can't have fun the wrong way if that was never an option in the first place. Nothing to nerf.

    Btw thanks for the salt I was running out.
    It's an option now and it's an option in Shadowlands. It's just hidden behind a time gated wall of bad design.

    Why you find it fun that the game gets ruined or by people being unhappy is beyond me but you might want to get professinal help for that.
    It's unhealthy and it'll hold you back in life.

  17. #137
    Covenants are shit system and should be removed from the game.

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggrophobic View Post
    It's an option now and it's an option in Shadowlands. It's just hidden behind a time gated wall of bad design.
    Yeah it's an option, if you want to maintain 4 mains, you have fun with that.

    Why you find it fun that the game gets ruined or by people being unhappy is beyond me but you might want to get professinal help for that.
    It's unhealthy and it'll hold you back in life.
    You're just making shit up now. Where did I say I wanted the game ruined?
    Last edited by Amsden; 2020-09-20 at 05:44 AM.

  19. #139
    Guys... There were days when you embrace your character and you didnt need to farm for unlocking new class spells & abilities once you hit maximum level. You were just playing to get gear and therefore you had to play lots of dungeons and raids which were fun...
    Dear blizzard : stop forcing people to farm covenants, artifacts or essences to get class abilities or spells... This is a MMORPG, let people love and enjoy their class when they hit last level. Let the game be played for dungeons and raids or farming for only item things not spells. If you dont stop making classes league of legends-like then the game wont have the next expansion

  20. #140
    The Patient
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    People here are actually mad because they can't be optimal in all types of content at all times in an rpg.

    And these people honestly need to leave and play something else, like any other of the hundred games where you pick your character and full load out before you start a match.

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