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  1. #141
    Brewmaster Magical Mudcrab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mardux View Post
    What the people who are blatantly lying when they say its never happened before? Do they get a free pass because you're one of them?

    Or are you legitimately trying to convince people that losing 75% of their stats during the bfa prepatch didn't happen?
    I don't think you quite know what relative means, but that's OK it's the internet and is expected.

    The problem is not the squish or the secondary stat breakpoint changes that have been introduced. The problem is that mob health pools and damage are higher than they were previously in respect to player power. I use schwarzkopf as an example, as he notes that his health has dropped by a factor of 26 times, damage by a factor of 21 times, but mob health has only decreased by a factor of 7 times. This sort of discrepancy has never happened before.

    What you are referring to is the squish which brought about a readjustment of secondary stats to curb the exponential growth in power; however, this did not lead to drastically increased times to kill mobs as balancing was done around players having lower secondary stats. The more notable change was the loss of the Artifact Weapon - which lost its traits but was still incredibly powerful - and Legendaries only became disabled during BfA leveling experience after Azerite is introduced to players to reduce the feeling of loss of power; however, it did not make mobs that were previously trivial to kill within a few seconds take, potentially, minutes depending on how the class/spec.
    Sylvanas didn't even win the popular vote, she was elected by an indirect election of representatives. #NotMyWarchief

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by ablib View Post
    You must be new to WoW, OP. Congrats on your first expansion! Exciting stuff!
    Could you remind me... How many level squishes have their been in all wow expansions? Because, this is my first.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by notJoyful View Post
    Nah mate.

    the squish was promised as:
    "we will lower dps, and hp, etc to lower the numbers, because it "feels better" and is easier to understand, but keep everything as close as possible to current relative numbers because we believe in the mantra that a character should feel stronger at the end of an expansion compared to the start of one".

    Which is entierly amazing, insane numbers by them self is nice sure, but I do agree that it makes it harder to gauge.

    The result was
    "relative to your dps before the pre-patch, you're dps is now hot garbage, outside of current raids, because if we fuck up that we're actually retarded"


    The level 50/60 thing is just not a argument that makes sense, because we have so many systems that adds dps that we wont have in SL, even if they're not point for point the same as the ones in SL.
    shadowland is "balanced for 60 player with system in place" its normal that level 50 without sl systems is bad for some class, some are shit like dh and some op like shadow priest

    we can talk about it for hours if peoples want, its serve no purpose until everyone is 60 and have systems in place for their character, until then, blizzard dont give a damn , i think

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by tomten View Post
    Could you remind me... How many level squishes have their been in all wow expansions? Because, this is my first.
    level squish is unimportant, what is important is number squish which happened already
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  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by tomten View Post
    Could you remind me... How many level squishes have their been in all wow expansions? Because, this is my first.
    Level squish irrelevant. Our dps would be the same whether it said we were 120 or 50. What's being discussed is damage. We've had several stat squishes over the years.
    The most difficult thing for people to do is objectively look at something they don't like and be able to accept that it is not bad, that other people like it, and if it was changed to the way they'd like it that other people would not like it and want it changed back. The second most is to receive something they didn't want or ask for and be grateful for it, not immediately demand what they wanted instead.

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by cparle87 View Post
    Level squish irrelevant. Our dps would be the same whether it said we were 120 or 50. What's being discussed is damage. We've had several stat squishes over the years.
    Quote Originally Posted by VladimirM View Post
    level squish is unimportant, what is important is number squish which happened already
    Then you both have no idea how mob/boss levels works in correlation to numbers /shrug

  7. #147
    Stood in the Fire
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    i noticed a small decrease in power but nothing to the level of what OP claims. i can still destroy anything with my gear 131 equiped.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by tomten View Post
    Then you both have no idea how mob/boss levels works in correlation to numbers /shrug
    A mob could say it was level 50, 60, 120, or 5,000, and that would have no relation to how its health and damage was squished. We've had damage squishes in the past that left levels untouched.
    The most difficult thing for people to do is objectively look at something they don't like and be able to accept that it is not bad, that other people like it, and if it was changed to the way they'd like it that other people would not like it and want it changed back. The second most is to receive something they didn't want or ask for and be grateful for it, not immediately demand what they wanted instead.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by klogaroth View Post
    That isn't the same boss. One of them is a boss intended for 5 people, the other is a boss intended for a raid group. Conveniently the one intended for 5 people was done in the "before prepatch" section and the one intended for a raid was done in the "after prepatch" section. Of course it was faster. It was always faster, it's an easier boss.

    Videos that straight up aim to lie to you aside, there sort of wasn't a stat squish. In fact there was a stat inflation on gear available to a level 50. If our level is brought down to 50, our equipment isn't going to keep the same stat values as it did at level 120, otherwise we would have thousands of % of secondaries. The stats have to be brought down to level 50 appropriate. But if you compare ilvls and the amount of stats on gear, what we have now is actually better than level 50 gear before levels were adjusted. This is due to there being no tiers at 50 before, and 4 tiers (with multiple difficulties) at 50 now.
    You were almost right. Ji'arak is much harder in 9.0 than in 8.3. If you said Ji'arak is intended for 5 people you were wrong. Fortunately Ji'arak is up this week so I was able to do a comparsion with the same world boss in 8.3 and in 9.0, as you wished before to show you how wrong you were with this 5 man statement. Blizz stated in the Blizzcon the following: "It's very important that players feel just as powerful when they log in to play the expansion." - It's simply not true. The characters became much weaker in 9.0, you have to admit it.

    Here is the new video:

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Adi91 View Post
    You were almost right. Ji'arak is much harder in 9.0 than in 8.3. If you said Ji'arak is intended for 5 people you were wrong. Fortunately Ji'arak is up this week so I was able to do a comparsion with the same world boss in 8.3 and in 9.0, as you wished before to show you how wrong you were with this 5 man statement. Blizz stated in the Blizzcon the following: "It's very important that players feel just as powerful when they log in to play the expansion." - It's simply not true. The characters became much weaker in 9.0, you have to admit it.

    Here is the new video:
    "Guys I can't solo shit anymore without my Corruptions and omgwtf"

    You chose Fire mage.. an insanely squishy cannon. You know what you are getting into.

    I just tried that one on my ilevel 90 Enhance Shammy, 0 issues. My ilevel 120 hunter, no issues..

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by 8bithamster View Post
    "Guys I can't solo shit anymore without my Corruptions and omgwtf"

    You chose Fire mage.. an insanely squishy cannon. You know what you are getting into.

    I just tried that one on my ilevel 90 Enhance Shammy, 0 issues. My ilevel 120 hunter, no issues..
    Good for you. But all in all they stated that characters will not lose power. ("IT’S VERY IMPORTANT THAT PLAYERS FEEL JUST AS POWERFUL WHEN THEY LOG IN TO PLAY THE EXPANSION).
    If you can solo a boss before patch, and after the patch you can't do the same isn't count as power loss? In my opinion it is.
    Last edited by Adi91; 2020-10-23 at 12:44 PM.

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Adi91 View Post
    Good for you. But all in all they stated that characters will not lose power. ("IT’S VERY IMPORTANT THAT PLAYERS FEEL JUST AS POWERFUL WHEN THEY LOG IN TO PLAY THE EXPANSION).
    If you can solo a boss before patch, and after the patch you can't do the same isn't count as power loss? In my opinion it is.
    or.. maybe.. it's the usual PEBCAK issue. Problem Exists Between Chair And Keyboard. If you can provide any form of evidence that no fire mage at your gear level at all can solo it, you have a point. Otherwise? Skill issue.

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    thats literaly imposible,even at the peak of its power infinite star was only doing about 40% of your damage,that was the strongest corruption at one point,and it was nerfed...a 100%+ increase would maybe be posible if you had really low gear and got some high ranks of stuff that dont scale from ilvl
    You do realize that if you add something to your damage profile that is doing 50% of your damage.. then that means your overall damage has doubled, right?

  14. #154
    Herald of the Titans MrKnubbles's Avatar
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    I think the problem is that you're trying to compare how well you cleared a much lower level raid at max level before the squish to how well you clear a slightly lower level raid at 10 levels below max level.
    Check out my game, Craftsmith, on the Google Play Store!

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by 8bithamster View Post
    or.. maybe.. it's the usual PEBCAK issue. Problem Exists Between Chair And Keyboard. If you can provide any form of evidence that no fire mage at your gear level at all can solo it, you have a point. Otherwise? Skill issue.
    What are you talking about? The video shows how he in 8.3 killed the boss solo, without even dropping below 75% health. Same boss, same player, same gear after 9.0 went live he cant even get the boss to 50 % health.

    Blizzard stated several times that they did not want the players to lose power in 9.0, obviously we did, by alot!

  16. #156
    Can we save this thread, so we can take it out with the next prepatch again?
    Then we don't have to chew through all of it again and again and again and again

    Who the hell really cares? Progression is over. Is anyone still farming gear? Most guilds are pausing with raiding to get a breath in.

    Does the squish and the loss of (overall hated) power (corruption) feels weird. Maybe. I got used to it allready. Maybe you take longer or are over sensitive.

    In the end you will get used to it and nothing you do from now till SL matters in any way to anyone anyway....

    But again: What do people expect and why do we have to chew through it again?

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by 8bithamster View Post
    or.. maybe.. it's the usual PEBCAK issue. Problem Exists Between Chair And Keyboard. If you can provide any form of evidence that no fire mage at your gear level at all can solo it, you have a point. Otherwise? Skill issue.
    Okay, but if the problem is skill issue, than why I was able to do it in patch, 8.3? Blizzard stated that we will not lose power. In the same gear, with the same character I experiencing a tottaly different scenario. If I've PEBACK issue than why didn't I had in 8.3? If it's my fault than why the fight takes 2,5* longer with 2 man, than in 8.3 with 1 man?

    - - - Updated - - -

    To VinceVega:

    I only expect that Blizzard should be self-righteous. They stated that you should feel as powerful as before when you login after the LVL squish: You can read it here, on MMO Champion

    I was able to kill Ji'arak in 8.3 without any help, without any suffering, just in 2 minutes, so let's say it was my character's power. In patch 9.0 I'm dying after 2 minutes and I only damaged around 30% of it's HP. Is this the same power? Really?

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Uniqed View Post
    What are you talking about? The video shows how he in 8.3 killed the boss solo, without even dropping below 75% health. Same boss, same player, same gear after 9.0 went live he cant even get the boss to 50 % health.

    Blizzard stated several times that they did not want the players to lose power in 9.0, obviously we did, by alot!
    Ofcourse, his corruption was exactly the same post 9.0! Ofcourse, he was the only mage. Secondary stats etc, all exactly the same. Scaling is exactly the same etc etc..

    Hint; we hear this whining every damn expansion, every damn pre patch. We get it, it sucks now. Guess what? You're a levelling character now, not a max level. Deal with it.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by 8bithamster View Post
    Ofcourse, his corruption was exactly the same post 9.0! Ofcourse, he was the only mage. Secondary stats etc, all exactly the same. Scaling is exactly the same etc etc..

    Hint; we hear this whining every damn expansion, every damn pre patch. We get it, it sucks now. Guess what? You're a levelling character now, not a max level. Deal with it.
    Talk about moving the goal posts. You went from that it was a player issue, that we did not lose power and it was his lack of skill that was the problem to "deal with it"?
    Last edited by Uniqed; 2020-10-24 at 02:04 PM.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Uniqed View Post
    Talk about moving the goal posts. You went from that it was a player issue, that we did not lose power and it was his lack of skill that was the problem to "deal with it"?
    oh not moving any goal posts.. it's still probably a player issue. No Corruption to carry him, he realises he actually isn't all that good at the game. Again, unless you can state that every mage has issues with this, there is no evidence it's a scaling issue.

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