Is Blizzard exploitative?

[Ashleyxoxo]

One of the things that Blizzard didn't do that other MMOs did was reveal its sub numbers. That was really transparent. Unfortunately, they stopped doing that. That is bad ethical practice.

However, I also noted that other MMOs make you convert real money into in-game currency (e.g., Crowns in TESO). That is the only way to buy things from their in-game shop. (For example, TESO sells costumes for "crowns", whereas Blizzard just charges real money for their services). That way, other MMOs keep you from really knowing how much real money you're spending on things, only the amount of in-game currency. You could say that Blizzard doesn't do that because WoW is old and the practice is new, but even in Hearthstone they do this more than other CCGs. For example, Shadowverse charges 100 "crystals" for a card pack, whereas Blizzard charges real money. That way, you know exactly how much money you're spending. This is transparent, and they haven't stopped doing it.

So. Is Blizzard still the "good" company we fell in love with?

[omeomorfismo]

One of the things that Blizzard didn't do that other MMOs did was reveal its sub numbers. That was really transparent. Unfortunately, they stopped doing that. That is bad ethical practice.

However, I also noted that other MMOs make you convert real money into in-game currency (e.g., Crowns in TESO). That is the only way to buy things from their in-game shop. (For example, TESO sells costumes for "crowns", whereas Blizzard just charges real money for their services). That way, other MMOs keep you from really knowing how much real money you're spending on things, only the amount of in-game currency. You could say that Blizzard doesn't do that because WoW is old and the practice is new, but even in Hearthstone they do this more than other CCGs. For example, Shadowverse charges 100 "crystals" for a card pack, whereas Blizzard charges real money. That way, you know exactly how much money you're spending. This is transparent, and they haven't stopped doing it.

So. Is Blizzard still the "good" company we fell in love with?

whats the "ethic" behind knowing the number of subscriber?

[Aliven]

One of the things that Blizzard didn't do that other MMOs did was reveal its sub numbers. That was really transparent. Unfortunately, they stopped doing that. That is bad ethical practice.

However, I also noted that other MMOs make you convert real money into in-game currency (e.g., Crowns in TESO). That is the only way to buy things from their in-game shop. (For example, TESO sells costumes for "crowns", whereas Blizzard just charges real money for their services). That way, other MMOs keep you from really knowing how much real money you're spending on things, only the amount of in-game currency. You could say that Blizzard doesn't do that because WoW is old and the practice is new, but even in Hearthstone they do this more than other CCGs. For example, Shadowverse charges 100 "crystals" for a card pack, whereas Blizzard charges real money. That way, you know exactly how much money you're spending. This is transparent, and they haven't stopped doing it.

So. Is Blizzard still the "good" company we fell in love with?

They created Overwatch and defend those microtransactions so no.

[Hinastorm]

Your entire second paragraph is you arguing against them being exploitive.

I'm kinda confused if you're *actually* asking if they are exploitive, or trying to claim that they are?

I'll add that the way they are pricing the way that they do isn't because "they are new at it". They know what they're doing, and if they wanted to be truly exploitative, they could, and know how to do so.

[Synical123]

One of the things that Blizzard didn't do that other MMOs did was reveal its sub numbers. That was really transparent. Unfortunately, they stopped doing that. That is bad ethical practice.

However, I also noted that other MMOs make you convert real money into in-game currency (e.g., Crowns in TESO). That is the only way to buy things from their in-game shop. (For example, TESO sells costumes for "crowns", whereas Blizzard just charges real money for their services). That way, other MMOs keep you from really knowing how much real money you're spending on things, only the amount of in-game currency. You could say that Blizzard doesn't do that because WoW is old and the practice is new, but even in Hearthstone they do this more than other CCGs. For example, Shadowverse charges 100 "crystals" for a card pack, whereas Blizzard charges real money. That way, you know exactly how much money you're spending. This is transparent, and they haven't stopped doing it.

So. Is Blizzard still the "good" company we fell in love with?

None of the things you mentioned are related to being exploitative. They aren't required to tell you how many people are playing. The tokens thing is also an odd thing to bring up. They aren't doing this so you can 'see how much money you have spent' you can do this with or without the in game currency. Blizzard's 'in game currency' is their bnet balance. You use this to purchase things across all their games or just purchase different items in the game while also allowing you to make some off of wow tokens.

Exploitative behavior is doing things like releasing game that are unfinished at a top price, loot boxes/lottery systems, and beyond that it's just subjective opinions. I personally believe pay to play games like clash of clans where you have to literally pay money in order to further your campaign as being exploitative but I'm sure some others don't.

[Knight Meta]

They created Overwatch and defend those microtransactions so no.

I'm finally early in a thread and spotted someone like yourself. Let's go!

So I need to ask, why the heck is the "Microtransaction" part of Overwatch considered bad? It is legit 0 pay to win. There just isn't any. Any argument along the lines of "Well, if you get that one skin for Reinhardt, his Mace turns into an axe so you get a bit more field of view" is rendered mute upon launch as it's not in anyway a element that "wins" you a game.

Now look to other games that legit has in-game advantages earned from the same microtransaction system; Why does OW need to be rung out as bad guys when they legit have zero P2W with their loot boxes?

If the argument is that "loot boxes bad" then OW is still golden as it dishes out so much currency and cosmetics to you just for "existing" in the game that it's borderline stupid.

[rayvio]

I think their (currently on strike) workers in France feel exploited

[Dread Pirate Phayde]

If you know how many crowns or whatever $20 turns into, you still can figure out what things cost, unless you are irresponsible and spending blindly.

Money is still being spent by being turned into in game currency, so if that isn't exploitive than neither is Blizzard charging real world money OR in game currency for services.

[Aliven]

I'm finally early in a thread and spotted someone like yourself. Let's go!

So I need to ask, why the heck is the "Microtransaction" part of Overwatch considered bad? It is legit 0 pay to win. There just isn't any. Any argument along the lines of "Well, if you get that one skin for Reinhardt, his Mace turns into an axe so you get a bit more field of view" is rendered mute upon launch as it's not in anyway a element that "wins" you a game.

Now look to other games that legit has in-game advantages earned from the same microtransaction system; Why does OW need to be rung out as bad guys when they legit have zero P2W with their loot boxes?

If the argument is that "loot boxes bad" then OW is still golden as it dishes out so much currency and cosmetics to you just for "existing" in the game that it's borderline stupid.

Because lootboxes are exploitative by nature.
And they have no place in full priced triple A games.

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If you know how many crowns or whatever $20 turns into, you still can figure out what things cost, unless you are irresponsible and spending blindly.

Money is still being spent by being turned into in game currency, so if that isn't exploitive than neither is Blizzard charging real world money OR in game currency for services.

You also ALWAYS have leftover and can pay custom amount for in game currency. So it feels shitty and is shitty.
Paying fixed price in dollars/euros/whatever without another form of a currency is better.

Can we stop blaming players? Those system are in place because they work. Not in a way "eh, maybe some idiot will fall for it" but rather "this is fucking money printer".

[pepine]

Sub numbers irrelevant. Their recent games as of late have been hella exploitative due to lootbox mechanics such as HS and Overwatch as well as them bringing Diablo RNG like mechanics into WoW. However that's only part of the mess right now.

The way they treat their employees/morals/ethics? Absolutely. Fuck them for what they've just done during a global fucking pandemic and what they did with firing 800 people. That's where their exploitative attitude lies.

A lot of people uprooted their lives to go work in Versailles because they believed Blizzard was an amazing company from their days of playing games like WC3, Diablo 2 and Brood War. Imagine getting a job at the company you love only to be told 10-15 years later to "fuck off"?

Fuck them for what they did. I have friends and family who uprooted their lives who grew up on the classic Blizz games and they contacted me a few days ago saying it was chaos over there and there are angry people/people in absolute tears right now due to the situation.

[Jester Joe]

Because lootboxes are exploitative by nature.
And they have no place in full priced triple A games.

Overwatch isn't full price on the PC.

The only reason it was $60 on consoles was because it came with the extra stuff to begin with, otherwise it would have been $40 there too.

[loras]

One of the things that Blizzard didn't do that other MMOs did was reveal its sub numbers. That was really transparent. Unfortunately, they stopped doing that. That is bad ethical practice.

However, I also noted that other MMOs make you convert real money into in-game currency (e.g., Crowns in TESO). That is the only way to buy things from their in-game shop. (For example, TESO sells costumes for "crowns", whereas Blizzard just charges real money for their services). That way, other MMOs keep you from really knowing how much real money you're spending on things, only the amount of in-game currency. You could say that Blizzard doesn't do that because WoW is old and the practice is new, but even in Hearthstone they do this more than other CCGs. For example, Shadowverse charges 100 "crystals" for a card pack, whereas Blizzard charges real money. That way, you know exactly how much money you're spending. This is transparent, and they haven't stopped doing it.

So. Is Blizzard still the "good" company we fell in love with?

Relatively speaking, yes.

[Super Kami Dende]

I've never understood the requirement of seeing Subscription numbers. As if you are enjoying the game why does it matter.

On top of that, many MMO's don't disclose playerbase numbers, as the negative attention from naysayers to any population drop can be pointlessly damaging.

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Because lootboxes are exploitative by nature.

"exploitative" only to idiots and addicts though.

[Kumorii]

Because lootboxes are exploitative by nature.
And they have no place in full priced triple A games.

Those lootboxes are funding new maps and heroes which are free.

[LordTakeo]

They created Overwatch and defend those microtransactions so no.

To be fair, Overwatch is cosmetic only, and I can live with that.
Unless they changed that?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I think their (currently on strike) workers in France feel exploited

By getting advance notice that things out blizzard control caused them to change plans and not be able to move every one they originally wanted?

[pepine]

By getting advance notice that things out blizzard control caused them to change plans and not be able to move every one they originally wanted?

Yikes. Imagine defending shit like that where workers who probably dreamed of working for a company and have done for 15 years get the boot.....

Get some perspective my guy.

[Arikara]

I wouldn't call them exploitative, but they're definitely manipulative. More importantly, they've lost sight of their core values

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Sub numbers irrelevant. Their recent games as of late have been hella exploitative due to lootbox mechanics such as HS and Overwatch as well as them bringing Diablo RNG like mechanics into WoW. However that's only part of the mess right now.

The way they treat their employees/morals/ethics? Absolutely. Fuck them for what they've just done during a global fucking pandemic and what they did with firing 800 people. That's where their exploitative attitude lies.

A lot of people uprooted their lives to go work in Versailles because they believed Blizzard was an amazing company from their days of playing games like WC3, Diablo 2 and Brood War. Imagine getting a job at the company you love only to be told 10-15 years later to "fuck off"?

Fuck them for what they did. I have friends and family who uprooted their lives who grew up on the classic Blizz games and they contacted me a few days ago saying it was chaos over there and there are angry people/people in absolute tears right now due to the situation.

While being laid off is always hard doing it the way blizzard has isn’t exploitative in any way. This isn’t like telltale where they just went dark with no notice blizzard had a plan to keep as many as they could and things out of there control changed those plans and they kept the workers informed from the sounds of it.

[Thelxi]

There actually is a buyable currency in WoW: gold. With gold you can buy anything you want with Blizzard blessing: rating, gear or whatever else; your credit card is the limit.

With Legion, Blizzard made a very hard push to catch up on the monetization schemes that other MMOs have been utilizing for ever, overhauling their business model which directly impacted and overhauled pretty much all reward structures in the game itself.

At this point, there is absolutely nothing that gives Blizzard the edge over other developers. Blizzard used to be able to say with a straight face that they were dedicated to the quality of their games, but even that doesn't land anymore with but the dumbest of sheep and whales.