DPS is down 50% since 9.0.1 !

[FelPlague]

I didn't - finally gave up on TD, IS and tendrils and went for stats.

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Aim what ... the thing never proc'ed.

then that is you fault, cause it procced all the time.

[Qnubi]

I'd prefer to not be weaker at the end of the expansion than I was at the start ... doing the same content.

The end of the expansion was 8.3, 9.x is already next expansion. Not trying to be a smart-ass but come on, it's been what now, 15 years? You are around long enough to know, that the pre-patch is already part of the expansion. It literally changed the number from 8 (BFA) to 9 (SL)...

[FelPlague]

I can't tell if this is a joke or not, but whether this specific event happened in any previous prepatch is entirely irrelevant. The problem is that it feels awful because we have lost relative power, not because stats and levels have been squished. Previous squishes did not feel this bad because relative power was sort-of maintained, whereas now a players ability to actually do content is substantially slower.

cause we had both a squish, and a removal of corruptions, if only the squish hapened it wold be no where near as bad, but players are getting used to BOTH things being gone.

[schwarzkopf]

This isnt really the "end" of BfA though.

Let's put it in simple terms - before the patch I could splat a BfA elite 1-2M mob in 20 seconds or so no CDs, no corruptions, after the patch - I can't get him down under 50% at all with all CDS before I die.

I'm not talking about feeling a little weaker like we do every pre patch ... I'm talking about a massive change in power.

[crusadernero]

Ok 50% is just a random number i pulled.. but with the retarded AOE cap, and the stupid number squish, i'm noticing a severe decrease in dps. Example was HFC-M solo mount run, it's taking longer than before. My prev. ilvl was 469 and is now 119, if this matters.

Welcome to every pre patch since forever.

[Boiled-Lobster]

Let's put it in simple terms - before the patch I could splat a BfA elite 1-2M mob in 20 seconds or so no CDs, no corruptions, after the patch - I can't get him down under 50% at all with all CDS before I die.

I'm not talking about feeling a little weaker like we do every pre patch ... I'm talking about a massive change in power.

Which is exactly their design. Elites are and were never designed to be solo'ed by players.

The stupidity of borrowed power and overtuning mechanics like corruptions made this possible ever since late MoP.

Myself am glad the game is returning to the "this mob hits hard and requires atleast 2 people in order to be killed.

[ClassicPeon]

What are you talking about? Blizzard themsleves think the same. Thats why the expansion is delayed.

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Warriors actually do more damage at lvl 50 than at 60 with covenants and legendaries...

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Blizzard does not agree.

yeah thats obviously not true, just like pretty much everything else you say :P

Blizzard not agreeing with you is one of the few undeniable facts of this universe

[schwarzkopf]

Which is exactly their design. Elites are and were never designed to be solo'ed by players.

I think you missed the point ... probably intentionally... I could kill a mob in 20 seconds before patch, I could not kill it at all after patch.

What type of mob is irrelevant.

[Aggrophobic]

yeah thats obviously not true, just like pretty much everything else you say :P

Blizzard not agreeing with you is one of the few undeniable facts of this universe

Again, what are you talking about?

[FelPlague]

Warriors actually do more damage at lvl 50 than at 60 with covenants and legendaries...

idk if you know buty this was the exact same with legion to BFA.
its cause as we level that damage becomes weaker, because its based on mob level, so while yes at 50 you do more damage then at 60, if both tried to dps a level 60 mob, the 50 would do FAR less then a 60.

its why people were able to get low level DH's to spam farm freehold with exp turned off.

[ClassicPeon]

Again, what are you talking about?

the prepatch should not have come out now.

Blizzard themsleves think the same.

I'm quoting you here btw.

Its not good if you forget what you wrote so quickly

[klogaroth]

Despite the sat squish (which also happened) the players should feel as powerful as before according to the quoted statement. However testing with a world boss in 9.0 it seems it's not really true.

In patch 8.3 a world boss (which introduced in 8.0) was took about 2 min to kill, while in patch 9.0 it takes almost 8 minutes.

All in all it seems players became much more weaker than its intended.

That isn't the same boss. One of them is a boss intended for 5 people, the other is a boss intended for a raid group. Conveniently the one intended for 5 people was done in the "before prepatch" section and the one intended for a raid was done in the "after prepatch" section. Of course it was faster. It was always faster, it's an easier boss.

Videos that straight up aim to lie to you aside, there sort of wasn't a stat squish. In fact there was a stat inflation on gear available to a level 50. If our level is brought down to 50, our equipment isn't going to keep the same stat values as it did at level 120, otherwise we would have thousands of % of secondaries. The stats have to be brought down to level 50 appropriate. But if you compare ilvls and the amount of stats on gear, what we have now is actually better than level 50 gear before levels were adjusted. This is due to there being no tiers at 50 before, and 4 tiers (with multiple difficulties) at 50 now.

[deenman]

What are you talking about? Blizzard themsleves think the same. Thats why the expansion is delayed.

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Warriors actually do more damage at lvl 50 than at 60 with covenants and legendaries...

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Blizzard does not agree.

obviously thats not gonna go live lol,but i do remember when legion came out,enha shamans with archi trinket and artefact could almost 1 shot dungeon bosses,and i sure as hell couldnt do that at max anymore

[Nythiz]

In the MMO Champion's "BlizzCon 2019 - Developer Interview" Blizzard stated the following: "There will not be a stat squish. It's very important that players feel just as powerful when they log in to play the expansion."

You can read this here: LINK

Despite the sat squish (which also happened) the players should feel as powerful as before according to the quoted statement. However testing with a world boss in 9.0 it seems it's not really true.

In patch 8.3 a world boss (which introduced in 8.0) was took about 2 min to kill, while in patch 9.0 it takes almost 8 minutes.

All in all it seems players became much more weaker than its intended.

Haha this is the dumbest thing ever.

You're comparing two completely different bosses which before the patch also already had a major disparity in difficulty.
On top of that you do it with a fire mage, a spec that's arguably the most nerfed due to removal of corruption and SL changes.
Nice troll attempt

----

To be honest, I'm not noticing the huge negative swing as some portrait this out to be.

Maybe a minor step down, but that's mostly due to corruptions being removed.
I had a few alts that just dinged 120 only a few weeks back and had terrible corruptions and they are probably relatively stronger now than before the patch. (Granted 1 of them is a shadow priest which got some massive buffs).

On my hunter, BM feels a bit slower but that's mostly due to removal of corruptions. And even despite that we're still one of the stronger specs.
MM and SV on the other hand feel quite equal, maybe even better; with both of them mostly taking a bit of a hit in the rotational flow (due to focus regen changes and loss of haste corruptions).

Old Content (e.g. transmog runs) also seems to be quite equal or maybe even easier, so that doesn't seem to be impacted much either.

[Adi91]

That isn't the same boss. One of them is a boss intended for 5 people, the other is a boss intended for a raid group. Conveniently the one intended for 5 people was done in the "before prepatch" section and the one intended for a raid was done in the "after prepatch" section. Of course it was faster. It was always faster, it's an easier boss.

Videos that straight up aim to lie to you aside, there sort of wasn't a stat squish. In fact there was a stat inflation on gear available to a level 50. If our level is brought down to 50, our equipment isn't going to keep the same stat values as it did at level 120, otherwise we would have thousands of % of secondaries. The stats have to be brought down to level 50 appropriate. But if you compare ilvls and the amount of stats on gear, what we have now is actually better than level 50 gear before levels were adjusted. This is due to there being no tiers at 50 before, and 4 tiers (with multiple difficulties) at 50 now.

I hope some of the prepatch weeks will bring the same boss (Ji'arak) appear, and you can see the difference on the same boss. The 8.0 world bosses were easily soloable on 8.3 (any of them), and now you can see it isn't so trivial. During this week Azurethos is active so I can only show the difference with it. Unfortunatelly I haven't recorded any Azurethos kill before 9.0... But you can also see the DBM after the kill: It says the record on Azurethos is 30 sec, and this kill took 8 minutes. They are from the same tier (8.0) which means they are have almost the same power. All of the 8.0 world bosses designed for a raid group, not for 5 people. Ji'arak is a WORLD BOSS too, not a party-boss or an elite designed for 5 man groups, a World boss. Where did you get this from that Ji'arak is not a world boss and 5 man content??? Azurethos is also a world boss, from the same tier (they drop the same iLVL, they have similar hp and damage, etc.).

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Two different boss, but from the same tier...

[Nythiz]

I hope some of the prepatch weeks will bring the same boss (Ji'arak) appear, and you can see the difference on the same boss. The 8.0 world bosses were easily soloable on 8.3 (any of them), and now you can see it isn't so trivial. During this week Azurethos is active so I can only show the difference with it. Unfortunatelly I haven't recorded any Azurethos kill before 9.0... But you can also see the DBM after the kill: It says the record on Azurethos is 30 sec, and this kill took 8 minutes. They are from the same tier (8.0) which means they are have almost the same power. All of the 8.0 world bosses designed for a raid group, not for 5 people. Ji'arak is a WORLD BOSS too, not a party-boss or an elite designed for 5 man groups, a World boss. Where did you get this from that Ji'arak is not a world boss and 5 man content??? Azurethos is also a world boss, from the same tier (they drop the same iLVL, they have similar hp and damage, etc.).

- The world bosses are still easily soloable.

- The 30 sec kill was obviously in a raid enviroment, so that entire comparison is stupid.

- You're on a fire mage, which is one of the most nerfed specs due to removal of mastery corruption and general changes to fire itself
On Ji'arak you're bursting the boss to 50% in the first 20 seconds due to (again) the power of combustion with high mastery.
On Azurethos you're running around spamming Scorch 90% of the time, to avoid shit. The entire fight makeup isn't even the same.

- Azurethos is way more interruptive than Ji'arak is due to the tornadoes and stuff.

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Two different boss, but from the same tier...

Completely irrelevant, they're two different bosses.

It's like saying Wrathion and N'Zoth are the same level of difficulty because they are the same tier.

[Aggrophobic]

I'm quoting you here btw.

Its not good if you forget what you wrote so quickly

Run along, fanboy.

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idk if you know buty this was the exact same with legion to BFA.
its cause as we level that damage becomes weaker, because its based on mob level, so while yes at 50 you do more damage then at 60, if both tried to dps a level 60 mob, the 50 would do FAR less then a 60.

its why people were able to get low level DH's to spam farm freehold with exp turned off.

Nah, it was not as bad but these patches also came with content that made the balance issues less obvious.

Theres no way around the fact that the prepatch and the expansion should have been delayed months ago.
The very late panic-move we got now is a serious issue.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Run along, fanboy.

Calling someone a fanboy is not an argument.

[Scrod]

I remember the WoD prepatch when optimal healing as a priest was just to spam holy nova endlessly... lol good times.

[FelPlague]

Run along, fanboy.

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Nah, it was not as bad but these patches also came with content that made the balance issues less obvious.

Theres no way around the fact that the prepatch and the expansion should have been delayed months ago.
The very late panic-move we got now is a serious issue.

Remember the literally unkillable Imonar?
yeah...
Also "Also came with content that made the balance issues less obvious" what are you talking about?