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  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    And if you are a decent player, you don't need to buy gear! The system works!

    - - - Updated - - -



    Woooosh - that's the conversation flying over your head. Read the OP. They want to make it "illegal" to discuss mtx if you have ever used them. You are wrong, but, thanks to freedom of speech, you are entitled to either admit you are wrong and apologize for misunderstanding the context of the discussion, or just double down and refuse to admit your mistake.
    Uh, a game developer can make it "illegal" to say whatever they want in their game. Illegal does not have to mean its against the "law". This is why games like football have "illegal motions" that are penalities.

    the term "illegal" has two parts to its definition. The first is what you're referring to, something being against law. The second part of the definition is this:

    Definition of illegal (Entry 1 of 2) (Merriam-Webster dictionary)
    : not according to or authorized by law : UNLAWFUL, ILLICIT
    also : not sanctioned by official rules (as of a game)

    And here is the definition from Dictionary.com:
    adjective
    forbidden by law or statute.
    contrary to or forbidden by official rules, regulations, etc.:
    The referee ruled that it was an illegal forward pass.


    Wow, they even used the near same example as me.

    So actually, you are in fact wrong, and now you've made yourself look like an idiot, as well.
    Last edited by Alcsaar; 2020-10-27 at 03:35 AM.

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Alcsaar View Post
    Uh, a game developer can make it "illegal" to say whatever they want in their game. Illegal does not have to mean its against the "law". This is why games like football have "illegal motions" that are penalities.

    the term "illegal" has two parts to its definition. The first is what you're referring to, something being against law. The second part of the definition is this:

    Definition of illegal (Entry 1 of 2) (Merriam-Webster dictionary)
    : not according to or authorized by law : UNLAWFUL, ILLICIT
    also : not sanctioned by official rules (as of a game)

    And here is the definition from Dictionary.com:
    adjective
    forbidden by law or statute.
    contrary to or forbidden by official rules, regulations, etc.:
    The referee ruled that it was an illegal forward pass.


    Wow, they even used the near same example as me.

    So actually, you are in fact wrong, and now you've made yourself look like an idiot, as well.
    I think you are getting confused. An illegal move in a game is something that can't happen. Try making an illegal move in a chess game on a computer. You can't. Comparing RL illegal moves with gaming is completely.missi g the point. What you are getting confused with is cheating.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nizah View Post
    why so mad bro

  3. #123
    A lot of people in the world hold very strong, completely irrational and baseless opinions, often on very serious real life matters. It's not surprising there's a sect of "anti mtx" players in WoW, too.

    When it comes to wow, this is a far bigger issue clearly because of who the players are. Many are oldtimers who are incapable of catching up with modern reality. If you look at other games, cosmetic MTX is almost unanimously accepted and doesn't bother almost anyone.

    It helps to realize that these people crying online about a mount or a transmog set are in the extreme minority. Same as with most controversies in WoW. At large, people either buy the cosmetics or not, and carry on with their lives. It's okay to browse the forums from time to time and look at the drama threads, that can be fun, but don't get too invested in it cause it will just annoy the hell out of you in the end. Whenever a new cash shop item hits the game and drama ensues, I like to go to a populated place in the game and just see people enjoying that new piece of content. I can recommend that to everyone - really shows you the difference between forum reality and reality

    And yeah, obviously have to agree with OP that people who buy tokens and at the same time shit on the system are pretty silly, but again, what can you do.

  4. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by Azerate View Post
    A lot of people in the world hold very strong, completely irrational and baseless opinions, often on very serious real life matters. It's not surprising there's a sect of "anti mtx" players in WoW, too.

    When it comes to wow, this is a far bigger issue clearly because of who the players are. Many are oldtimers who are incapable of catching up with modern reality. If you look at other games, cosmetic MTX is almost unanimously accepted and doesn't bother almost anyone.

    It helps to realize that these people crying online about a mount or a transmog set are in the extreme minority. Same as with most controversies in WoW. At large, people either buy the cosmetics or not, and carry on with their lives. It's okay to browse the forums from time to time and look at the drama threads, that can be fun, but don't get too invested in it cause it will just annoy the hell out of you in the end. Whenever a new cash shop item hits the game and drama ensues, I like to go to a populated place in the game and just see people enjoying that new piece of content. I can recommend that to everyone - really shows you the difference between forum reality and reality

    And yeah, obviously have to agree with OP that people who buy tokens and at the same time shit on the system are pretty silly, but again, what can you do.
    Old timers, lol.
    MTX is accepted in F2P games (lol, aion, overwatch, fortnite, apex..) and so on not the buy + pay sub games

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    Old timers, lol.
    MTX is accepted in F2P games (lol, aion, overwatch, fortnite, apex..) and so on not the buy + pay sub games
    Additional purchases are widely accepted in any game these days by the majority of players, as long as they are cosmetic/visual, like the ones in WoW.

  6. #126
    Don't agree, +10 characters
    My Collection
    - Bring back my damn zoom distance/MoP Portals - I read OP minimum, 1st page maximum-make wow alt friendly again -Please post constructively(topkek) -Kill myself

  7. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Azerate View Post
    Additional purchases are widely accepted in any game these days by the majority of players, as long as they are cosmetic/visual, like the ones in WoW.
    No. It is just free to play game marketing seeping in the Pay for Game + Pay for Sub game market.
    It is accepted in buy to play games in many cases or free to play games, for most cases and that is absolutely ok if the game needs continuous support to run the servers or push the updates out.
    BUT this should be not overflowing into buy+pay to play games and that being accepted is just BS. We are literally paying to get the base game and then continue to pay monthly price for the servers and whatnot. They started with mounts, which is bad but now they went into cosmetics so either it has to be buy to play and no sub cost or it should not go any deeper into the MTX shit. Riot has this right, Blizzard is trying to eat the cake and keep it at the same time.

  8. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by pepine View Post
    Pay employees? You mean the 1100 they laid off in the past year and a half when they're already making record profits.....

    Yeah no. Even with those 1100 they wouldn't be hurting for money because MTXs for WoW are coming out more than ever. It's literally because Activision and the higher ups are beyond greedy.
    Hurting for money? Lol, are people actually this naive? Who in the world thinks companies beyond the smallest kinds do anything because they -need- money?

    Fact of the matter is that the more profit a product yields, the more interest it'll receive from owners and investors. The less profit WoW creates the less resources will be put towards its development. There is no hard cap.

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    No. It is just free to play game marketing seeping in the Pay for Game + Pay for Sub game market.
    It is accepted in buy to play games in many cases or free to play games, for most cases and that is absolutely ok if the game needs continuous support to run the servers or push the updates out.
    BUT this should be not overflowing into buy+pay to play games and that being accepted is just BS. We are literally paying to get the base game and then continue to pay monthly price for the servers and whatnot. They started with mounts, which is bad but now they went into cosmetics so either it has to be buy to play and no sub cost or it should not go any deeper into the MTX shit. Riot has this right, Blizzard is trying to eat the cake and keep it at the same time.
    You simply represent the vocal minority.

    While it could be argued that WoW is another level entirely than just a paid game, because it's both paid upfront and then you pay a sub, in games that just have a box price most players don't mind cosmetic mtx.

  10. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by Azerate View Post
    You simply represent the vocal minority.

    While it could be argued that WoW is another level entirely than just a paid game, because it's both paid upfront and then you pay a sub, in games that just have a box price most players don't mind cosmetic mtx.
    Well, the vocal minority is quite big then. We are a silent majority tho and people who defend it in buy+p2p game is a vocal minority

  11. #131
    What do tokens have to do with Blizzard selling cosmetic items in the store? I actually struggle to even discern what the complaint or problem is. In fact it seems to be trying to find a problem or thing to complain about where there isn't one. The items in the store are cosmetic, if you want to buy them with cash, go for it. If Blizzard wants to give you a free cosmetic item for agreeing to sub for 6 months, how is that something to complain about? And tokens have been in the game for years (and gold selling since day 1 of wow prior to that), so I'm not sure what the issue is there either. You can even grind out a ton of gold in-game, sell the token, and buy a cosmetic item in the store if you want without spending any money.

    Blizzard has also gone far out of their way compared to most companies to make sure wow isn't pay to win or selling stat items for cash, as much as possible. Can you technically buy a token, buy gear in the AH, and join a pvp or pve group, sure. A person could do the same in 2005 in wow by buying gold from a seller. Except if you buy gear above your skill level it's not the p2w you think, because the gear being far above the player's skill level will quickly be realized by the other group members and you'll get the boot along with a good and deserved mocking.

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azerate View Post
    You simply represent the vocal minority.

    While it could be argued that WoW is another level entirely than just a paid game, because it's both paid upfront and then you pay a sub, in games that just have a box price most players don't mind cosmetic mtx.
    I would think it's probably the majority of WoW players who are anti-microtransaction. I vaguely remember, at the time, that support for the store was relatively sparse, and that the few who defended it believed that the store would be very limited in scope, and it has since expanded. Nowadays, the reason you don't see many threads complaining about it are likely because it has been in the game for so long that there's not really a point in arguing about WoW microtransactions at all. Keep in mind that the store was added nearly 10 years ago, so anyone who would disagree with it at this point are likely in a state of begrudged acceptance.
    Sylvanas didn't even win the popular vote, she was elected by an indirect election of representatives. #NotMyWarchief

  13. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by Knight Meta View Post
    If you buy and / or use WoW tokens for Game time and / or Blizzard Balance - You should legally not* be allowed to whine over the in-game store existing / having items added too it. You are just fueling the system you supposedly "Hate" - You can't have your cake and eat it too.

    (* Because there is an absurd amount of people in this thread alone that is non-trollingly trying to make me seem like the fool for thinking there should be a law about this; I Just had to add this segment to tell you - It is a figure of speech ya dummy)

    Also: While on that topic - What is even the fuss about the game store about? I am a Mount Collector and I'm hardly fazed by there being mounts at the store. Comparing the WoW game store to so many other MMORPGS out there makes the WoW one seem like a kindergarden project; it's harmless. There is NO pay to win elements as no mount, transmog or battle pet will give you an in-game advantage. (Yeah I know Lil'Rags is a decent battle pet but he is nowhere near the best, nor does he break the system)

    In addition to that; All of the items on the game store is TOTALLY obtainable via in-game activities. You get your gold, you turn it into a token and you convert that to currency. Like how is this missing people's head?

    Seeing folks shout "70 DOLLARS / EUROS FOR A MOUNT / TRANSMOG?!" Is also just absurd, it's 70 $ / € for SIX MONTHS OF GAME TIME IN ADDITION TO (Insert whatever Blizz will include with the 6 month sub in the future)

    But yeah, if you add fuel to the system you hate - Then screw you, your argument is invalid. If you use tokens; you should not whine in any way over whatever the heck Blizz adds to the game store (As long as it remains purely cosmetic and nothing stupid like "Pay not for a full set of the most recent raid gear" is added)

    Yet while on that note. Ya'll know WoW can be played for free now after purchase yeah? Thanks to those tokens? Surely a lot of people is doing that. And Blizzard despite being under Activision's wing (Activision which clearly wants WoW to die so they can have the people working on it focus on things like Hearthstone and Overwatch where there is still money being made for some reason) They still got employees to pay, despite that they seem to go in + on the quarterly earnings calls we see: A lot of people seem to think that a in-game store is only justified if your company is going in minus or is barely breaking even. Are you folks just that ignorant? I guess there is a reason you are sitting here complaining about Brightwing being flayed for a transmog as opposed to taking it for what it is and rather unsubbing or moving on with your life.

    Thanks. I'll see some of you in court since surely someone got offended to the point of feeling like I personally attacked them while standing firm on that if you buy and / or use WoW Tokens to any degree; You should shut the heck up about anything in-game store related.
    people in general are crybaby whiners.....at chance of getting them to shut up lol

  14. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    Old timers, lol.
    MTX is accepted in F2P games (lol, aion, overwatch, fortnite, apex..) and so on not the buy + pay sub games
    Ff14 has a sub, mounts, outfits, and even job boosts in their shop and you can't use in game gold to buy those. You can even pay to skip story quests.

    I'm sure there are more but that example alone breaks this echo chamber up.

  15. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by Knight Meta View Post
    If you buy and / or use WoW tokens for Game time and / or Blizzard Balance - You should legally not* be allowed to whine over the in-game store existing / having items added too it. You are just fueling the system you supposedly "Hate" - You can't have your cake and eat it too.

    (* Because there is an absurd amount of people in this thread alone that is non-trollingly trying to make me seem like the fool for thinking there should be a law about this; I Just had to add this segment to tell you - It is a figure of speech ya dummy)

    Also: While on that topic - What is even the fuss about the game store about? I am a Mount Collector and I'm hardly fazed by there being mounts at the store. Comparing the WoW game store to so many other MMORPGS out there makes the WoW one seem like a kindergarden project; it's harmless. There is NO pay to win elements as no mount, transmog or battle pet will give you an in-game advantage. (Yeah I know Lil'Rags is a decent battle pet but he is nowhere near the best, nor does he break the system)

    In addition to that; All of the items on the game store is TOTALLY obtainable via in-game activities. You get your gold, you turn it into a token and you convert that to currency. Like how is this missing people's head?

    Seeing folks shout "70 DOLLARS / EUROS FOR A MOUNT / TRANSMOG?!" Is also just absurd, it's 70 $ / € for SIX MONTHS OF GAME TIME IN ADDITION TO (Insert whatever Blizz will include with the 6 month sub in the future)

    But yeah, if you add fuel to the system you hate - Then screw you, your argument is invalid. If you use tokens; you should not whine in any way over whatever the heck Blizz adds to the game store (As long as it remains purely cosmetic and nothing stupid like "Pay not for a full set of the most recent raid gear" is added)

    Yet while on that note. Ya'll know WoW can be played for free now after purchase yeah? Thanks to those tokens? Surely a lot of people is doing that. And Blizzard despite being under Activision's wing (Activision which clearly wants WoW to die so they can have the people working on it focus on things like Hearthstone and Overwatch where there is still money being made for some reason) They still got employees to pay, despite that they seem to go in + on the quarterly earnings calls we see: A lot of people seem to think that a in-game store is only justified if your company is going in minus or is barely breaking even. Are you folks just that ignorant? I guess there is a reason you are sitting here complaining about Brightwing being flayed for a transmog as opposed to taking it for what it is and rather unsubbing or moving on with your life.

    Thanks. I'll see some of you in court since surely someone got offended to the point of feeling like I personally attacked them while standing firm on that if you buy and / or use WoW Tokens to any degree; You should shut the heck up about anything in-game store related.
    I couldn't agree more. People complain about how WoW has a cosmetic microtransaction market is ridiculous. I think they should do more cosmetic transmog sets. Literally the ONLY thing you can dislike about this market is it pulls a small number of employees away from making the game better.

    I would disagree with the OP with his signature: Wrath = TBC (most feel the same) > Legion (balanced without game breaking content such as Corruption) > WoD (bad story, but playing Alliance we won 80% of the battlegrounds) > MoP (similar to Legion but just did not enjoy the extreme Chinese theme everywhere) > Vanilla (the nostalgia) > Cata = BFA (Cata had hilarious Thorns which could kill a Rogue before it ended and it was almost always active, BFA would be better if it wasn't for the Corruption imbalance).

  16. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by Knight Meta View Post
    If you buy and / or use WoW tokens for Game time and / or Blizzard Balance - You should legally not* be allowed to whine over the in-game store existing / having items added too it. You are just fueling the system you supposedly "Hate" - You can't have your cake and eat it too.

    (* Because there is an absurd amount of people in this thread alone that is non-trollingly trying to make me seem like the fool for thinking there should be a law about this; I Just had to add this segment to tell you - It is a figure of speech ya dummy)

    Also: While on that topic - What is even the fuss about the game store about? I am a Mount Collector and I'm hardly fazed by there being mounts at the store. Comparing the WoW game store to so many other MMORPGS out there makes the WoW one seem like a kindergarden project; it's harmless. There is NO pay to win elements as no mount, transmog or battle pet will give you an in-game advantage. (Yeah I know Lil'Rags is a decent battle pet but he is nowhere near the best, nor does he break the system)

    In addition to that; All of the items on the game store is TOTALLY obtainable via in-game activities. You get your gold, you turn it into a token and you convert that to currency. Like how is this missing people's head?

    Seeing folks shout "70 DOLLARS / EUROS FOR A MOUNT / TRANSMOG?!" Is also just absurd, it's 70 $ / € for SIX MONTHS OF GAME TIME IN ADDITION TO (Insert whatever Blizz will include with the 6 month sub in the future)

    But yeah, if you add fuel to the system you hate - Then screw you, your argument is invalid. If you use tokens; you should not whine in any way over whatever the heck Blizz adds to the game store (As long as it remains purely cosmetic and nothing stupid like "Pay not for a full set of the most recent raid gear" is added)

    Yet while on that note. Ya'll know WoW can be played for free now after purchase yeah? Thanks to those tokens? Surely a lot of people is doing that. And Blizzard despite being under Activision's wing (Activision which clearly wants WoW to die so they can have the people working on it focus on things like Hearthstone and Overwatch where there is still money being made for some reason) They still got employees to pay, despite that they seem to go in + on the quarterly earnings calls we see: A lot of people seem to think that a in-game store is only justified if your company is going in minus or is barely breaking even. Are you folks just that ignorant? I guess there is a reason you are sitting here complaining about Brightwing being flayed for a transmog as opposed to taking it for what it is and rather unsubbing or moving on with your life.

    Thanks. I'll see some of you in court since surely someone got offended to the point of feeling like I personally attacked them while standing firm on that if you buy and / or use WoW Tokens to any degree; You should shut the heck up about anything in-game store related.
    Whether I use a token or pay out of pocket, the ability to play the game is still being paid for. I pay for the expansion. I have paid for the right to access this game and features. I shouldn't have to pay for anything else in the game. There should be ways to get all of the mounts and pets in-game. If they want to have a paid store, then they shouldn't charge a sub fee or for expansions.

  17. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Azerate View Post
    You simply represent the vocal minority.

    While it could be argued that WoW is another level entirely than just a paid game, because it's both paid upfront and then you pay a sub, in games that just have a box price most players don't mind cosmetic mtx.
    It sounds like you’re confusing apathy with acceptance. While I personally might not care about the WoW cash shop, that doesn’t mean that I can’t see the issues with this MTX model. Paying for a game three times (once up from, a second time just for access to what you already paid for, and a third time for additional cosmetics) shouldn’t sit well with any players.

    “Whales” dumping $100s in MTX are doing one of two things: funneling extra money into the pockets of executives (not to the benefit of the average player) or keeping the game afloat amid waning interest (not a good sign for the health of the game).

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Knight Meta View Post
    If you buy and / or use WoW tokens for Game time and / or Blizzard Balance - You should legally not* be allowed to whine over the in-game store existing / having items added too it. You are just fueling the system you supposedly "Hate" - You can't have your cake and eat it too.
    No. No, I cannot agree to this, and I imagine no one would. Imagine suing someone because they complained about the Blizzard in-game store after buying something off it.

    Also: I am allowed to complain about a bad service being offered, regardless if I partake on it or not.
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