The horde council is pathetic.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

I'm not ruining anything. I simply do not roll over to the alliance players like others would. I will fight for repairing the horde until blizzard actually does something about it.

You can do that without calling the website's admins out with baseless accusations.

[Mehrunes]

Make us the mwahahaha eeeeeevil faction and then you're forced to ask why the hell are the numerous neutral groups that gib evil factions for a living tolerating our existence, let alone working with us. Bad enough that groups like the Argent Dawn and Ebon Blade had literally 0 issues with the Forsaken behaving pretty much like the Scourge and even kidnapping their own, or Malfurion/Cenarius who stood with a thumb up their ass while Garrosh/Sylvanas were ravaging their forests. These instances of stupid don't need to be reverberated across the entire game.

You mean the Ebon Blade that was acting like the Scourge as well? The Ebon Blade that compared themselves to the Forsaken and found them to be too soft twice? Who took a detour from fighting the Scourge just to torment Scarlet Crusaders by turning them into mindless ghouls for shits and giggles? Ebon Blade's issue with Arthas was never "Oh noes, he bad." but "Wait, we were just sacrificial pawns just to lure Tirion out? Time for payback.". And speaking of the Argent Crusade, this is the faction they worked the most closely with. Even after Darion effectively called Tirion an idealistic moron and told him he'll be fighting the Scourge with Scourge tactics no matter what.

[Soon-TM]

Oh wow...a few npcs did something you don't like that doesn't even affect you in the least and you're instantly forgiven...must be so hard and painful to be a Horde player!

It still is more, and noticeably so, than what happens when the Alliance does something funky... which is exactly zero. Must be so hard doing all sorts of underhanded BS and getting away with it all the time

[Feanoro]

It still is more, and noticeably so, than what happens when the Alliance does something funky... which is exactly zero. Must be so hard doing all sorts of underhanded BS and getting away with it all the time

Wait, I thought we were boring goody two shoes? I'm sorry, I've never been good at doublethink.

[Soon-TM]

Wait, I thought we were boring goody two shoes? I'm sorry, I've never been good at doublethink.

The Alliance is depicted as goody goody, lawful boring good two shoes, but it actually does quite a bit of... less than honourable stuff. It's just that the narrative never owns to it, so there never are any consequences whatsoever - even less than in the Horde's case.

Unless that we're talking nelfs, that is. They are the sacrificial lamb that keeps the Alliance's collective ass squeaky shiny.

[Ardenaso]

While I don't have an issue with the Horde Council as it currently is, I *would* like to see the developers make up their minds on what they actually want the Horde to be. They can be the Chaotic to the Alliance's Lawful, or the Evil to their Good, but they need to pick a path and stick with it for the long haul. They keep seeming to want to have it both ways - making the Horde honorable and good but less hierarchical and more prone to chaos when it comes to world events but then also have the Horde do patently evil things (e.g. Teldrassil) in the name of fomenting drama in the game's story. This manner of use would be fine if the Horde kept to its evil roots but trying to have their cake, eat their cake, and then trying to sell the playerbase both cakes is unseemly (and impossible).

I just want the WC3 Horde to come back, where Thrall, Cairne, Vol'jin and Rexxar makes the Alliance bend to them and not the other way around; and of course where they would never approve Teldrassil nor Brennadam

Rokhan's fine; he wants Kul Tiran justice
Talanji's fine; same as Rokhan
bring back Nazgrel
give Rommath more spotlight and power
make Tagar the interim leader for Taurens

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also, the Darkspears may snap if Garrosh ever comes back to the Horde

[MikeBogina]

They are alliance biased. Just like the Admins of this forum.

As one said years ago, it's easier to relate to the humans than other races, so the humans get more focus. With the admins on this forum, I think Aucald is actually more of a Horde player/fan, but in the same way that baine is "horde".

It really does show with the devs how much more of a focus the humans have and how more the horde is used as plot tools.

[Grazrug]

As one said years ago, it's easier to relate to the humans than other races, so the humans get more focus. With the admins on this forum, I think Aucald is actually more of a Horde player/fan, but in the same way that baine is "horde".

It really does show with the devs how much more of a focus the humans have and how more the horde is used as plot tools.

Baine isn't horde. He's a traitor and jumps when Anduin and Jaina tells him to. #notmywarchief #notmyhorde #stonespiretriberemembers

[Rendark]

I miss Gallywix. He should be leading the goblins still.

[MikeBogina]

Make us the mwahahaha eeeeeevil faction and then you're forced to ask why the hell are the numerous neutral groups that gib evil factions for a living tolerating our existence, let alone working with us. Bad enough that groups like the Argent Dawn and Ebon Blade had literally 0 issues with the Forsaken behaving pretty much like the Scourge and even kidnapping their own, or Malfurion/Cenarius who stood with a thumb up their ass while Garrosh/Sylvanas were ravaging their forests. These instances of stupid don't need to be reverberated across the entire game.

The Horde's identity crisis is entirely of Blizzard's own making by the way. Most people didn't mind what it was during Vanilla to Wrath, then they listened to the "muh War in Warcraft" types to artificially drive the conflict and its stakes into the stratosphere and we got stuck with the shitty edgelord Warchief merry go round ever since. Why would a rational person think they'd get it right the third time?

I hated it 2 years ago, when we were being basically told that this is the horde, we're the more evil faction and to just embrace it... then all throughout BFA, we're about honor.

I mean we see it coming and Blizzard wanting to think they're clever writers told us that Garrosh is gonna have changes... turns out no, and Blizzard thinks they got us. Then it happens again with Sylvanas and Blizzard is basically like "Wait and see" ohhh she's evil, GOT YA! To play as a Horde player and see blizzard use my faction as a rollercoaster kinda sucks, it's one of the main reasons I've only been subbed for a total of 2 months this expansion.

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Baine isn't horde. He's a traitor and jumps when Anduin and Jaina tells him to. #notmywarchief #notmyhorde #stonespiretriberemembers

lol well yeah, Baine cares more for the Alliance than Horde. He's killed more Horde than he has allianced and he's gone behind 2 warchief's backs to help Jaina, after Jaina has harmed the Horde, but he's still a Horde character
I just mean that I feel he is like a loyal Blizzard fan who enjoys whatever the story is, while most of us Horde players hate the story we've been given.

[Jastall]

I hated it 2 years ago, when we were being basically told that this is the horde, we're the more evil faction and to just embrace it... then all throughout BFA, we're about honor.

I mean we see it coming and Blizzard wanting to think they're clever writers told us that Garrosh is gonna have changes... turns out no, and Blizzard thinks they got us. Then it happens again with Sylvanas and Blizzard is basically like "Wait and see" ohhh she's evil, GOT YA! To play as a Horde player and see blizzard use my faction as a rollercoaster kinda sucks, it's one of the main reasons I've only been subbed for a total of 2 months this expansion.

- - - Updated - - -



lol well yeah, Baine cares more for the Alliance than Horde. He's killed more Horde than he has allianced and he's gone behind 2 warchief's backs to help Jaina, after Jaina has harmed the Horde, but he's still a Horde character
I just mean that I feel he is like a loyal Blizzard fan who enjoys whatever the story is, while most of us Horde players hate the story we've been given.

Sylvanas being Warchief was the first warning sign. I disliked it even then and thought some evil Horde plot was inevitable when our boss was now the lady who is a villain in all but name, shielded only by her belonging to a playable faction for now. They could have changed her, I suppose, but does anyone really see friggin Sylvanas starting to care about whatever variation of honor is important that day, and empathizing with Orcs in smelly mud huts and Trolls? Would make about as much sense as turning Velen into a serial killer.

Baine should have been shoved into neutrality ages ago. Develop another, more assertive Tauren character to take his place (not, not Magatha before anyone says so) and have him leave the Horde so he can be a middleman between the factions, the only role that actually suits his background and personality.

[Powerogue]

Our current cast of leading characters is truly pathetic. They are underdeveloped, underused, underpowered and lack any sorts of investment that could draw a horde player emotionally to them. To fix these issues it is needed that the horde council gets replaced with characters that could actually stand off against the big alliance super heroes.

Orcs - kill Thrall. Bring back AU Grommash
Trolls - Rastakhan and Jindo the Breaker
Tauren - Sark Ragetotem
Blood elves - kael’thas Sunstrider
Nightborne - Grand magistrix Elisande
Undead - sylvanas can come back.

Then the horde would be fixed.

orcs - a dead guy.
trolls - two dead guys.
tauren - a random warrior trainer I had to google despite reading WoWpedia for fun https://wow.gamepedia.com/Sark_Ragetotem
blood elves - a dead guy.
nightborne - hey, a changeup, a dead woman.
undead - a soon to be un-un-un-un-dead woman who stabbed her loyalists in the back and released an old god plotting to have it destroy both factions, then headed north and released the Scourge. Yeah, she seems like great leadership material. Well I didn't vote for her.

Not a great lineup.

But on topic, how do we improve what we have?


First thought: Unlikely buddy adventure with Geya'rah's gruff edginess and Ji Firepaw's lovable upbeat attitude that has them both grow as people and appreciate what they both bring to the table that is The Horde. I'm telling ya, that is prime short story material.

Next up, hrmm, Lilian and Thrall. Both characters with checkered pasts hoping to make the best of a new start. Another oddball mixup meant to bring to light how the forsaken will learn to forge a path away from their devotion to their leader as Thrall learns to step down from leadership and let himself follow. That could be fun.

Let's see, who else could really use it, ah Mayla Highmountain and Baine. Schisms amidst the tauren, ignited by tauren in the Barrens who continue open hostilities towards the Alliance and condemn Baine, with Mayla contributing her experience of dealing with the schisms we saw in Highmountain. Some players still hold his actions in Cataclysm against him all these years later and I think it's high time to confront them head-on.

I've got one more for you, Gazlowe and The Player. Gallywix is central to the goblin player's story arc, and while the heritage armor was legendary, I think the way to endear us to Gazlowe, who we only know as a minor questgiver and, if you played WC3, the architect of Orgrimmar, he should help us kill Gallywix. Finally confronting him in an epic adventure in the depths of the rebuilt Kezan and Undermine. Gallywix let me ride his giant death machine to fight the gnome leader, buddy, you'd better cough up the special effects budget to top that if you want to win me over!

[VladlTutushkin]

I mean, it looks like you didn't realise how Sad™ Saurfang was. Or how sorrowful Thrall was when he pretty much bent his knee in front of Tyrande. Or how cringeworthy was Sylvanas from beginning to end (in BfA). Or how Horde players will get to see Tyrande waving an admonitory finger to them in Ardenweald. Yeah, everyone has forgiven us, from both Watsonian and Doylist PoV's LMAO. What do you want? The dismantling of the Horde? Sorry my boi, not gonna happen.

Well, maybe some offhand comment how horde pissed off from Ashenvale and payed up for genocide with reparations and so “rational” part of the Alliance really moved on too. No need to show it even. Just tell for gods sake. Or maybe write how sylvanas loyalists organised a coup and got all wiped out for good. Or if thats not an option the make Alliance commit something equal to Teld and then get away with it just for the sake of parity.

[Dazmalak]

Given how fucked all the lore is anyway, let's just go back in time again so I can be a part of Orgrim Doomhammer's Horde alongside legends like Zul'jin, Cho'gall, and Teron Gorefiend. Bonus points if we get Hellscream back with his WC2 voice. Let us be properly evil and wage war against the Alliance as it was meant to be.

[VladlTutushkin]

Given how fucked all the lore is anyway, let's just go back in time again so I can be a part of Orgrim Doomhammer's Horde alongside legends like Zul'jin, Cho'gall, and Teron Gorefiend. Bonus points if we get Hellscream back with his WC2 voice. Let us be properly evil and wage war against the Alliance as it was meant to be.

Its all good and well but then you lose your “always forgiven” card and might actually feel a metal boot coming down your ass like horde did in Warcraft 2.

[Queen of Hamsters]

Oh look, another thread for suffering Alliance players to lament their struggles whilst a person taking the game too seriously but on the other side asks for more idiocy from the writers.

I will take meek leaders if it means no more edgelord crapfests where the Horde is made the villain. Next time they can use the Alliance for that, let us see the mental gymnastics that would unfold.

[jellmoo]

My question: How do you propose to change the racial leader of each group? Does literally every Horde race have a sudden and unexpected coup? Everyone gets ousted at once and suddenly the evil league of evil is in charge?

The problem we have is that the Horde as a concept doesn't make a ton of sense. The idea of a Warchief leading all these races is silly the way they've been doing it. So far, it's just been "Oh, that's the Warchief? We better do what that person says. Not sure why..."

Let's simplify the whole thing. Pick a race. Don't care which one. Now, within that race pick an incredibly intelligent, ambitious, militaristic lore character. That person takes control of that race, then uses that race to essentially take over the rest of the Horde through force. This person isn't a "Muhahaha cartoon villain", this person is a calculating opportunist. Not a warmonger, but more than happy to have bloody hands. Wants the Horde to succeed, but has a very strict vision for what success is. The rest of the Horde may not like it, but they can't argue with the results.

That's the Warchief. Better yet, give the character a new title. Emperor or something.

Making the Horde into Alliance 2.0 is bland and we all know it. But at the same time, bloodthirsty cartoon super villains that take control for a while and do bad stuff and the Horde getting redeemed afterwards has been done too many times. Let the Horde be a militaristic society that has goals and plans and uses violence as a tool, not as a plaything of a petulant child.

[Maljinwo]

Fix horde
stronk evil leader
me smart

The Horde can't be evil because it keeps losing wars as the evil faction will never win in an MMO

Oh wait. It's a Grazrug post

lol

[tommyhil622]

Not sure what that list was by the OP but, the main thing I would like to see is some stability in the horde leadership. Every expac since Thrall left his post, has the Warcheif either getting killed or turning batshit insane. Also how long will Silvermoon maintain a regent?

I don't mind them returning to their old ways or the council, just stick with it for the long haul and bring some stability w/e form that takes.

[Stelio Kontos]

Some of these Horde posters are almost memes at this point.